MitchelC
MGF, Master Grumble Framer
What is Ubuntu? Can it replace WinXP? Should it replace WinXP? Can they both be used in the same computer? How easy is it to install? Any advise is appreciated. Thanks.
Ubuntu
- Thread starter MitchelC
- Start date
You know the old joke about asking about the price of Rolls Royce. If you have to ask, you can't afford it.
Ubuntu is sort of like this. It's a flavor of Linux and unless you know Linux and what's required for it's care and feeding, then you shouldn't be asking.
It's not a replacement for any flavor of Windows, but its own operating system. While there are many programs that can be substituted for Windows programs, it is likely that you will have to get all new programs.
On the plus side, almost everything having to do with an Linus flavor is free.
On the negative side, almost everything dealing with Linux is arcane and requires a super geek level of knowledge to install and maintain. And you just can't install and forget. Your ongoing tasks will be daunting.
So the questions is: are you a super geek? If the answer is no, then stay with Windows.
Here's a quick example of the type of help available for Linux. This is a partial help page for one of the most basic commands; grep.
If this makes sense, then go for it.
grep(1) - Linux man page
Name
grep, egrep, fgrep - print lines matching a pattern
Synopsis
grep [options] PATTERN [FILE...]
grep [options] [-e PATTERN | -f FILE] [FILE...]
Description
Grep searches the named input FILEs (or standard input if no files are named, or the file name - is given) for lines containing a match to the given PATTERN. By default, grep prints the matching lines.
In addition, two variant programs egrep and fgrep are available. Egrep is the same as grep -E. Fgrep is the same as grep -F.
Options
-A NUM, --after-context=NUM
Print NUM lines of trailing context after matching lines. Places a line containing -- between contiguous groups of matches.
-a, --text
Process a binary file as if it were text; this is equivalent to the --binary-files=text option.
-B NUM, --before-context=NUM
Print NUM lines of leading context before matching lines. Places a line containing -- between contiguous groups of matches.
-C NUM, --context=NUM
Print NUM lines of output context. Places a line containing -- between contiguous groups of matches.
-b, --byte-offset
Print the byte offset within the input file before each line of output.
--binary-files=TYPE
If the first few bytes of a file indicate that the file contains binary data, assume that the file is of type TYPE. By default, TYPE is binary, and grep normally outputs either a one-line message saying that a binary file matches, or no message if there is no match. If TYPE is without-match, grep assumes that a binary file does not match; this is equivalent to the -I option. If TYPE is text, grep processes a binary file as if it were text; this is equivalent to the -a option. Warning: grep --binary-files=text might output binary garbage, which can have nasty side effects if the output is a terminal and if the terminal driver interprets some of it as commands.
--colour[=WHEN], --color[=WHEN]
Surround the matching string with the marker find in GREP_COLOR environment variable. WHEN may be 'never', 'always', or 'auto'
-c, --count
Suppress normal output; instead print a count of matching lines for each input file. With the -v, --invert-match option (see below), count non-matching lines.
-D ACTION, --devices=ACTION
If an input file is a device, FIFO or socket, use ACTION to process it. By default, ACTION is read, which means that devices are read just as if they were ordinary files. If ACTION is skip, devices are silently skipped.
-d ACTION, --directories=ACTION
If an input file is a directory, use ACTION to process it. By default, ACTION is read, which means that directories are read just as if they were ordinary files. If ACTION is skip, directories are silently skipped. If ACTION is recurse, grep reads all files under each directory, recursively; this is equivalent to the -r option.
-E, --extended-regexp
Interpret PATTERN as an extended regular expression (see below).
-e PATTERN, --regexp=PATTERN
Use PATTERN as the pattern; useful to protect patterns beginning with -.
-F, --fixed-strings
Interpret PATTERN as a list of fixed strings, separated by newlines, any of which is to be matched.
-P, --perl-regexp
Interpret PATTERN as a Perl regular expression.
-f FILE, --file=FILE
Obtain patterns from FILE, one per line. The empty file contains zero patterns, and therefore matches nothing.
-G, --basic-regexp
Interpret PATTERN as a basic regular expression (see below). This is the default.
-H, --with-filename
Print the filename for each match.
-h, --no-filename
Suppress the prefixing of filenames on output when multiple files are searched.
--help
Output a brief help message.
-I
Process a binary file as if it did not contain matching data; this is equivalent to the --binary-files=without-match option.
-i, --ignore-case
Ignore case distinctions in both the PATTERN and the input files.
-L, --files-without-match
Suppress normal output; instead print the name of each input file from which no output would normally have been printed. The scanning will stop on the first match.
-l, --files-with-matches
Suppress normal output; instead print the name of each input file from which output would normally have been printed. The scanning will stop on the first match.
-m NUM, --max-count=NUM
Stop reading a file after NUM matching lines. If the input is standard input from a regular file, and NUM matching lines are output, grep ensures that the standard input is positioned to just after the last matching line before exiting, regardless of the presence of trailing context lines. This enables a calling process to resume a search. When grep stops after NUM matching lines, it outputs any trailing context lines. When the -c or --count option is also used, grep does not output a count greater than NUM. When the -v or --invert-match option is also used, grep stops after outputting NUM non-matching lines.
--mmap
If possible, use the mmap(2) system call to read input, instead of the default read(2) system call. In some situations, --mmap yields better performance. However, --mmap can cause undefined behavior (including core dumps) if an input file shrinks while grep is operating, or if an I/O error occurs.
-n, --line-number
Prefix each line of output with the line number within its input file.
-o, --only-matching
Show only the part of a matching line that matches PATTERN.
--label=LABEL
Displays input actually coming from standard input as input coming from file LABEL. This is especially useful for tools like zgrep, e.g. gzip -cd foo.gz |grep --label=foo something
--line-buffered
Use line buffering, it can be a performance penality.
-q, --quiet, --silent
Quiet; do not write anything to standard output. Exit immediately with zero status if any match is found, even if an error was detected. Also see the -s or --no-messages option.
-R, -r, --recursive
Read all files under each directory, recursively; this is equivalent to the -d recurse option.
--include=PATTERN
Recurse in directories only searching file matching PATTERN.
--exclude=PATTERN
Recurse in directories skip file matching PATTERN.
-s, --no-messages
Suppress error messages about nonexistent or unreadable files. Portability note: unlike GNU grep, traditional grep did not conform to POSIX.2 , because traditional grep lacked a -q option and its -s option behaved like GNU grep's -q option. Shell scripts intended to be portable to traditional grep should avoid both -q and -s and should redirect output to /dev/null instead.
-U, --binary
Treat the file(s) as binary. By default, under MS-DOS and MS-Windows, grep guesses the file type by looking at the contents of the first 32KB read from the file. If grep decides the file is a text file, it strips the CR characters from the original file contents (to make regular expressions with ^ and $ work correctly). Specifying -U overrules this guesswork, causing all files to be read and passed to the matching mechanism verbatim; if the file is a text file with CR/LF pairs at the end of each line, this will cause some regular expressions to fail. This option has no effect on platforms other than MS-DOS and MS-Windows.
-u, --unix-byte-offsets
Report Unix-style byte offsets. This switch causes grep to report byte offsets as if the file were Unix-style text file, i.e. with CR characters stripped off. This will produce results identical to running grep on a Unix machine. This option has no effect unless -b option is also used; it has no effect on platforms other than MS-DOS and MS-Windows.
-V, --version
Print the version number of grep to standard error. This version number should be included in all bug reports (see below).
-v, --invert-match
Invert the sense of matching, to select non-matching lines.
-w, --word-regexp
Select only those lines containing matches that form whole words. The test is that the matching substring must either be at the beginning of the line, or preceded by a non-word constituent character. Similarly, it must be either at the end of the line or followed by a non-word constituent character. Word-constituent characters are letters, digits, and the underscore.
-x, --line-regexp
Select only those matches that exactly match the whole line.
-y
Obsolete synonym for -i.
Regular Expressions
A regular expression is a pattern that describes a set of strings. Regular expressions are constructed analogously to arithmetic expressions, by using various operators to combine smaller expressions.
Ubuntu is sort of like this. It's a flavor of Linux and unless you know Linux and what's required for it's care and feeding, then you shouldn't be asking.
It's not a replacement for any flavor of Windows, but its own operating system. While there are many programs that can be substituted for Windows programs, it is likely that you will have to get all new programs.
On the plus side, almost everything having to do with an Linus flavor is free.
On the negative side, almost everything dealing with Linux is arcane and requires a super geek level of knowledge to install and maintain. And you just can't install and forget. Your ongoing tasks will be daunting.
So the questions is: are you a super geek? If the answer is no, then stay with Windows.
Here's a quick example of the type of help available for Linux. This is a partial help page for one of the most basic commands; grep.
If this makes sense, then go for it.
grep(1) - Linux man page
Name
grep, egrep, fgrep - print lines matching a pattern
Synopsis
grep [options] PATTERN [FILE...]
grep [options] [-e PATTERN | -f FILE] [FILE...]
Description
Grep searches the named input FILEs (or standard input if no files are named, or the file name - is given) for lines containing a match to the given PATTERN. By default, grep prints the matching lines.
In addition, two variant programs egrep and fgrep are available. Egrep is the same as grep -E. Fgrep is the same as grep -F.
Options
-A NUM, --after-context=NUM
Print NUM lines of trailing context after matching lines. Places a line containing -- between contiguous groups of matches.
-a, --text
Process a binary file as if it were text; this is equivalent to the --binary-files=text option.
-B NUM, --before-context=NUM
Print NUM lines of leading context before matching lines. Places a line containing -- between contiguous groups of matches.
-C NUM, --context=NUM
Print NUM lines of output context. Places a line containing -- between contiguous groups of matches.
-b, --byte-offset
Print the byte offset within the input file before each line of output.
--binary-files=TYPE
If the first few bytes of a file indicate that the file contains binary data, assume that the file is of type TYPE. By default, TYPE is binary, and grep normally outputs either a one-line message saying that a binary file matches, or no message if there is no match. If TYPE is without-match, grep assumes that a binary file does not match; this is equivalent to the -I option. If TYPE is text, grep processes a binary file as if it were text; this is equivalent to the -a option. Warning: grep --binary-files=text might output binary garbage, which can have nasty side effects if the output is a terminal and if the terminal driver interprets some of it as commands.
--colour[=WHEN], --color[=WHEN]
Surround the matching string with the marker find in GREP_COLOR environment variable. WHEN may be 'never', 'always', or 'auto'
-c, --count
Suppress normal output; instead print a count of matching lines for each input file. With the -v, --invert-match option (see below), count non-matching lines.
-D ACTION, --devices=ACTION
If an input file is a device, FIFO or socket, use ACTION to process it. By default, ACTION is read, which means that devices are read just as if they were ordinary files. If ACTION is skip, devices are silently skipped.
-d ACTION, --directories=ACTION
If an input file is a directory, use ACTION to process it. By default, ACTION is read, which means that directories are read just as if they were ordinary files. If ACTION is skip, directories are silently skipped. If ACTION is recurse, grep reads all files under each directory, recursively; this is equivalent to the -r option.
-E, --extended-regexp
Interpret PATTERN as an extended regular expression (see below).
-e PATTERN, --regexp=PATTERN
Use PATTERN as the pattern; useful to protect patterns beginning with -.
-F, --fixed-strings
Interpret PATTERN as a list of fixed strings, separated by newlines, any of which is to be matched.
-P, --perl-regexp
Interpret PATTERN as a Perl regular expression.
-f FILE, --file=FILE
Obtain patterns from FILE, one per line. The empty file contains zero patterns, and therefore matches nothing.
-G, --basic-regexp
Interpret PATTERN as a basic regular expression (see below). This is the default.
-H, --with-filename
Print the filename for each match.
-h, --no-filename
Suppress the prefixing of filenames on output when multiple files are searched.
--help
Output a brief help message.
-I
Process a binary file as if it did not contain matching data; this is equivalent to the --binary-files=without-match option.
-i, --ignore-case
Ignore case distinctions in both the PATTERN and the input files.
-L, --files-without-match
Suppress normal output; instead print the name of each input file from which no output would normally have been printed. The scanning will stop on the first match.
-l, --files-with-matches
Suppress normal output; instead print the name of each input file from which output would normally have been printed. The scanning will stop on the first match.
-m NUM, --max-count=NUM
Stop reading a file after NUM matching lines. If the input is standard input from a regular file, and NUM matching lines are output, grep ensures that the standard input is positioned to just after the last matching line before exiting, regardless of the presence of trailing context lines. This enables a calling process to resume a search. When grep stops after NUM matching lines, it outputs any trailing context lines. When the -c or --count option is also used, grep does not output a count greater than NUM. When the -v or --invert-match option is also used, grep stops after outputting NUM non-matching lines.
--mmap
If possible, use the mmap(2) system call to read input, instead of the default read(2) system call. In some situations, --mmap yields better performance. However, --mmap can cause undefined behavior (including core dumps) if an input file shrinks while grep is operating, or if an I/O error occurs.
-n, --line-number
Prefix each line of output with the line number within its input file.
-o, --only-matching
Show only the part of a matching line that matches PATTERN.
--label=LABEL
Displays input actually coming from standard input as input coming from file LABEL. This is especially useful for tools like zgrep, e.g. gzip -cd foo.gz |grep --label=foo something
--line-buffered
Use line buffering, it can be a performance penality.
-q, --quiet, --silent
Quiet; do not write anything to standard output. Exit immediately with zero status if any match is found, even if an error was detected. Also see the -s or --no-messages option.
-R, -r, --recursive
Read all files under each directory, recursively; this is equivalent to the -d recurse option.
--include=PATTERN
Recurse in directories only searching file matching PATTERN.
--exclude=PATTERN
Recurse in directories skip file matching PATTERN.
-s, --no-messages
Suppress error messages about nonexistent or unreadable files. Portability note: unlike GNU grep, traditional grep did not conform to POSIX.2 , because traditional grep lacked a -q option and its -s option behaved like GNU grep's -q option. Shell scripts intended to be portable to traditional grep should avoid both -q and -s and should redirect output to /dev/null instead.
-U, --binary
Treat the file(s) as binary. By default, under MS-DOS and MS-Windows, grep guesses the file type by looking at the contents of the first 32KB read from the file. If grep decides the file is a text file, it strips the CR characters from the original file contents (to make regular expressions with ^ and $ work correctly). Specifying -U overrules this guesswork, causing all files to be read and passed to the matching mechanism verbatim; if the file is a text file with CR/LF pairs at the end of each line, this will cause some regular expressions to fail. This option has no effect on platforms other than MS-DOS and MS-Windows.
-u, --unix-byte-offsets
Report Unix-style byte offsets. This switch causes grep to report byte offsets as if the file were Unix-style text file, i.e. with CR characters stripped off. This will produce results identical to running grep on a Unix machine. This option has no effect unless -b option is also used; it has no effect on platforms other than MS-DOS and MS-Windows.
-V, --version
Print the version number of grep to standard error. This version number should be included in all bug reports (see below).
-v, --invert-match
Invert the sense of matching, to select non-matching lines.
-w, --word-regexp
Select only those lines containing matches that form whole words. The test is that the matching substring must either be at the beginning of the line, or preceded by a non-word constituent character. Similarly, it must be either at the end of the line or followed by a non-word constituent character. Word-constituent characters are letters, digits, and the underscore.
-x, --line-regexp
Select only those matches that exactly match the whole line.
-y
Obsolete synonym for -i.
Regular Expressions
A regular expression is a pattern that describes a set of strings. Regular expressions are constructed analogously to arithmetic expressions, by using various operators to combine smaller expressions.
BTW, if you do want to learn more, here is the home page for Ubuntu.
http://www.ubuntu.com/
I have been programing for 35 years and maintain an unmanaged Linux (Fedora) server for my website, but at home I run Win7. No way I want to run Linux at home. More than half of my programs don't have a Linux equivalent.
Some of them claim to do the job but fall short. I am a heavy Photoshop user and the is a Linux program called Gimp that claims to be able to work with Photoshop files. It does but only with the most trivial files. It can't handle files with layers - which is what Photoshop is all about.
There are some good programs but most aren't as good as professional programs on Windows. BTW, most programs are open source, which means that the aren't written but a company, but are a collaborative effort of programers from all over. The design and programmed effort for most is based on what the top Nazi wants; not what the community needs. I have seen several cases where needed additions to programs weren't allowed because the head Nazi for that program didn't want it.
And asking for help. Go only to any Linux forum and ask for some help. Expect to be royally flamed and told over and over in the most unsavory language to RTFM. It isn't like the friendly Grumble where people actually like to help others. It is a world of anonymous cowards that like to flaunt their geekdoom and put down anyone everyone else.
Image a world inhabited entirely by Sheldons (Big Bang Theory); whether they really are that smart or not, and you have the Linux world.
http://www.ubuntu.com/
I have been programing for 35 years and maintain an unmanaged Linux (Fedora) server for my website, but at home I run Win7. No way I want to run Linux at home. More than half of my programs don't have a Linux equivalent.
Some of them claim to do the job but fall short. I am a heavy Photoshop user and the is a Linux program called Gimp that claims to be able to work with Photoshop files. It does but only with the most trivial files. It can't handle files with layers - which is what Photoshop is all about.
There are some good programs but most aren't as good as professional programs on Windows. BTW, most programs are open source, which means that the aren't written but a company, but are a collaborative effort of programers from all over. The design and programmed effort for most is based on what the top Nazi wants; not what the community needs. I have seen several cases where needed additions to programs weren't allowed because the head Nazi for that program didn't want it.
And asking for help. Go only to any Linux forum and ask for some help. Expect to be royally flamed and told over and over in the most unsavory language to RTFM. It isn't like the friendly Grumble where people actually like to help others. It is a world of anonymous cowards that like to flaunt their geekdoom and put down anyone everyone else.
Image a world inhabited entirely by Sheldons (Big Bang Theory); whether they really are that smart or not, and you have the Linux world.
MitchelC
MGF, Master Grumble Framer
Thanks for the info. I will download it and install it today.
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JUST KIDDIN'! I will stick to WinXP. lol
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JUST KIDDIN'! I will stick to WinXP. lol
I have it on one of my machines at home, but don't use it very often. If you're just browsing the web and doing some basic stuff, it's fine. If you plan to use software, you'll have a hard time finding many things that run on it. There is no POS software that runs on it, as far as I know, for example.
Like any other operating system, you have to patch it regularly so you don't get exploited or infected.
I don't suggest it as a replacement for XP, in a business environment, unless your software needs are met. You can TRY IT if you want, by burning that version that boots FROM a dvd. You can put the DVD in and boot right from the DVD, rather than overwriting your hard drive operating system and erasing XP.
The graphic user interface has been designed to look very similar, and it includes many basic network testing utilities, web browser, email, etc.
Mike
Like any other operating system, you have to patch it regularly so you don't get exploited or infected.
I don't suggest it as a replacement for XP, in a business environment, unless your software needs are met. You can TRY IT if you want, by burning that version that boots FROM a dvd. You can put the DVD in and boot right from the DVD, rather than overwriting your hard drive operating system and erasing XP.
The graphic user interface has been designed to look very similar, and it includes many basic network testing utilities, web browser, email, etc.
Mike
Jerry Ervin
PFG, Picture Framing God
One of the problems I have always had when playing around with Linux is finding drivers for the hardware I was using.
Sometimes the only work around is to replace hardware with something you can get a driver for or live without, say a sound card, or live with low quality graphics...
Just sayin'
Sometimes the only work around is to replace hardware with something you can get a driver for or live without, say a sound card, or live with low quality graphics...
Just sayin'
B
BusterBart
Guest
Ubuntu could be copied to a CD (or even a USB flash drive) and can be made to reboot from either (very easy actually).
This is helpful when your XP dies on you and you need to access you hard drive.
Also, it comes with everything you need (Windows like interface) to, amongst other things, mange your files, connect to the internet, etc. And all that is running from the CD or USB drive. No need to install it or replace Windows XP.
I keep mine handy just in case.
Here's more info and where to download: http://www.ubuntu.com/desktop/get-ubuntu/download
This is helpful when your XP dies on you and you need to access you hard drive.
Also, it comes with everything you need (Windows like interface) to, amongst other things, mange your files, connect to the internet, etc. And all that is running from the CD or USB drive. No need to install it or replace Windows XP.
I keep mine handy just in case.
Here's more info and where to download: http://www.ubuntu.com/desktop/get-ubuntu/download
As another example of what the wacky world of Open Source software can be like, I got an email today about a new javscript checker called JSHint, which is a branch of a popular program called JSLint.
The authors of JSHint offered these words for why they have developed JSHint, which is a branch off of JSLint (with open source you can do this).
The tool is very similar to JSLint, but is designed to be more customizable and community-oriented.
The JSHint Web site explains, "The most important difference is that JSHint is developed and supported by the JavaScript developer community and not by one very opinionated person."
Irish elaborates on the differences in a comment on Hacker News:
JSLint has gotten increasingly more opinionated in the past few months.. For example, the standard for loop:
`for (var i = 0, len = arr.length; i < len; i++) { ... `
will now error out in JSLint.
A lot of these sorts of changes don't have flags to customize, so that's something that JSHint aims to fix. Start with some great defaults, and allow them to be customized. Heck, we even save your checkbox preferences for you (via localStorage).
Crock's responses to people asking for changes on the mailing list have also been a little disappointing:
"Your sadly pathetic bleatings are harshing my mellow." http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/jslint_com/message/1688
On the github project, he's refused CommonJS convention, NodeJS export support, and Rhino compat -- all quite easy to do. So until Crock's primary JSLint is a bit more friendly to customizability and different environments, JSHint will fulfill those needs.
I use JSLint for checking my server JavaScript but have slowed using it because of its inability to overlook what you see as errors, as opposed to what the author thinks. Since JSHint will be customizable, I will move over to it.
And from the JSLint website.
WARNING: JSLint will hurt your feelings.
The authors of JSHint offered these words for why they have developed JSHint, which is a branch off of JSLint (with open source you can do this).
The tool is very similar to JSLint, but is designed to be more customizable and community-oriented.
The JSHint Web site explains, "The most important difference is that JSHint is developed and supported by the JavaScript developer community and not by one very opinionated person."
Irish elaborates on the differences in a comment on Hacker News:
JSLint has gotten increasingly more opinionated in the past few months.. For example, the standard for loop:
`for (var i = 0, len = arr.length; i < len; i++) { ... `
will now error out in JSLint.
A lot of these sorts of changes don't have flags to customize, so that's something that JSHint aims to fix. Start with some great defaults, and allow them to be customized. Heck, we even save your checkbox preferences for you (via localStorage).
Crock's responses to people asking for changes on the mailing list have also been a little disappointing:
"Your sadly pathetic bleatings are harshing my mellow." http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/jslint_com/message/1688
On the github project, he's refused CommonJS convention, NodeJS export support, and Rhino compat -- all quite easy to do. So until Crock's primary JSLint is a bit more friendly to customizability and different environments, JSHint will fulfill those needs.
I use JSLint for checking my server JavaScript but have slowed using it because of its inability to overlook what you see as errors, as opposed to what the author thinks. Since JSHint will be customizable, I will move over to it.
And from the JSLint website.
WARNING: JSLint will hurt your feelings.
Steve Collins
SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer
A way to play with it without switching
Microsoft puts out a free virtualization product called Virtual PC that allows you to install and run other OS's; I've used it in the past to host older versions of Windows and DOS on an XP machine (back when I was software engineer) but preferred a similar product called VMWare Server, which I did use to host various flavors of Linux, including Ubuntu.
At the time I did all that because the code I worked on had to behave on multiple OS versions, so I would test as best I could on multiple environments before checkins. The alternative was to either punt or fill my office with hardware.
Anyway, you can get VMWare Server for free here: http://www.vmware.com/products/server/. Download & install it. Then install Ubuntu in VMWare Server. You can then play with it to your heart's content without committing yourself to a switch.
I keep a copy running here to keep my Unix skills from rusting. I hope to never deal with it for a living again, but you never know.
Microsoft puts out a free virtualization product called Virtual PC that allows you to install and run other OS's; I've used it in the past to host older versions of Windows and DOS on an XP machine (back when I was software engineer) but preferred a similar product called VMWare Server, which I did use to host various flavors of Linux, including Ubuntu.
At the time I did all that because the code I worked on had to behave on multiple OS versions, so I would test as best I could on multiple environments before checkins. The alternative was to either punt or fill my office with hardware.
Anyway, you can get VMWare Server for free here: http://www.vmware.com/products/server/. Download & install it. Then install Ubuntu in VMWare Server. You can then play with it to your heart's content without committing yourself to a switch.
I keep a copy running here to keep my Unix skills from rusting. I hope to never deal with it for a living again, but you never know.