The difference between Black and White

Marc Lizer

SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer
Joined
Jun 28, 1999
Posts
1,545
Loc
North Hollywood, CA
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comments?
 
According to theory, surrounding the print with a dark may should emphasize the light areas in the photo. The theory's not working in this case. Perhaps because the dark mat is gray rather than black? I like the white one.

Kit
 
Well, I gotta go out on a limb (probably by my self), but I like the darker one. For me, the white one is too stark. If I close my eyes and then open them, the white jumps out at me before I see the photo.

With the darker one, her leg and hand are the first thing I see. And is it my computer, or is there something red behind her leg? I don't see it at all with the white mat.

Betty
 
I also like the darker Mat .I think it is more strikeing ( I also have a personal problem with mats haveing to be WHITE). However i think a nice wide contemporary silver frame and maybe a Fillet would be a better choice. You know like the Models LJ offered for sale. I really Liked what they did and it's very similar to this.
I know the idea isn't original but it definetly LOOKS GREAT with dark black and white Photos .
BUDDY
 
I like both of them.
Although I love the "classic" look of white mats and black frames, and variations on that theme.
I suppose it would depend on the "look" you wanted.
And, Marc, the photo is quite lovely... whassa story on it?
-e
 
Originally posted by B. Newman:
Well, I gotta go out on a limb (probably by my self), but I like the darker one. For me, the white one is too stark. If I close my eyes and then open them, the white jumps out at me before I see the photo.

<font color=indianred>I agree. I have never liked the stark white mat/black metal frame combo. White is for refrigerators, IMHO. I do many b/w images with a combo of Artique 4849 Nickel for a top mat, Artique 4833 Graphite underneath, a fillet between the 2 mats of LJ 147974 Pewter Manhattan, and to top it off, a frame of either 237974 or 437974 Pewter Manhattan depending on the size of the image. This combination stays away from the stark black or white mats and looks smashing on most anything in black/white or shades thereof.</font>

With the darker one, her leg and hand are the first thing I see. And is it my computer, or is there something red behind her leg? I don't see it at all with the white mat.

<font color =indianred>Betty, I believe that is a reflection of Marc's arm just above and below the model's leg. Either that or he is doing a horizontal pirouette. ;) Part of the difference in the way these 2 photos appear is in the amount of light in each image. The bottom photo has a lighter overall appearance which would make everything in the image appear lighter. (Compare the backgrounds behind the frame on each photo).</font>
Framerguy
 
Just to add a word or two here:

I take the pix with the frame laying on the ground, face up, and hold the camera above it. Hence the funny pose for my arms.

As for the blacks and whites. It is Crescent 6989. A rather black black. It is metering and reflection.

The black does actually look better in person. You do see the hip and hand first.
 
Marc,

I am a new framer. So you will have to forgive me for asking this.

Why did you use a single mat?

Would a black mat/white mat combo have
balanced the black to white ratio?

Both mats are good/bad but neither complements
the picture entirely.

Lorrie

***********************************************

Originally posted by Marc Lizer:
Just to add a word or two here:

I take the pix with the frame laying on the ground, face up, and hold the camera above it. Hence the funny pose for my arms.

As for the blacks and whites. It is Crescent 6989. A rather black black. It is metering and reflection.

The black does actually look better in person. You do see the hip and hand first.
:eek:
 
Originally posted by Marc Lizer:
I take the pix with the frame laying on the ground, face up, and hold the camera above it. Hence the funny pose for my arms..
Duh! I went back a day or two later and could actually see that! Don't know what I was thinking.

The black does actually look better in person. You do see the hip and hand first.
Whew! I feel better!

Betty
 
The second photo has a bit of a color shift making the mat appear gray-blue. Also, the light is reflecting a bit more off the glass causing a milkiness to the image. When you put something with a "black" mat under bright lights you quickly find that there are no mats black enough. They all show up as dark gray. This is a problem we have all the time in photographic competitions. In order to make an image "pop" so the judges score it well, we often use dark mats on them but blacks usually look dull under the bright competition lights. Many photographers now use "flash paper", which is just a piece of photo graphic paper exposed to light and processed. It produces a true, dark glossy black which looks very striking when mounted to a mat under or over the photo. I do think a black mat makes the photo stand out more.
 
My two cents: I think the mat is way too small. My eyes "jump" from frame to photo without "resting" on the mat. therefore, I'd double at least the mat size.

I'd also try the 8-ply Cresent 621574--Dawn Gray--gray outer and blackcore inner. Mix it with Nielsen 34-179. Very skinny and boxy contemporary metal. Am doing four photos in this style for acustomer.

Too bad my Wizard doesn't cut 8-ply. Another handjob ;) ;)
 
My personal preference for this print would be the black mat. But, sometimes, you have to use white, either the customer wants it, or it's going in a light room, and being a big black rectangle wouldn't work. Here's an idea for softening the effect of a stark white mat on a dark BW photo.

I would like to use a double mat, with white grey-core on top, and white black-core on the bottom. This adds a nice french mat effect, while giving a little transition between the white and black. I don't really like to use a grey mat, grey things just look old and dusty to me. If I must use grey, I try to go with a suede. The richness of color and texture accents the richness of a good photo. A silvery grey suede with a black core would be smashing on this one!
 
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