What Would YOU Do?

Rob Markoff

PFG, Picture Framing God
Joined
Mar 8, 1999
Posts
5,183
Loc
San Diego, CA USA
A customer bings in a framed photograph that is in very bad condiditon that he wants to reframe.

We measure the window size of the existing mat, and calculate a price for a design based on the size of his original photo.

He then decides that he wants to have the photo restored and takes it with him to have the work done. (Please don't get into "Why didn't you offer, subcontract etc......, he wanted to have it done himself).

When he returns, the output is slightly larger than the original, and if we maintain the size originally quoted, it unacceptably crops the photo, so the proper size jumps to the next UI category.

In reality, the only thing it does is require another 1/2 foot of moulding (but we buy length and the 1/2 foot would probably been thrown into the trash.) The mats/glass come out of the same sheet.

Our designer tells him that because the size he brought in is different than the original, the estimate is now slightly higher (about $15).

Client gets very angry and says he will walk unless we honor the original quote.

What would you do? Whould you have even brought up the size difference?
 
With no more size difference than that, and with a customer already in hand (with a piece that you know won't offer any problems as with a piece in "bad condition") I'd probably mention the size difference, and say, but we'll keep it at the price we originally quoted.

One: The customer knows it is larger and
Two: He hears you say that you'll "treat him right" on the price.

That's gotta make him feel good about you...
 
I think it is unreasonable of the client to expect you to honor your quote which was for a smaller frame.
I would give him the choice of having the photo cropped or paying for the larger frame.

If he is unable to appreciate that price is related to size then I would let him walk.

That's what I would do but probably the smart thing is to take the money.

George
 
15.00 is a small amount, to lose a client over and the bad advertising he offers word of mouth as well. I would have done exactly as Betty suggested, point out the difference so they understand , but I would not have charged more.

Now if it was significantly larger thats a different animal and a higher price is to be expected.
 
He is essentially negotiating on the price. I'd probably do it for him. It is your call. If business is well, you may not need him but could be a return customer later. If business is flat, you need him anyway. That’s why I say to do it.
John
 
Betty's solution.
You come out looking like the hero.

Do your designers have any leeway in dealing with issues like this? I would think that a quick glance at the footage necessary and the glass size and the designer can make the call to "honor" the initial quote, but then again, I do every order that comes through my shop. You have to establish policy so that the people that work for you don't give away the farm.
 
Make him happy and you'll have a repeat customer. Besides, it's not costing you anything to make him satified, and word of mouth is a strong deciding factor in this situation.

That has happened in my shop a few times before and I point out to the person that even though their calculations may have been off, I'm still going to honor the quote. I would much rather see a smile of gratitude than anything else.

Lori
 
What Betty said.
I know of a new framer at a local craft store who's senior coworker consistently calls his customers to tell them to come back in, that she feels they could make a better choice in frames/mats, or that the new guy misquoted them. Not GOOD! I know this happens because I have gotten a few of their customers who got caught in the "but he said/she said" war and just said to heck with it.
$15 is a lot to lose a customer over sheer principle, you would ultimately lose a lot more than that..."he said/she said" travels fast.
 
Biggest "no brainer" we probably all face

So, what did you do?

For us, it cost probably nothing. Knowing your prices, Rob, you probably killed the fatted calf at the first quote (LOL)
 
I agree with Betty's advice 100 percent. For a matter of $15 (and really at no extra cost to you), you could gain a lot of goodwill from this customer. Word of mouth is an amazing source of advertising and 'bad' word of mouth can spread much faster than 'good' word of mouth.

It is fortunate that you hadn't gone ahead and made the frame, cut the mats & glass based on the original photo size.
 
I'm curious, do your designers frame as well as handle the front counter.

I only ask because I am curious if they understand the backroom enough to know exactly what you said about, knowing it was only going to be a half a foot more, probably would have been thrown out anyway, etc.

Do they have backroom knowledge and/or permission to make that kind of sale saving call at the front.
 
As much as I hate to say it, it would probably depend on my mood.

As others pointed out, he knows that it is larger and, thus, more costly to you. I probably would have suggested that we split the difference. That way he thinks you are compromising a little, and you are not losing quite so much.

But, if he balked at that, too, my back would have been against the wall, and rather than look like a nebbish, I would have had to let him walk.

But, honestly, I don’t think I would have let him have the original price; it would have looked too much like he was demanding a discount and too much like I was caving to his demand.
 
Before I met Bob Carter I never had the mind set re: "on a slow day, or at the end of the month, any PROFITABLE sale is better than no sale, even if you make less profit." And, as many have pointed out, the out of pocket on this one is nominal. Why give the client an opportunity to go elsewhere?

SIDEBAR: If you are ANYWHERE near St. Louis, it is well worth your time and expense (even if it means spending the night and/or closing your shop for a day) to spend some time LISTENING to Bob. He comes to the framing industry with a completely different perspective than has been "taught" for years in framing publications and the mind set/philosophy he teaches can make a significant difference in your profitabililty, or in this current state of the industry, survival.

But, what if the extra half foot meant buying another WHOLE stick of moulding, meaning it required 10 1/2 feet of a metal moulding?

After explaining to the customer why the new price should be higher than the original quote, I still would have said that we would honor the original price.

And, since my designers are in a separate location than the frame shop, it is my responsibility as a business owner to be sure they understand the rammifications of making such a decision....AND to empower them to make that decision (and support their having done so) without having to "check with the manager, owner etc.".

Yes, customers like this really get to me, but I do not want them to go someplace else. And, yes it is possible that if he did go someplace else, even with the larger size, someone else's prices might be LOWER than mine, so why give him an opportunity to price shop?

(He can always be noted as a "special fit" client for future orders, but he would probably not question the price because he had a POSITIVE experience the last go around.)

What is a "special fit" client? We have a line item on our pricing that is higher for some jobs that require extra time.

One of my managers years ago moved some PIA, energy suck clients to the "special fit" category regardless of what they brought in and the concept has stuck. They pay for "special fitting" because they are "special."

So, yes we did honor the original price and we kept the sale.
 
What would I do? Retrain the person who pi$$ed-off your customer half-way through the sale.

If the original was an 8x10 and they blew it up to a 16x20... renegotiate a new price. The customer has no leg to stand on.

If the 8x10 went to an 11x14, then the conversation might go something like "well the photo restorer didn't pay attention to your request for a photo of the same size, but I think we can reduce the mat a bit and still accomidate your to our original agreed price. There sure did a real nice job on the retouch, and with the ink-jet printing technology, this will be a picture that your grandkids can enjoy and fight over."

It's not what you say or do, it's how you made them FEEL that they will remember forever.

Even if <u>they were wrong</u> in making the photo a little bigger, they will always FEEL like you baited and switched on them.

Oh and ah over the restoration then causually remark the size difference, and HANDLE IT. They will always feel that you did it anyway because THEY WERE <u>SPECIAL</u>.
 
Rob "special fit" sounds much better than what I call it, lol
 
I just KNEW it was a test question. Oughta be part of the CPF exam instead of some of the stuff that's on there
 
"Half a pint of best bitter pleas barman"

"£1.50 please sir"

(gulp gulp)

"A pint of your bst bitter please barman"

"£3.00 please sir"

"WHAT - £3 .. £1:50 or you can stick it"

"Who's next please"

I'm afraid the bit that went "the customer got very angry and threatened to walk" would do it for me.

Anyone is entitled to haggle, no-one makes demands!
 
Originally posted by RoboFramer:

I'm afraid the bit that went "the customer got very angry and threatened to walk" would do it for me.
The key is to never let it get to that point. If you do, then it becomes a, uh, well a "save face" situation, and goodness knows, we can't let the other fella win, now can we?
:rolleyes:
 
It's not so much about "letting the other guy win" as much as when tempers flair... that's the customers experience.

If we in our infinate experience of "been down this road before" we don't just snip it off before it happens... well then.. you can bet your bottom line... even though they "won", that's the last order you do for them.

John, it's an American thing. Americans <strike>think</strike> believe they are the most special person on the face of the earth because for no other reason than they think it.

Point it out that it isn't true... and you get temper tantrum.

Stroke it ever so slightly, and you get a mushy gushy evangelical for your shop. Don't customers REALLY respond when you remember their names and sometimes even the frame job you did yeah those long years ago? [you know the job.. it was the one you lost your a$$et on and hated her forever... untill she came in gushing about your work and dropped off several more.]

But the secret is never let the temper flair.. Houdini.
 
Thanks for the kind words, Rob

With the caveat that no additional material would be needed, why create any "bad will"?

Lets assume that you did order a chop already

I might suggest that then we have a new ball game

Or, we might cut the mat with a tad smaller opening or fudge a bit on the cropping or anything else to "eliminate" the need to "re-sell" the same project

But, above all, exhaust the obvious cures before we you have to start all over trying to find a new client

Anyone that knows Rob's shops can take as fact that the job will be first-rate and charged for accordingly.

There is no way you will ever find that good of a client for $15
 
I would have used the same frame size with a slightly smaller mat width.

I have took this approach for years and the customer will never notice a half inch here and a half inch there.

That way, no body gets angry. Not the customer or me.


I just renamed my 'PITA' charge to 'special fit'.

thumbsup.gif
 
I would write it off as a $15 lesson. Most of my lessons are much more expensive than that.

I'm holding on a job right now becuase a customer insists on getting the brass plate herself. I hadn't thought about a photo restoration changing the size. Now that is a lesson I got for free.
 
Another thread talked about tact.

I would have nonchalantly pointed out that the copy was a larger size, but that you would honor the original quote and appreciate the opportunity to be of service.

Dave Makielski
 
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