Widen Rabbet - Rip or Router?

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Widen Rabbet - Rip or Router?

I need to widen the rabbet on this moulding to about 3/4".

The moulding is Roma #51955 - 2", wide 1 3/4" H, with a rabbit depth of 1 1/4".

Will a router handle the depth or do I need to rip it on a table saw? Any other ideas? Fillet is not an option.

Less is a good designer, framer, fabricator of metal, and a decent electrical tech, but I have not dabbled much with carpentry. I can have a friend do the job for me, or should I invest in the tools that will get the job done?

romarip
 
Either tool in the right hands will do the job, but from my experience using a rip or dado blade on a table saw will give you much greater control.
Unless you have to do this often it would be more practical let your friend do it.
Good luck.
 
Oooh, oooh, me, me, (with hand waving in the air) I can answer this one. I just did it Monday!!!

I only needed a little bit (fold in canvas on the corner made the frame too tight.) I first tried a profile sander - wasn't taking enough at a time. Then I tried an old woodworker trick, using a piece of glass to shave off a bit. Not enough either. Finally, I got out my Dremel flexible shaft with a high speed cutter tip and cut the amount out in about 5 minutes! Worked great!

Personally, I'd be afraid to use a router or a saw as you wouldn't have as much control over the tool as with a Dremel.

That is of course if you have a Dremel... A lot of what I do, depends on what kind of tools I have.

Betty
 
Less, that's too much wood to remove with a dremel. I'd vote for the table saw and I'd vote for having the friend do it. (Assuming your friend is experienced.) "Dabbling in carpentry" was exactly how I lost part of a finger 20 years ago.

Unless you're really anxious to live up to your screen name.
 
Lessafinger,

I'd take the advice of Lessapartofafinger who is speaking from experience in the woodworking field. A good woodworker with a dado blade can clean out 3/4" from that moulding in less time than it takes to talk about it. If you try to do it with a regular table saw blade you will have to make multiple passes from the bottom side because of the profile of the moulding and, with each additional pass, you run the risk of making a mistake. With a dado blade you make one pass and you're done

I'm sure you already know this but do the dadoing before you build the frame.

Framerguy
 
I agree with Woodshaper and Ron on this one. A table saw (unless you happen to have access to a shaper table, which is really nothing more than a big industrial router) gives you the most control and is the safest machine to use.

A Dremel tool, handy as it is for small work, just isn't big enough for what this size of job appears to be, I would opine. Also, it's much harder to control freehand than a large piece of stable equipment designed for this specific task. Operator fatigue would increase the likelihood of the small tool taking a good gouge eventually. (speaking ruefully from experience, after which I finally set up a moderately-stout router table designed for occasional use such as this)

If you have a cabinetmaker friend, just remember, we probably all have friends we haven't used yet! :D He probably needs your electrical acumen from time to time; it's a fair exchange.

One reasonably constructive suggestion I would offer is that it might perhaps be helpful to pre-cut the moulding close to its general chop length before using a dado set OR shaper table, to increase the accuracy of the cut by decreasing any potential flexing. Then cut the angles to the correct length, once the final moulding depths are measured, etc etc.

[ 03-06-2003, 01:23 PM: Message edited by: po' framer ]
 
Less,
A table mounted router (with fence) or table saw is the way to go. No freehand power tools unLess you want to live up to your cybernom.
A very handy tool for relieving small amounts of material to widen or deepen a rabbet is a bull-nosed rabbet plane. UMS handles one made by Stanley (item 2690) made from cast iron. I bought mine, a Record No. 077, at Garrett-Wade in NY. It is made from machined steel and a very fine tool indeed.

D#$%, stop to take a phone call, and you post becomes irrelevant.

[ 03-06-2003, 01:49 PM: Message edited by: wpfay ]
 
Spindle Moulder or Plunge Router (with a good bit you will be able to take two strikes to get the perfect result).

Table saw, hmmm maybe.

I think the Dremel would have melted down by the time you finished on this, though they are one of the handiest tools in the workshop...

Don't forget to mask the edges that you guide along to save from scratching!!!
 
Less,
As long as the frame has not been joined, a good tablesaw with a dado blade works best. I've done this stuff before and I am a faithful follower of Brother Norm Abrams of "New Yankee Workshop" However, let somebody who has done it before and has the equipment do it, or if you're into toys a halfa** tablesaw would cost you about $400 bucks.
Dado set would be extra.
 
Ok, ok, teacher finally called on me and I had the wrong answer. Story of my life! Anyway, for only taking out a 1/16 or so, the Dremel works great. And I use a Dremel often enough that I am comfortable doing this kind of thing with it.

Like I said, "a lot of what I do, depends on what kind of tools I have." I don't have a router or a dado blade, so there....


Seriously, guys, I stand corrected.

Betty
 
Aw, Betty, no correction, just additional thoughts!

I agree with you about available tools; you use what you have access to. I had to use a Dremel tool to widen a slot in a stained glass moulding cause I didn't have the router table set up at the time. In that case it was fine because I had guidance along both edges but still burnt up a couple of cutting tools and severely stressed the Dremel's motor and bearings while I was at it.

Except for us tool- and gear-heads, just one job isn't justification for buying industrial-quality shop tools, which can easily run over $2k for the good stuff. (and who doesn't want the good stuff, I ax ya?)
 
No doubt that a table saw is the best solution and next would be a router but only when used in a router table. However, if you are simply not into power tools (dust and noise) you could buy a Stanley #93 Rabbet plane (or similar - Lee Valley tools has a nice asian wooden rabbet plane for about 40 bucks) and after a brief learning curve be able to trim out those pesky wabbets in a few minutes.

[ 03-06-2003, 10:29 PM: Message edited by: John Gornall CPF ]
 
For those who would happily run this through a table saw I must query as to if removing the safety guard is really that easy or safe to do? If you only ever use the Dado set maybe so???
A Dado set is not very quick to set up and with a soft timber (as I imagine this being) it may leave a gooey (torn) edge on such timbers?

or maybe just wrap a bit of sandpaper aound your finger and sand it while watching tv...
 
Safety guard? What safety guard? I haven't seen mine for about 15 years and yes...I still have all my fingers. Table saw with a dado blade is the tool for this job. If you want a nice clean cut raise the blade about 1/4" at a time making mutiple passes. Much safer that way too. Cut your moulding close to the size you want but don't miter it. It's harder and riskier to push through the saw with a mitered end. Your push stick could slip off letting the moulding kick back and fly through the wall stabbing your neighbor in the hinie. How's that for a twisted imagination?
 
Orton, widening the rabbet is not to cover a mistake, but the edges of an unsightly wood mounting board. Personally it does not bother me, but the clients wants it covered. Fillets are not an option.

see before and after thread.
 
We have a Dremel, but, like Po' said, the really good, heavy duty stuff is expensive. To wit:

<center>
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There's another brand name that jewelers use. Comes mounted on a stand, and you can use almost any kind of bit, polisher, grinder, etc with it. Old age prevents me from recalling the name of the company that makes it.

Check it out HERE

[ 03-07-2003, 01:01 PM: Message edited by: CharlesLowry. ]
 
Originally posted by CharlesLowry.:

There's another brand name that jewelers use. Comes mounted on a stand, and you can use almost any kind of bit, polisher, grinder, etc with it. Old age prevents me from recalling the name of the company that makes it.
Click to expand...
Foredom www.foredom.com/

Oh, and a table saw will do a pretty good job cutting off the ratty edges of the artwork too....


Just Kidding! :D

[ 03-07-2003, 09:48 PM: Message edited by: Frank Larson ]
 
Table saw with a dado blade. Routers are handy but you run a great risk of tear out when you use one. If you decide on a router, be sure to use a router table. Use a upward spiral cutting blade instead of using a rabbeting bit, lot less chance of tear out. I hate using a router for rabbeting and only do it when I have to. We make a lot of mission style frames that must be rabbeted after the frame is joined, so I am stuck with it ( the router) but I prefer the table saw and dado blade.

John
 
Oh, and a table saw will do a pretty good job cutting off the ratty edges of the artwork too....
Click to expand...
Less,

That isn't a bad idea. Could you trim the mounting board to within 1/4 inch of the artwork?Just a thought.

Good luck with whatever you do and hope you don't Loosafinger in the process!
 
Originally posted by JRB:
We make a lot of mission style frames that must be rabbeted after the frame is joined
Click to expand...
John, could you tell us a little more about these frames?
 
I am not computerized enough to know how to send pictures.

I purchased a set of samples of "Mission style" frames from Kellar & Klein about four or five years ago. After seeing them I figured I could make them myself, so I've been doing just that. The woodworking part of it is fairly easy, applying the finish is the hardest part. I have yet to be able to match the quality of the finishes on my sample set, but I am now getting pretty darn close. My customers all seem happy with everything I've done so far.

For a look at Kellar & Klein frames, go to www.kellarklein.com

John
 
Router works fine if you have the right bit. We just cleaned out 1/4 inch off a frame to accomodate another frame( a stacked moulding). It was only off by 1/4 inch, but I also realized that meant only 1/8 for all around effect.One moulding was already chopped, the other not. Until I stretched the canvas, had no idea about the measurements. It was a really tough fit, and I still can see where I could have made different calculations. We were down to 1/32's of an inch.
Measure 2x and cut once, as the pro's say. It worked fine, eventually.
Let me know if you have any q's, I would be happy to answer

[ 03-10-2003, 10:32 PM: Message edited by: lyoncat ]
 
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