That's IT!!

[Sherry Lee]

Not long ago there was a discssion about doing jobs with customers 'antique' frames.....you know, the corners are marginal, the wood is splitting and the finish is falling off even when you hold it with gloves.

Well, last night, Jay Leno and I finished four such pieces (not quite in that shape, but close). Today my goal is to raise my prices on 'take downs/cleaning' and 'refits'! It will cost about the same as new moulding.....if not more!! You betcha!

These are SO much more work than making a new frame - and I can't tell you how many times I wash my hands/arms while doing such projects. UGH!

Just thought I'd share my feelings.

 

[J Phipps TN]

I hate those things. I've almost cryed when I see a customer pulling them out of their car.

 

[Paul N]

We have to make people understand that there is more labor and eventually it will cost as much, if not more, than a new frame!

I had the same thing yesterday (customer wanted to stack TWO older frames to frame a piece!).

I sold her a CC frame instead, She was happier. But this was a young woman and she saw the light. Older folks are more stubborn.

 

[Val]

I've found that the "older" folks are sentimentally attached to these frames. Many times, it isn't the money, it's that "I remember this hanging on my mother's wall, and I want to keep it just as I remember it". Or "My late husband brought this home to me for our first anniversary, and..."...you get the idea.

It's hard to convince them to let go of their memories, just because it's a pain for us to save the frame.

I do agree with Sherry, that we're in business here, much of our business being that of preserving memories. And I haven't figured out yet how not to give away our time and materials (mostly time!) doing that! Many times I've priced accordingly, and then watched a person walk away with a disappointed face, not able to afford what I can't afford not to charge!

It's a dillemma, and I'm trying to learn that business is business is business, and if I keep giving away my time by undercharging for the sake of sentimentality, I'll be out of that business before long. They'll still have their precious rotten old frames and I'll have splinters, a rash, and an unemployment check!

What I'm learning is that if we can finally convince them that it isn't the frame that's so precious, but what's in it, and making a new one that looks vintage, the memories will still be there, and will be protected for future generations to tell the "when Grampa gave Gramma, this picture" stories.

I have one in the shop now that the frame is falling apart, rotten, etc, and found a brand new moulding that looks nearly identical to it, and have finally convinced the owner to replace it. I priced the repair to where it cost about the same as the new frame (for once!), but it's taken awhile.

 

[Lori Drugan]

The least amount we will charge for one of those projects is the regular labor charge for that size. If I see the job is going to be "one of those", I tell the customer we may have to revert to an hourly charge. If they really want it done, they won't object. I certainly don't need a massive headache without any compensation.

Lori

 

[BILL WARD]

I've been 'trying' to develope the habit of looking them straight in the eye and saying "my shop rates for this type endeavor start at $30/hour and go up with the difficulty &/or the unexpected problems--1 hour minimum"
I've had 1-2 takers & a like amount of rejects...most people seem to already understand the time=$$ concept. I also am trying to cultivate the " I wont take this job for any anount of $$ but I will direct you to a conservator" if it's really BAD/basket case

 

[Twin2]

Fortunately, I haven't had many of those 'old' frames to refurbish. They certainly can take a lot longer to fix up than starting from scratch. I agree with Val, that many people are sentimentally attached to their old frame and have a hard time parting with it.

I used to do a lot of sewing and I much rather sew a piece of new clothing from start to finish than alter an existing one - same sentiments with framing

 

[MarkyW]

Originally posted by Val:
They'll still have their precious rotten old frames and I'll have splinters, a rash, and an unemployment check!

Not quite, Val. You've now joined the ranks of the self-employed, which means that you don't get the 'protection' of an unemployment check, like when you were an employee, if business goes bad.

Not necessarily just in regards to reusing older frames, but figuring out what to charge for anything that will take extra work (such as mounting various items for a shadowbox) where it's not a category in the POS and you're not sure exactly how much time it is going to take to do. And also understanding the customer's view that I myself wouldn't want to leave something for someone to work on with an open ended price ($30/hour X however long it takes)

One thing that I was just thinking about writing a post about that roughly fits in with this is: I was wondering if anyone charges extra when you have to work with a piece that has alot of black in the picture (or mat). I just finished framing a photo portrait whose background had a large area of black and spent quite a bit of time getting all the little specks off of it. And of course once you get it in the frame you find some more specks. Everytime I do something like this I tell myself I should add a 'dark color' surcharge.

 

[Val]

Originally posted by MarkyW:
]Not quite, Val. You've now joined the ranks of the self-employed, which means that you don't get the 'protection' of an unemployment check


Oh yeah, I keep forgetting about that! Even more important to price accordingly!!!

I used to love restoring ratty old frames, but since I discovered the Time-is-$$ concept, I'm becoming less sentimental all the time, and have even been known to throw away one or two of my own lately!! And it's time to do Summer Cleaning (I was laid up for Spring!), so maybe I'll have even less sentimentality, hence fewer ratty old frames!
Maybe there's hope yet for this Grandaughter of Maudie-the-Packrat!

 

[David Waldmann]

Originally posted by MarkyW:
I was wondering if anyone charges extra when you have to work with a piece that has alot of black in the picture (or mat). I just finished framing a photo portrait whose background had a large area of black and spent quite a bit of time getting all the little specks off of it.

I don't know anything about the details, but a customer I visited the other day was mentioning some sort of static dissapative device that makes keeping dust out of the package a lot easier.