Will it bring down the house?


CGF II, Certified Grumble Framer Level 2
Sep 18, 2002
Huntington Beach, CA
I am floating a h22"Xw55 1/2" light tapestry (over all including extra mat width(s))into a LM19514 2" moulding.

The customer wants to use glass rather then plexi because she thinks her house cleaning service will screw up the plexi. I agree.

Would you be comfortable using glass in this size frame job or...

Thanking you in advance as always.
We regularly use 40x60 glass. Just use a double d-ring and braid 2 strands of #8 wire, using of course a thick, minimun 1 3/4 wide frame.
As long as the frame is sturdy enough to support the weight, glass that size shouldn't be a problem.

Unless you have to climb up a ladder to hang it.

I have a 3' x 4' pastel chalk drawing above the door in my bathroom. Had to use glass on that. I put it in a stacked metal frame with wallbuddies, then got my kid to hang it. Easy!

Size is okay. But One word WALLBUDIES
Originally posted by GUMBY, GCF:
Size is okay. But One word WALLBUDIES
Glass that size is fine. I do it all the time. Don't use wire across the back though. A piece that wide and short should be hung either directly from the D-Rings with 75lb hooks or use Wall Buddies. Be sure to instruct your customer not to put a wire on it or they'll go down to the local hardware store and buy 15lb wire then it will be your fault when it hits the ground. Why do they insist on using a wire???? You have no idea how many times I've torn wire off the back of mirrors that had no business being hung from one hook. Usually it's a piece of electrical wire or a wire hanger thats been bent around the rings (or in one case Wall Buddies!). They always say the same thing..."I don't know why the framer didn't put a wire on it, I had to use what I could find....". Idiots.
Originally posted by Frank Larson:
...Why do they insist on using a wire???? You have no idea how many times I've torn wire off the back of mirrors that had no business being hung from one hook....They always say the same thing..."I don't know why the framer didn't put a wire on it, I had to use what I could find....". Idiots.
Yes, using a wire that way seems idiotic, but consumer idiocy is something we can fix. We need to educate them.
WallBuddies are my default hanging system and has been since I found them in Darrell's booth at a trade show a few years ago. Give them a try. You will immediately fall in love with them! I can't imagine why this idea didn't surface long ago, there have been similar ideas come along but WB's are simple, cheap, and they WORK!!

'Nuff said 'bout that!

Nope, if you go along with glass and agree that is what should be used, try to guess who is going to get named in a lawsuit, should the glass somehow break. Grandchildren can come to visit, accidents happen. Kids try to clean up broken glass so they don't get in too much trouble......

OK, heres another one: Uncle Bob drinks a little more wine than he is accustomed to, stumbles into the large piece of SSB glass, cuts himself badly......

I can dream up a lot more, hopefully you've got the idea. If you recommend single strength or even double strength glass that size, you are going to be liable. Why would you want to jeopardize someones safety and your own livelihood?

Myself, if the customer insisted on using glass, I would have them give me that order in writing, making it clear that I recommended against using glass.

California is the land of the legal lottery, just about everyone is hoping for a chance to win.

Thanks all!

Yes, wall buddies have been my shop standard for the last.

As to the kids and law-suits, uuuuummmmmm. This is going to hang in the living room with other framed art. Two are 28x30 with glass. I think that most art is framed using glass up to 30x?? so a law-suit is not what I would expect to happen. If this was in the kid's bedroom, no question what I would use.

Thanks again
Schott have a glass which they call “Microgard Protect” http://www.schott.com/architecture/english/products/non_reflective_glass/mirogard/index.html it is a laminated glass….with a 98% UV …..they have US distribution…. someone posted recently that they sold it to picture framers (sorry cannot recall who)……….I think it may be possible that TruVue may have some thing similar…on the market by now…I know they were talking about it a few years ago …

I have just completed a piece which is 60 x 36” with standard glass…I’m not very happy with the project…..but I ran with it, as the framing is only a temporary frame for an exhibition ,,,,the item will be un framed and archival stored in the dark after the exhibition….
Schott is handled in the US by Museum Glazing Services (910)692-8855.

I just knew you would come to my rescue…thanks

Now a question….I got some samples of Schott and TruVue glass yesterday…..the clarity of Schott Microguard Plus……is remarkable when compared to TruVue .Museum Glass…..no green ting…. Microguard Plus has a 84% UV protect…what are the feelings about trading clarity for UV protect….I can most likely get Microguard Plus for in or around the same price as TruVue standard UV glass……in other words what are the trade offs

Somebody (mostly not me) is buying all that 40"x60" glass that Tru Vue is boxing up. I can't believe they're cutting it up into 8x10s.

If you're concerned about glass, and concerned about cleaning problems with Plexi, I'd look at Cyro Acrylite A/R (abrasion-resistant.) This stuff is tough and can be cleaned with just about anything you'd use on glass, comes with the OP-3 UV protection and weighs half-as-much as glass.
Originally posted by Jim Miller:
consumer idiocy is something we can fix.
Let me know when there are no more idiots and I'll come out of hiding

Seriously, I do know what you mean. Unfortunately it doesn't end with "consumers". There are even idiot framers we've had to educate - of course, there wouldn't be any of those on the Grumble ;)
Not familiar with the Schott Microguard Plus as I don't think they import it to US. Sounds like waterwhite glazing to me (no iron) and TruVue distributes a product in the states called Conservation Ultraclear which has no green cast and has the 97% UV protection, but it is softer and more easily broken that the regular Conservation Clear. Denglas has a waterwhite UV product as well. Schott does import a product called Amiron (excuse the spelling if wrong) that is a laminated safety glass using waterwhite and UV acrylic layers with an anti-reflective coat on the surface.
The guy to talk to at Museum Glazing Services is Ernie Robertson (ernrob@earthlink.net). He is my source for knowledge about glazing products.