Shadow Box

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walknonsunshine

CGF II, Certified Grumble Framer Level 2
Joined
Aug 16, 2012
Posts
229
Ok...I gotta be honest here....I'm terrified of asking a question and have someone think "what the heck is she going framing, she should give it up already". I'm 6 months into this and while I love framing I still wonder if my hubby and I made the right decision....

Anyway, I got my first shadow box project yesterday. The shadow box frame is LJ119630. My frame size will be 13 1/4 x 17 1/4.

I will be mounting a pair of knitted ladies booties on to a matboard (no clue how I'm going to do that yet, so any help there would be appreciated.) and then a photo underneath.

I'm a very visual person and for the life of me I can't wrap my mind how this whole project is going to come together. Is there a step-by-step guide on how to do shadow boxes?

Oh - and how do I know if my frame is deep enough? Is this a personal preference on the customer's part?

How I wish I could go out to the frame expo in Vegas. I'm terrified to travel by myself for starters.

Thanks in advance for your help.

Sue
 
Call Pat at Attach EZ and she will walk you through the whole thing. Pat sells a tagging gun/kit with DVD's so you will have no problems. You can look her up under the members list as Pat Kotnour.
 
walknonsunshine said:
Ok...I gotta be honest here....I'm terrified of asking a question and have someone think "what the heck is she going framing, she should give it up already". I'm 6 months into this and while I love framing I still wonder if my hubby and I made the right decision....

Anyway, I got my first shadow box project yesterday. The shadow box frame is LJ119630. My frame size will be 13 1/4 x 17 1/4.

I will be mounting a pair of knitted ladies booties on to a matboard (no clue how I'm going to do that yet, so any help there would be appreciated.) and then a photo underneath.
Click to expand...
Depending on age, condition, material, and value I would either stitch them down (couching) or use a nylon tagging gun.

walknonsunshine said:
I'm a very visual person and for the life of me I can't wrap my mind how this whole project is going to come together. Is there a step-by-step guide on how to do shadow boxes?
Click to expand...
Get a copy of Jim Miller’s The Complete Guide to Shadowboxes and Framing Objects. It’s very thorough and richly illustrated. While you’re at it, get a copy of PPFA Guidelines for Framing Textiles and Needlework.

walknonsunshine said:
Oh - and how do I know if my frame is deep enough? Is this a personal preference on the customer's part?
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The frame should be deep enough to allow at least 1/8” clearance between the glazing and the highest point of the object or objects. If you relied on the customer’s preference you’d be stuck trying to cram the booties into the tiniest frame on the wall.

walknonsunshine said:
How I wish I could go out to the frame expo in Vegas. I'm terrified to travel by myself for starters.
Click to expand...
It’s worth every penny. Starting today, tack on $2 to every order and put that money in a jar marked Vegas. That’s your seed money to go next January.
Where are you located? There’s a chance that another Grumbler would be leaving from your area and you could catch the same flight, maybe share a room.
 
The down and dirty of a shadow box is pretty simple.

You will have your item attached to a backing (most likely a matboard) and a backing behind that (possibly foamboard)

The frame is cut and joined. The glazing (glass or plexi) is cut and placed into the empty frame.

You cut materials to line the walls of the shadowbox. This is done for both decorative and functional reasons. The function is to hold the glass in place so you can have a spaced enclosure and the decorative aspects is because you will see the side walls so you want to use something pleasing to the eye.

If the frame is deep enough to hold the item or items without pressing them up against the glazing you will have an easier time. Cut the sidewall materials, (I've used a strip of foamboard with a strip of matboard attached) leave it about 3/16 short of the back edge of the frame.

Try a dry fit to see if everything lines up and looks good. It's easier to make changes now before you staple everything together. If you're happy with the look, place the shadow boxed objects, that are attached to the mat and foam backing, into the opening. The recessed walls you have lined the frame with will hold the package in place and you can staple the finished package in place.

That recessed area also keeps the package from protruding out from the back.
 
Can you post a photo of the booties and provide a more complete description? That would enable us to make useful suggestions for the attachment.

For the appearance, I might suggest attaching the booties to a fabric or suede mat background, and mounting the photo above them, elevated on an undersized plateau of mat board or foam board layers. You could also place the booties next to the photo or above the photo, but be careful about putting the photo in the shadow of the booties, which of course depends on the angle of illumination.

UV-filtering, optically coated glass (Museum Glass) would be my preference, or Museum Optium Acrylic if size,weight, or shatter-resistance are issues. (Tru Vue sponsors some of my classes and I am a consultant.) My guess is that this project will require at least two inches of depth, maybe three or four. Right? That size would be well within the practical range for a Museum Glass shadowbox, which would enable you to use any standard-rabbet moulding, and it would provide plenty of light in the frame and the best overall view of the booties.
 
photos

photo 2.jpgphoto 3.jpg

Hopefully this works.

The strip where is says "photo" is going to be what the photo will look like. It more of a panoramic.
The depth of the frame is 2 7/8 inches.

I called Pat and ordered the basic start up kit.
 
Hiya Sunshine!!

I think this is going to look great!!!!
Have you thought about stuffing the booties to make them look fuller?!
 
I just looked up the frame profile - appears you have a lot of room in there so Nic's idea of adding a bit of stuffing would work.

Have fun with the job - whilst shadowboxes can be the most frustrating of framing jobs, they can also be the most FUN!!!
 
blackiris said:
Hiya Sunshine!!

I think this is going to look great!!!!
Have you thought about stuffing the booties to make them look fuller?!
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No, what is an OK product to use? Kleenex is the first thing that comes to my mind but I don't know how it would hold up
over time.

You guys/gals are so great, I honestly don't know what I would do without you!
 
As for stuffing, go to a craft store, or a fabric store and get PolyFil. It is for making quilts. It comes in sheets, or fluff. I'd get the fluff for stuffing something. Easy to work with, and won't degrade.
 
I always use poly fil batting I buy at Wal Mart. It's inexpensive and easy to use, and you should have enough for many, many projects. I think Nicole's the Queen of Shadow Boxes. She's done a million of them and every one looks like a masterpiece! Of course, keep in mind she's my "Baby Girl" who also has a "baby girl" The first shadow box is very, very stressful, but, when it's done you will be quite proud of yourself! And I'm sure with good cause. As for the WCAF, it is absolutely worth much more than the cost of attending. Randy J
 
As you found out when I spoke with you yesterday, I've had Pseumonia since Christmas and am very sorry it took me so long to wiegh in. You were given some good advice here and don't be afraid of asking questions. The only dumb question is the one not asked. You will find out that Shadowbox's are not that hard to do. Your first one will be the one you will always remember, but in time you will learn to love doing them. If I can be of anymore help to you, don't hesitate to call again. I'm almost always the one who answers the phone and ususally can give you some pretty easy ways of mounting shadowbox art. Good luck to you in your new business. BTW: You didn't make a mistake.
 
Good luck Kid!! Post pics when you're done!!!!

Pat a wealth of knowledge and will graciously take the time to answer any questions!!

As for the "stuffing"....... just make sure you get a bit of it when you tack down your booties.... otherwise..... you will have saggy booties....... <so did not sound right but I hope you get the idea!!!> :)
 
Pat Kotnour said:
As you found out when I spoke with you yesterday, I've had Pseumonia since Christmas and am very sorry it took me so long to wiegh in. You were given some good advice here and don't be afraid of asking questions. The only dumb question is the one not asked. You will find out that Shadowbox's are not that hard to do. Your first one will be the one you will always remember, but in time you will learn to love doing them. If I can be of anymore help to you, don't hesitate to call again. I'm almost always the one who answers the phone and ususally can give you some pretty easy ways of mounting shadowbox art. Good luck to you in your new business. BTW: You didn't make a mistake.
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Pat, you were so gracious and patient yesterday with my questions. Thanks a bunch!
 
Ok, one more thing....

if you look at the photo on the right of the booties. In the center of the right bootie (in that photo) you'll see from the black part
ascending upward is where a stitch has come out. I'm not sure if I should try to sew it?

I'm now just realizing that I may not be able to stuff them for fear that it will continue to come undone.

I don't see a thread there for me to grab and somehow run it back through.

I know nothing about knitting or crocheting......
 
Artrageous said:
Everytime I see the OP make a post, this runs through my head.

Maybe if I post it it'll get the heck out of my head.

[video=youtube;iPUmE-tne5U]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iPUmE-tne5U[/video]
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Mark ~~~ that is exactly why I chose the name!! I'm an 80's child! Love Katrina and the Waves!!
 
I wouldn't stuff the booties full... just a wee little bit... I think you will be ok.
As far as fixing it...don't!! I would leave it.
I would try to get any loose yarn threads pulled into the inside.
Dont yank it....it will unravel like crazy!!!! Good Luck!
 
If the booties are heavy enough to sag with only a few attachment points, I suggest cutting a 4-ply filler-board to fit inside each of them. That would give them shape, and then you could attach each one by only three or four nylon fasteners through the backing board, through the back of the bootie, and through the filler-board.
 
Cost

Ok....I'm still working on this, yikes!!

While I'm not going to charge the customer anything additional I believe that I under bid this job. I need someone to fill in the blanks (if I'm incorrect) on what else I should have charged for. Mostly so I know what to do for the next job cuz there's no sense in crying over spilled milk.

Frame (size 14.75 x 20)
1 mat (that the booties are being secured to)
glass
object mount ($3 ea= $6 for the booties)
For a total of $157.44 before tax.

I'll be spending the day working on this project. Hopefully I'll get it done today. Will post a pic when it's completed.

Thanks!
 
My pricing would be, based on my understanding of what you are doing... $ about $ 272.00 + tax.

Breakdown

Frame: $ 135.97
Rag Mat backing bonded to cor-x polyflute board 21.79
Attach three booties filling out with poly-fill and maybe rag insert $ 20.00
Mount photo bevel and attach to backer $ 15.00
Side walls made of same rag board and backed with foam-cor $ 20.00
Regular clear picture glass $ 8.70
Fit up and hanging hardware including premium wall hook $ 24.95

Set up fee (which I charge on most orders 10%) $ 25.00

I would definitely recommend Museum Glass on this piece though. Shadow boxes call out for it and the additional cost is well worth it.
 
I completely forgot to take into consideration lining the shadow box (materials/labor). I was questioning myself about the mount charge that was coming up - that is was only $3. Thank you for posting Dave, I have a better idea of how/what to charge for next time.


Dave said:
My pricing would be, based on my understanding of what you are doing... $ about $ 272.00 + tax.

Breakdown

Frame: $ 135.97
Rag Mat backing bonded to cor-x polyflute board 21.79
Attach three booties filling out with poly-fill and maybe rag insert $ 20.00
Mount photo bevel and attach to backer $ 15.00
Side walls made of same rag board and backed with foam-cor $ 20.00
Regular clear picture glass $ 8.70
Fit up and hanging hardware including premium wall hook $ 24.95

Set up fee (which I charge on most orders 10%) $ 25.00

I would definitely recommend Museum Glass on this piece though. Shadow boxes call out for it and the additional cost is well worth it.
Click to expand...
 
Photos of shadow box

Ok.....here is the finished product! I thought it turned out great (as did the art gallery manager)! Let me know what you think! :)
 

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I'd say you are walkingonsunshine!

Looks nice. Now you can go out and do more object boxes with confidence! Nice job.
 
Great job! I bet you can't wait to do another shadowbox now. They are my favourite type of frames to work on.
 
NICE

surprise, surprise - it looks great - like the arrangement

Less' price would have been around 200 + or -
 
Good job - no one would ever know this was your first shadowbox!

Figuring out charges is always wayyyyy harder than doing the actual framing. :nuts:
 
There is no such thing as a stupid question, but stupid responses are surprisingly common. Never be afraid to ask, no matter how silly it might seem to you. There are professionals and educators on the forum, sadly, if you are made to feel like there are stupid questions, there must be a few fools as well.

The thing of most concern to all of us is that your customer will end up being glad they went to a custom picture framer, we all want to help you insure that will happen. What you produce, reflects on our entire industry.


Please, ask the stupid questions.


-John
 
Thank you everyone for the encouraging replies. :):)

The next time I do a job that I’m unsure about the pricing (being a different/new type of job) I’m going to ask the customer if they would leave the project with me while I “play around” with ideas for the piece (and secretly, figure out pricing too). (I have a gal who is bring me a flag to frame….)

@ JRB – that is just my own insecurities. I’m sure that will come w/time as I get more confident.

Sunshine
 
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