I say we ban the term, "Gallery Wrap" from our vocabulary!

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Paul Cascio

Paul Cascio

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This "Gallery Wrap" thing is BS and it's costing us a lot of money. Just when we almost eradicate the word "laminate" as a verb, "Gallery Wrap" comes along.

I say we call it "Flea Market Wrap," or "Hotel-Motel Art Sale Wrap," or "Fish Wrapped" or better yet, "Too Cheap To Frame It Wrap."

Using the word "Gallery" is just a horrible idea that implies a level of quality that is totally opposite of what it is.

Who's the crook who came up with this term? I'll bet it wasn't a framer. It was probably the same person who came up with "Faux Diamond" or "Faux" anything.

Let's all take a vow to stop using this term "Gallery Wrap" effective immediately. I say we go with "Dormatory Wrap" because that's the only place where such a form of display is acceptable.

All who agree, say "Aye."
All who want to kill me...
 
I'll second that Paul! You crack me up, lately, you seem to have accelerated your postings , I like it, keep it up!
 
Is that the same thing Andrew?
 
Aye, aye Paul! I'll probably get in trouble for this but I kind of like "Wally World Wrap" but Dormitory wrap works just fine...;)
 
Paul Cascio said:
Is that the same thing Andrew?
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No!

In a gallery wrap, image goes round the sides. In a museum wrap, image ends at edge, sides are white (or colored).

A picture is worth a thousand words ... see below.
 

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So what should we call it? Its a legitimate style of wrapping canvas.

Carry on.
 
Well Jay...

Here's a few more and I'm sure others can probably top these:

Put-Another-Framer-In-The Unemployment-Line-Wrap

or how about,

Looks-Like-Crap-Wrap

If I seem a bit hostile toward this technique, it's probably becasue I'M A FRAMER.

:-)
 
I make more money stretching a canvas the un-named way. Perhaps you should learn to stretch canvases and you too can capitalize on this?

Carry on.
 
Good one Terry

And legit too. You get my vote.
 
Jay H said:
I make more money stretching a canvas the un-named way. Perhaps you should learn to stretch canvases and you too can capitalize on this?

Carry on.
Click to expand...

It's not a knock on you Jay, I understand.
 
When I do a gallery wrap, I'll often say, as they're leaving with it, "Be thinking of the frame you want for it later"....sometimes they actually come back for a frame after I've "planted the seed" that it looks unfinished. Sneaky, but....sometimes it works!
 
Oh, Paul, I'm keeping this in the same spirit that it began. I have probably 3 gallery wrapped pieces in my shop for sale. I even have two in my house. I don't have a strong opinion one way or another but I do charge more for it.
 
Jay H said:
I don't have a strong opinion one way or another but I do charge more for it.
Click to expand...

Jay, if you don't mind my asking, how do you charge for a gallery wrap? Do you charge by united inches? How much extra for gallery wrap -vs- museum wrap or regular (stapled on the edges-showing) stretch? I haven't been charging differently for any of them, same charge, but I'm re-thinking that lately. And does your charge reflect stretching only, or does it include the strainer stock?

I'm interested in others' views about charges, as well as Jay's.
 
Jay H said:
Oh, Paul, I'm keeping this in the same spirit that it began. I have probably 3 gallery wrapped pieces in my shop for sale. I even have two in my house. I don't have a strong opinion one way or another but I do charge more for it.
Click to expand...

I'm hurt.
 
I am wondering who you think actually does all these gallery wraps that are allegedly running framers out of business??? I did over 100 canvas stretches this week. Most of them were regular oil originals and I used a Tensador II for stretching them but 6 of them were gallery wraps that I did by hand. ......... Yup, li'l ol' me. Are you thinking that there is some secret place or a short bespeckled specialist who works wearing a visor under a bare light bulb who does all these gallery wraps late at night??

They are done by framers!!! Yeah, that may sound odd but it's true. And, believe it or not, they can be sold with a float frame attached for mucho buckeroos over whatever you feel that a "Wally World wrap" would bring. You keep that attitude and send all those cheap gallery wraps my way and I'll gladly take them off your hands for you.

I can do them as fast as a regular hand stretch size for size and I charge the same for the labor either way. The added cost is in the gallery wrap strainer bars. And, with the exception of a few contemporary abstract giclars that my boss has bought, most of the original oils that I gallery wrap go into a high end Roma float or medium level float frame from a couple of other distributors.

CAframer is correct in his definition and the museum wraps are actually more difficult to stretch than a gallery wrap because you have a line of definition you have to follow to get the image where it is supposed to be. It doesn't allow for fudge factoring. It has to be straight the first time so the solid painted edge lines up with the edge and not overlapping into the image area or visa versa.

This seems to be simply another example of people running at the mouth without first having the knowledge or the background to talk professionally about the subject matter. As Jay Hartman pointed out, it is a legitimate form of canvas stretching and there is money to be made if you know how to stretch both regular and gallery wrapped originals.

But that is only my humble opinion.
 
psssssst. Tom, I think we are just having a little fun here, it's not meant to be serious. I'll happily do them too. You just see so many of them and artists in particular are starting to favor gallery wraps as an answer to not have to spend money on framing. For every gallery wrap that goes out of some shop that is just one more framer going home hungry for the day...........................we have to stand up and be heard.
 
Hang on, folks. I'm a painter and I know artists at all levels sometimes opt for gallery wrap or museum wrap. Sometimes it's because of budget and other times it's not. Sometimes it's a design decision or it's in line with the integrity of the art piece. Artists are in the business of selling art -- the frame is a secondary problem that may be resolved by high or low cost options. I can tell you that may times over the years I've heard the art buyer say, "I like the painting but I don't know about the frame." I learned to present the work, not a decorative package. It's an exercise in balance: what to present / what not to present. Many a sale is lost to the artist's taste in moulding, whether high end or low end. It's a very practical matter to leave cost and choice of framing for the interior designer or end buyer/collector. That's where the framer comes to the picture; either the designer or the collector brings the piece to the framer to shop for preference in taste that's appropriate to them. A gallery wrap eliminates the risk of revealing that your moulding taste is horrible. Likewise, in graphic design, a designer will first present options for a company logo in black and white, because many perfectly solid (even brilliant) identity solutions can be shot down because a client says, "I don't like red."

Let's not generalize that artists are being "cheap" -- they're allowing focus to be directed to the work. Most artists are (or should be) concerned with the work. It's all about the work first.
 
I can't believe I'm using "him" as an example.

jwilk, lets take the one artist in our lifetime that goes head to head with Donald Trump.....

The one thing you will never see in Thomas Kinkade gallery is a "Gallery Wrap". It may be the biggest schlock in the world... but it sells, and you have to admit.... the frames are never cheap or chintzy.
A "cheap" TK is the 500 piece puzzle.... until I put a $300 frame on it.
So maybe it's the $25 coffee mug... until you stick it in the cup holder of your $57,000 TK LTD Edition Explorer.

Gallery wrap is the height of conceit by an artist.... it basically says "I am the end-all be-all".
As for float frames... I find them to be little more than crate strapping, which is what it was when it first came into play in the 50s. At least the Dadaist had a reason for the wide white board.
 
Circle get the square

Jwilk, you make a valid argument from an artists standpoint, but since I'm a framer, my bias forces me to side with Baer, whose accuracy and eloquence is unmatched.

"Gallery wrap is the height of conceit by an artist.... it basically says "I am the end-all be-all". "

Baer
 
:shrug: I just don't get all the fuss. I have quite a few gallery wraps hanging "naked". I make sure they're priced so that I still make a profit even if I don't float them. But, 80% of the time I end up floating them, because I have an example of one in a float frame and it just looks SO MUCH BETTER. So, maybe that could be your next window display...show a wrap "naked" and one beside it in a float. I think you could probably generate some sales that way. You know what they say, "if you can't beat 'em...."
 
Could this be an opportunity in disguise? Become an "unframer" - many people have art works in their home surrounded by four pieces of wood. Just charge shop rate for liberating these items from their confines (easier than it looks, since often they are just held in place by clips). The customer will be amazed at the fresh appearance and it's all profit for you!
 
"Gallery wrap is the height of conceit by an artist..."

Hello black pot.
 
My first impression of gallery wraps was that it was cool to see the image on the sides of the bars. Now I think of it as something that is purely decorative and akin to a teenager putting a poster on the wall with tacks....pretty much the definition of cheap.

A frame does more than enhance a painting. Frames protect paintings and give them importance which in turn makes people handle them with greater care. It would behoove artists to think of the consequences fifty years down the road when they are creating art.
 
I think I'm getting it now. The opposition to this isn't for any tangible reason. It seems that "I don't like it" is the main reasoning for wanting it stricken from our vernacular. Oddly enough "conceit" was used to describe this (where’s that fainting smiley thing).

When we refinished our kitchen about 5 months ago why did I opt for two gallery wrapped canvases? I stretched them myself. I specifically chose to do it that way and not some cheap scum-of-the-Earth artist.

I guess I could start a formal poll but maybe in all wisdom of the G we could just sound off here informally.

millionaire.jpg


After the 50/50 it looks like I'm not cheap and I was so close to picking that one. I guess I either have no taste or I'm conceited. "Id like to phone a freind please, call my wife!"
 
Gallery and museum wraps are simply the result of some high-brow "tastemaker" .

Thumbtacking (please use conservation quality thumbtacks) an unstretched canvas to the wall allows it to follow its own inclinations, with the natural rippling and exposed selvedge that nature intended.

Just look at the oppressive technical terms used - "stretcher", "strainer" - how could you do this to an innocent "sofa-size" painting by a "starving artist"? Stop wrapping now and let the art go free!
 
Well, gollygoshohgee Kathy, I sure went off the deep end on that one didn't I??? I can see now that y'all are just having some fun and games with the idea that making money is discriminatory and we should make all those nasty naked GW's ride in the back of the framing bus!!!

I have no idea where I got the idea that Baer and Paul C were being serious??? I am sure that they are aware that the better artists who are selling on the wholesale level don't stretch their work except for display at market or in their private galleries and it is the framer and the end marketer that does the stretching. Oh, I guess there are some artists out there who can afford a stretching machine but those guys and gals are the ones who only sell pre-stretched oils in abandoned gas stations on weekends and their volume of sales is so terribly high that they have no option.

I wasn't sticking up for gallery wraps nor was I defending their virtues other than to say that, in an original art gallery such as the one where I work, they DO bring in alot of money from the people who are keeping us (our art gallery) in business. And the difficulty in stretching a gallery wrap ranks right up there with cutting a fillet or deciding which side of museum glass to score. The hardest part to a GW is making a nice smooth corner and I learned that in the military and practiced it every morning at 3 AM in basic training!!!

I wonder how many of you "purists" would turn away that crayon scribble drawing of little Johnny's from his first kindergarten class art project?? Done on kraft paper or worse, colored kraft paper, and bent and wrinkled from cramming it into a coloring book on the way home from school, heaven forbid that his dad or mom would go to Wally World to find a

:vomit: ................. (oh tell me I didn't let this phrase come out of my mouth!!! )​

................. a :fire: readymade frame :fire: !!!! ​

Would you stoop so low as to take money for framing something of that nature?? ............ Oh, what's this framing world coming to???? :icon11:

My offer still stands and I will take quantity stretching too. Anything up to 50 or so just send my way rolled preferably and I will fix them up for you and ship back at going rates plus crating and time and materials for stretching. :thumbsup:

(Oh, and I usually add in a PIA surcharge just because I feel that this kind of wholesale customer expects it of me.) :icon10:
 
E:

Jay H said:
When we refinished our kitchen about 5 months ago why did I opt for two gallery wrapped canvases? I stretched them myself. I specifically chose to do it that way and not some cheap scum-of-the-Earth artist.
Click to expand...

E: Because they double as serving trays.:party:

Sorry, Jay I just can't help myself sometimes.
 
This is getting to a point where it should be on Warped!

Now in my little 'burg in SW Michigan I became so tired of the trend toward gallery wraps and the artists cutting out my budget for good wine, that I started a new trend catching on like wildfire!

Half my business is now selling empty frames! Ah, yes! No worry about matching the frame to the art because the frame is the art itself!!!

I could care less what color walls these are put on for the exact match is already there in the empty space encased by the beauty of the true creative element in any framed art ...the frame itself!

Another great advantage is that I no longer have to worry about handling artwork or preservation techniques ...and of course, WallBuddies are a must so that the hanging wire doesn't show.

Too bad for the starving artists ...that'll teach them to mess in my business!

Dave Makielski
 
Food for thought

A question asked of me in another thread:
Alice, I have a question for you. One of my pet peeves is the gallery-wrap, and more generally, canvases that are just hung on a wall without a frame. This seems especially prevalent in the area of contemporary art, and since you work in the field, I'm curious as to your take on it. How do you deal with artists, galleries and purchasers that just want to hang the canvas on the wall, no frame?

My answer:
Paul,
In our galleries, there are some pieces that go up unframed though not in an opening show. There are some in the 2 rooms in back which are for general display. Of course there are the pieces that are not suitable for framing… i.e. We have a piece that is multi media, 6ft by 8ft, done on the back of Astro turf hung on angle-iron. There are some on board with nicely finished box edges which are painted or not. And we have pieces that are gallery wrapped. We even have some with the gallery wrap which have the wrapped edge decoratively painted as to “frame”.
I feel that the main reason for our artists, whom choose not to frame their pieces, is the expense. When we hang their work for display to sell, as opposed to a gallery show w/ opening, there are some whom do not want to incur the added expense of the framing when it might need to be changed out at purchase (the customer wants something else) or because the pieces are so large.
I will say that for the gallery owner, not having to worry about the frame can be a blessing, (if the piece is strong enough to pull it off). We do not have the added concern about the frame getting dinged, or someone wanting a discount because they don’t like the frame, and pieces take up less wall space w/o a frame and we can hang more work.
Gallery wrap is definately a big trend and it is a real judgment call for the artist and gallery. As long as the wrap is clean, well done, not distracting, etc., it is not a problem for us. A frame can sell a piece or it can be a problem.

Now having said all that, I also frame for the etching studio in our building and they frame everything! It is very hard to sell a fine art print without it being in a frame. They frame in a small or large, contemporary, black or maple moulding only. Everything is island mounted on acid free foamcore with foam core liners, plexi or glass according to size. Often someone will want the print but they may want to go to the drawer and pick out another copy in the edition.

I hope that answered some questions. Happy framing, Alice


Honestly, wrapping a frame may not be your personal cup of tea, but I promise you that it is not done to cause you pain. How if affects the local framer is not on the artist's mind. He is trying to eek out a living like the rest of us. I think that you can tap into the artist in other ways if framing is not in the equation. Make sure that you let it know that you doing wrapping. Sent the peice out of the shop with a quote for floating it. Do any of you make shipping crates for framed work? We have artist looking for help in that area all the time. We had a show go to China last year. Everyone needed a crate... a lot of work but a lot of money.
Alice
 
My issue is one of semantics - the term; not the technique.

As the subject line was designed to indicate, I'm opposed to the term "Gallery Wrap"; NOT the technique.

I want us to change the name so that it doesn't imply "Ready to Display." It's the name that is costing us money.

Terry Hart offered an excellent alternative in "Float Frame Wrap" that I wholeheartedly endorse. It's less derogatory than my "Dormitory Wrap" and it's both descriptive and suggestive.

Adopting this term could increase sales for all of us. Marketing techniques are often subtle and frequently involve semantics. I'm serious about this, I just use humor to make my point. "Gallery Wrap" has got to go.

And while we're at it, let's get rid of the term "Regular Glass."

I prefer, "Standard, Reflective Glass," which points out the negative qualities in a semi-subtle way. Call it "Standard Reflective Glass" and you'll sell more premium glass products with less effort.

This topic belongs right here. Since when is your profit picture not a serious issue?
 
Paul ...very astute observation about terminology on glazing and also a good analogy as to why "gallery wrap" could very well be a harmful term to the framing trade.

I tell customers my "regular glass" or "standard glazing" is UV clear. I only bring up the clear picture frame glass option if cost cutting is imperative. Even then I am shying away from it more and more as I use up any remaining stock, including scraps, I have of clear glass in stock. Someone once posted that they are thinking of charging more for clear glass than UV clear and I'm begininning to sympathize more and more with what they were saying.

I think the term "gallery wrap" may have gained common use when Tara Fredrix came out with their pre-stretched standard size "Gallery Wrap" series of canvas that could be bought off the shelf. How we can ever change the term is beyond me. We may just want to continue using the term but change its perceived meaning. Gallery wrap should mean and be explained as a method artists often use to display paintings since the environment of the eventual display space is unknown and the artist has chosen this method of display until a complimentary frame is chosen.

If this usage of the term is accepted, then we should also recommend that ALL CANVASES should be gallery wrapped allowing the greatest flexibility in framing (such as floats). Displaying a painting without a frame should be considered a temporary method until a proper frame is affordable and chosen. Just assume that this is the norm and convey that to the customer. Don't even suggest that displaying an unframed painting is an acceptable method of display ...only a temporary situation ...much like thumbtacking a photo on a bulletin board or matting the photo and sticking a sticky hook on the back with acetate or mylar wrap. Eventually the piece deserves "proper framing".

It's much more difficult to paddle upstream than lean back and float with the current.

Dave Makielski
 
I kind of like the term "Unprotected" or "Ready to Finish", I guess it is a little less harsh than "Unrespectful".

Of course those of you like Paul and I who sat in Christie's for the sale of Van Gogh's Sunflowers.. emediately noticed that it had been removed from it's Second Regency 23.75kt frame with the burnish panel liner, and was properly restretched in a Gallery Wrap for proper display.

Paul, you missed "F" for Disposable Art. :D
 
Dave said:
How we can ever change the term is beyond me.
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Dave, I think how we begin to change the term (at least in our own small little world) is to just do as Paul suggests in our own shop, with our own customers. And then present it as you suggested as a temp. solution until the correct frame is choosen.

I like it : As the subject line was designed to indicate, I'm opposed to the term "Gallery Wrap"; NOT the technique.

I want us to change the name so that it doesn't imply "Ready to Display." It's the name that is costing us money.

Terry Hart offered an excellent alternative in "Float Frame Wrap" that I wholeheartedly endorse. It's less derogatory than my "Dormitory Wrap" and it's both descriptive and suggestive.


From now on everytime a Gallery Wrap is presented/discussed in my shop it will be referred to by me as a "Float Frame Wrap" with an explanation.:)
 
I blame the French.

No real reason for it, it just feels Frenchy to me.

Aye, ban the term, dang the torpedos, to heck with hiding staples...

(OK I was kidding about the french thing, I think after the word Giclee came out they have been lying low, save your arrows for another day)

Bob
 
I'll go with that and do my part.

"FLOAT FRAME WRAP" :beer:

That works!

Now what penalty do we impose on the first Grumbler to use the term *%&#*^% wrap???

:icon11:

Dave Makielski



 
Ok. I think I first used the term here but only to describe what I was referring to so I could then get on with the posting of my message. I dislike the term, too. Actually, when I talk to a customer I just say "wrapped," but I like the idea of "float frame" wrapped: as it encourages one to think of the next step.

I'm a consumer in life like everyone else and I want to go to any merchant and feel that regardless of my budget and taste, that merchant is sincere about helping me with what is right for me (and in the case of framing, what's right for the object to be displayed). I don't want to be "sold" anything. You can help customers with smart advice, but if s/he must choose according to a budget that you don't like, send the customer away. If you don't want to sell cheap suits, don't stock them.

If you don't have mud flaps and curb feelers on your car, do you think of yourself as trying to hurt the automotive aftermarket? No. It's not personal, it's just the way things are. Float wrapped canvases exist as an option, we can't wish them away -- it's just the way it is (and we all know what the meaning of "is" is, don't we?)
 
LOVE THE NEW TERM

Okay, I'll admit.....I've done the Float Frame Wrap for customers who have requested it. But I have to tell you, I also tell them that in my opinion as a framer who has seen many applications come and go, I want them to think about the future when you want that framed traditionally and how much of the painting they will have lost. Of course, now we have the float frames back in full force, so their options are greater.

I personally don't like the look and never have, but that is my own taste. I would never turn down an opportunity to make a sale if that is all the customer really wants.

Lori
 
A word "frame" doesn't have a place in the name of the product without a frame

The terms - gallery wrapping and museum wrapping-were introduced to a general public by volume manufacturers some years ago. At that time technologies for art mass reproduction on canvas become relatively cheap and available all around the world. Also, at that time, the canvas "art" mass production assembly lines were set up in "some county" in Asia. To sell that wall decor cheap and as a finished product aura of words "gallery" and "museum" was added to the product designation.

The term we are going to introduce should convey our thoughts that, though, gallery wrapping and museum wrapping are appropriate in some cases, in most cases a FRAME is required. That term that describes a presentation/display of a stretched canvas without a frame must not contain a word "FRAME"- our bread and butter!

I suggest a term, that, though technically correct, may convey a notion of unfinished product, and, also, may be associated with some not very pleasant experience or observation: SCAFFOLD wrapping.

Not to be blamed with my English complete barbarism, following is the name of the article in some biotechnology publication: "Scaffold based on a naturally occurring plant protein, cytokinin oxidase (CKX).

Please note that this word become pretty popular in a modern biotechnology. Don't ask me its meaning...in biotechnology.:icon21:
 
Paul Cascio said:
As the subject line was designed to indicate, I'm opposed to the term "Gallery Wrap"; NOT the technique. .......................
Click to expand...

Paul Cascio said:
Here's a few more and I'm sure others can probably top these:

Put-Another-Framer-In-The Unemployment-Line-Wrap

or how about,

Looks-Like-Crap-Wrap

If I seem a bit hostile toward this technique, it's probably becasue I'M A FRAMER.

:-)
Click to expand...

Hmmmm, not opposed to the technique??

Well, ya sure had me fooled!!!!:shrug:
 
Ok - just read all this and I have it sussed - Paul Cascio is using us for free research in a forthcoming class. :smiley:

Anyway - I'm an 'aye' and the UK calls them 'boxed canvasses' and I call them 'inside out frames'

Most of the stuff I get to stretch in this manner looks better showing the 'frame' anyway!
 
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