Tru Vue Anti-reflective Glass versus Museum glass

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kuluchicken

kuluchicken

MGF, Master Grumble Framer
Joined
Apr 2, 2012
Posts
564
Loc
Auckland, New Zealand
I had a look of samples of both of the above and can't see why the museum glass is more expensive and considered superior.

The samples were slightly smudged and full of dust, so that may be why I couldn't see any difference.

I've used the museum glass, but never the Anti-reflective.

Please could you guys tell me why the Museum Glass is superior?
 
The AR (anti-reflective) has a lower UV blocking capability.
It has a similar anti-reflective look to Museum glass, but I believe it is about 20% less effective at blocking UV.
Museum is at about 99% UV, AR is at about 79% UV blocking.
We occasionally use AR with one or two clients, but we mainly use Conservation Clear or Museum.
The AR is kind of an "in-between" product.
 
If UV is not an issue, Tru-Vue's Ultra-Vue is anti-reflective, water white, less likely to scratch, and much cheaper if you take advantage of the promotional pricing that end August 31. LJ is one distributor participating in the promotion.
 
As noted above, Museum Glass has the 99% UV filtering coating on one side, so its advantage is that it meets the ISO standard for UV protection in preservation framing. No other single-layer, optically-coated glass meets the preservation standard, but several manufacturers' laminated glass products do.

AR Glass has exactly the same 2.5 mm substrate and optical coatings as Museum Glass, but not the UV coating. Ultra Vue is water-white 2.0 mm with the same optical coatings, but not the UV coating.
 
Cool, thanks so much everyone.

I was under the impression that it had the same UV protection as Museum Glass and that is what confused me. I couldn't visually see a difference and the sales person at LJ couldn't tell me the difference.

The price difference makes sense now, thanks so much for the info.
 
kuluchicken said:
Cool, thanks so much everyone.

I was under the impression that it had the same UV protection as Museum Glass and that is what confused me. I couldn't visually see a difference and the sales person at LJ couldn't tell me the difference.

The price difference makes sense now, thanks so much for the info.
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It's been bothering me what I said about LJ. I realized that my statement could very easily be misconstrued and just felt it fair to explain what really happened. They have been most helpful to me and their service is excellent in NZ, so I would hate to send out the wrong impression about them.

I was specifically asking about the visual difference between the two as well as the price difference. I presumed that all True Vue's Glass had UV protection, so I obviously never asked whether the Anti-reflective glass had UV protection, just what the visual difference was. So in all fairness the above statement is pretty unfair to them.

Just thought I'd put it out there. I realize that this is a public forum and one needs to be honest and fair.
 
The UV coating in TV glass has a brownish tint in it to aid in color correction since the glass has a green tint. Water white or low iron glass does not have a green tint to it the way most framing glass has.
 
Jim Miller said:
AR Glass has exactly the same 2.5 mm substrate and optical coatings as Museum Glass, but not the UV coating. Ultra Vue is water-white 2.0 mm with the same optical coatings, but not the UV coating.
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The Don-Mar rep was in yesterday and had a sample of Ultra-Vue which he was pushing.

He indicated that Ultra-View was a step above AR but below Museum in that it had 65% UV protection rather than the 97-99% of Museum. I didn’t ask, but I assumed that if it had 65% UV protection, it would have a plastic film (?) like Museum.

I was only half paying attention but he also mentioned another type of glass that appeared to almost be tempered. He claimed that is was virtually indestructible. This glass is, therefore, difficult to cut and suggested that framers have it sized and cut at the distributor.
 
Bill Henry- said:
... I assumed that if it had 65% UV protection, it would have a plastic film (?) like Museum.
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Of course, all glazing products block some ultraviolet radiation, but the protection is limited. Ordinary glass blocks about 45% of UV radiation.

The optical coatings on all anti-reflective glass products are reflective, so the wavelength-blocking performance diminishes as the angle of incidence changes from perpendicular. That is, the UV radiation wavelengths hitting the glass at 90-degrees may be blocked at a rate of, say, 80% or better. But UV radiation hitting the glass at 30-degrees may be blocked at a rate of, say, 60% or worse. I'm guessing at these percentages, and they vary among the products, but the exact numbers really do not matter. The point is that none of the anti-reflection, optical coatings provide UV-blocking performance suitable for preservation framing, according to the 97%-or-better ISO standard for preservation.

The only way to achieve UV-blocking that meets the ISO standard for preservation is to use a separate coating dedicated to the purpose. Only one manufacturer makes single-layer glass products with a dedicated UV-blocking coating, but several brands of laminated glass products use dedicated UV-blocking technology with the adhesive between the layers.

When preservation does not matter, all of this is moot.

I was only half paying attention but he also mentioned another type of glass that appeared to almost be tempered. He claimed that is was virtually indestructible. This glass is, therefore, difficult to cut and suggested that framers have it sized and cut at the distributor.
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Could that be the new laminated glass product?
 
Jim Miller said:
The optical coatings on all anti-reflective glass products are reflective, so the wavelength-blocking performance diminishes as the angle of incidence changes from perpendicular. That is, the UV radiation wavelengths hitting the glass at 90-degrees may be blocked at a rate of, say, 80% or better. But UV radiation hitting the glass at 30-degrees may be blocked at a rate of, say, 60% or worse. I'm guessing at these percentages, and they vary among the products, but the exact numbers really do not matter. The point is that none of the anti-reflection, optical coatings provide UV-blocking performance suitable for preservation framing, according to the 97%-or-better ISO standard for preservation.

The only way to achieve UV-blocking that meets the ISO standard for preservation is to use a separate coating dedicated to the purpose. Only one manufacturer makes single-layer glass products with a dedicated UV-blocking coating, but several brands of laminated glass products use dedicated UV-blocking technology with the adhesive between the layers.
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jim

this has me confused

are you saying that the tru vue product isnt included in the products described in the first paragraph?

i assume thats what you mean but the first papragraph sounds like description for all UV blocking if that makes sense
 
stcstc said:
jim

this has me confused
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Now I'm confused, too.

are you saying that the tru vue product isnt included in the products described in the first paragraph?
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Which Tru Vue product are you referring to?

The best protection from UV radiation comes from a dedicated UV-filtering coating, and not from any optical coating. Only Tru Vue "Conservation" glass products (Museum Glass, Conservation Clear, Conservation Reflection Control) have that dedicated coating. All others, including Ultra Vue and AR Glass, do not.
 
stcstc said:
its the terms than had me confused, between optically coated and uv coating
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The dedicated UV-filtering coating and the optical coatings are completely different technologies. Conservation Clear has only the UV filtering coating (one side). AR Glass (2.5 mm color-corrected); Ultra Vue and all other single-layer, anti-reflection glass brands (2 mm water-white) have only the optical coatings (both sides). Museum Glass has optical coatings on both sides, plus the UV filtering coating on one side.

OK, is it clearer now?
:icon9::faintthud:
 
OK, I got in some cases of the UltraVue. Now as my scraps and cutoffs are starting to accumulate I gotta ask, how do you tell the difference between a piece of UltraVue and a piece of MG? Telling the difference between CC and MG is pretty straightforward, usually. If you can see through it it is MG :)

Does TruVue sell a UV indicator paper where a UV flashlight would light up when shown through the UV (Really? Initials for a 65% UV blocking glass are UV? ;) Should we call it UVue?) Got my brain working, maybe the white matboard and a UV flash will do the trick....
 
Tru Vue has a kit similar to what you described that includes a small fluorescent black light. I think they will send it to you free, and you can order it from their web site.
:cool: Rick
 
Look at the edge of the glass and the Ultra Vue will be white or near clear and the Museum will have a green/brown tint to it.
 
Thanks Jeff. I would say from the sides the MG looks like regular ConClear and the UVue is greenish. I would not call it "clear" or white yet but definitely better. And definitely a detectable difference from the sides.
 
Bob Doyle said:
OK, I got in some cases of the UltraVue. Now as my scraps and cutoffs are starting to accumulate I gotta ask, how do you tell the difference between a piece of UltraVue and a piece of MG? Telling the difference between CC and MG is pretty straightforward, usually. If you can see through it it is MG :)
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UltaVue will not scratch...MG glass will

also, place them side by side on a white mat.
UltraVue will be "color-less"; ARF and MG will show a tint to the mat

hope that helps too
 
Bob Doyle said:
ConClear and the UVue is greenish. I would not call it "clear" or white yet but definitely better.
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If you have a piece of standard clear glass the Ultra will look much whiter and more clear. Ultra is the Water White or low iron glass and the iron is what gives glass the green tint and brown tint is added for color correction on coated TV products. All of the other TV products are standard glass and then coated or left as is for premium clear.
 
Speaking of (premium) glass and tint and color shifting I opened a frame I did back around 2002 using conclear. It was so much greener than the glass they are using at TV today. It is nice to see that TV changes as the glasses and materials get better. I still have a few pieces/shards of DenGlas' Water White in a box. That was some brittle glass to score. And thin, thinner than the 2 mm lites.

What was that glass we had to score through the plastic film? Was that just a UV glass or was it supposed to be water white? I vaguely remember a bluish hue from the sides of that one.

A customer brought in a frame that she got for $5 at a BB. Couldn't believe what I was charging. We picked out a really white mat put it under her glass and it was almost green :) Made Bainbridges 8260 look like Peterboro's A440 ;) Gotta say it is things like that that make me glad we have companies like TV selling quality glass.
 
Confused? Oh, yes. Not working with glazing much at all, but having been doing watercolors of late, at some point I'd like to start framing them. Are there charts available listing the various levels of protection? Charts showing the pros and cons of the different choices, not least of which is price? It seems there are competing brands, different levels of protection, different levels of durability (scratching), different construction, coating, film overlays, laminated, and different price levels. :confused:
 
Bron said:
Confused? Oh, yes...
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Picture framing glass is available with three finishes:
1. Plain, no surface treatment
2. Non-glare, etched surface on one or both sides
3. Anti-reflection, optically coated

All three types are available with, or without, a coating to block 99% of UV radiation.
1. Plain - Premium Clear and Conservation Clear
2. Non-glare - Reflection Control and Conservation Reflection Control
3. Anti-reflection, optically coated - AR Glass and Museum Glass

All of the above choices are available in 2.5 mm thickness from most framing distributors. In addition, 2 mm water-white glass is available with optical coatings, such as Ultra-Vue (Tru Vue) and ArtGlass (GroGlass). These optically coated glass products do not have a separate UV filter. They block more UV radiation than ordinary glass, but do not meet the ISO standard of 97% or better UV blocking for preservation framing.

Note that the only way to meet the preservation framing standard of 97% or better UV filtering is to use a separate, absorptive coating dedicated to that purpose. The optical coatings from all makers are reflective and their effectiveness diminishes as the angle of incidence increases, which is why none of them can meet the preservation standard for UV filtering.

Don't be confused about the various percentages of UV filtering. There are only two choices that matter: preservation (97% or better UV filtering) and non-preservation (less than 97% UV filtering).

I would not suggest buying glass only on price, because the more-costly choices offer excellent value when their features are useful. To decide which glass product is best for your purpose, I suggest first deciding whether you want UV filtering to meet the preservation standard, or not. Then, select the finish you want. After that, shop for the best price.
 
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