Sharpening Chopper Blades

Val

PFG, Picture Framing God
Joined
Nov 21, 2005
Posts
6,729
Loc
Carson City, Nevada
My Morso has been eating moulding lately. Researched all the could-be problems here, did the silicone, did the matbd against the fence, adjusted everything that can be adjusted, still chewing up the back. I finally took the blades off, and on very close inspection, found a nick in one blade toward the front point.

Okay, so I found the spare set, with a note on the box "Need sharpening, changed July 2000"...!!! And that set has the same nick on the same place.

I don't have a clue where the previous owner had them sharpened. I had a bad experience in my first shop with sharpening, and went thru 2 sets of blades (guy sharpened them backwards!!) before I found a good one, but that was years ago and many miles away.

I would like to find someone local, but reputable and with experience sharpening these things, and get them done soon. Who do I call, what do I ask and what do I look for? The other shops in the area only have saws, except one and I'm sure he won't divulge any "secrets", he's not very nice. I may have to send them away. Help quick! I have chopping to do!
 
I would suggest calling Ultramitre, they do an excellent job of sharpening all of our blades. You have to ship them the blades but the turnaround time is fairly quick.
 
Val, first of all they will need to be Hollow Ground. Check with some of your local saw sharpening services or machine shops. Also try contacting some of your suppliers they may know someone. Good luck!!!!!
 
Val,
Give Wilbers Knife World a call, Rick from

Great Edges Sharpening Service in Reno gives him a nod as the only flat grinder for guillotine and 16" planer blades.

As to the whole Hollow Ground vs. Flat Ground controversy.... I ain't gonna get into that because I have done it both ways.. It all is whether the grinder does his job, and the grind better come back HONED to a mirror for my shop.


Wilburs Knife World
4601 Goni Rd
Carson City, NV 89706-0619
(775) 884-4807
 
I have a box just like that; only the date is changed....except I am sure they are much sharper than the pair I am using now. Anxiously await info on an east coast sharpener.

nancy
 
Call a cabinet shop or a company that sells lawnmowers or maybe go into a WoodCrafters if you have one in the area...and ask them who locally sharpens blades. I do love doing it locally. They charge me $5 a set and I get them the next day. I have my sets sharpened at least once a month so every other week I have new blades.
 
Thanks Baer, but Wilbur didn't know what I was talking about. Said he's only set up to do kitchen cutlery and that my blades (he thinks) would probably "eat up his machine".

I did find out that Acme Saw in Reno is who most around here go to, so I'll call there and hope I can find someone going up that way, if not ship overnight and ship back overnight.

I started to ask what the difference between flat ground and hollow ground is (I forgot that I remember what it is now) and after a Grumble search, found this great explanation and more controversy, since Inquiring Minds (right Clive?) might want to know:
Flat vs hollow grround
 
Send them to TechMark, the US importer of Morso. They will do them right, guaranteed.

Note: if they are not Morso brand, or have not been hollow ground, there will be an extra charge but it will be worth every penny.
 
We send them as David does, and get a perfect result every time. Since we purchased the saw system, we only use the chopper for Fillets.

This was also discussed in a Grumble Poll 6 months ago

If you have a chopper, how do you have the knives/blades sharpened? 1/2006

39% Hollow Ground
30% Flat Ground
28% I dont know!
03% Other (please see thread)

http://www.custompictureframing.com/poll_results.htm
 
I contacted TechMark and are waiting for their reply.
Also found out that many of the cabinet shops here use a mobil sharpening service that sharpens their guillotine blades to their satisfaction, and they happen to be coming here today, so I'm also waiting to hear from them. I may have one set done by them now, see how they do, and then try TechMark for the next set.

Thanks everyone. I love this place!
 
I have just finished reading the previous thread on flat ground and hollow ground and there is one thing no one mentioned. A hollow ground blade will have much less physical resistance to the chop as it moves thru the wood. The only part of the wood preassuring the blade is the sharp edge where you have constant preasure through the whole cut with smoth ground>
 
Ray, the only criticle part of the whole blade is the support directly behind the micro edge of the cut... The more support, the longer the micro edge lasts, and the more shock dispersed during the cut.

Don't really worry about it much, this topic has caused friendships among woodworkers to desolve. It's a wedge issue.
 
Chrish04, where is Ultramitre, do you have their #?
Mobile sharpening service never showed. InfoTech didn't e-mail back, so I will call tomorrow and hopefully get a human and their shipping address. And try to find someone going to Reno. Or ship a set to them overnight (I can't chop at all now, blades are really shredding the moulding, just a waste)

I used to always have the spare set sharpened and ready to go. I just assumed the last guy...ah, never mind. I learned something else today....never assume. And don't put off....well, you know. And I have to find out what's causing that nick in the same place on both sets of blades. Challenges!
icon45.gif


Denny, you paying attention? If you have a chopper, check your spare blades now!
 
Val,

(We must stop meeting this way. My wife wants to know who I'm writing to.)

If both sets of blades are nicked in the same place my bet would be the left rabbit support is catching under the blade.

When I purchased my shop the blades were being sharpened by a local company for $15.00. The blades on the machine looked as though someone had taken a coarse file to them. I called the company and asked if they were grinding them flat or hollow. They had no idea what I was talking about! My confidence level was not high at that point.

After Grumble searching I called TechMark. What great people. Very knowledgeable and very helpful. My chopper is actually a Hansen, not a Morso. No problem. The blades have probably been used as ploughshares. No problem. The styrofoam box is almost non-existant. No problem.

Off they went. Came back quickly looking like a mirror. Cut like a hot knike through butter.

Spend the extra $20.00 and GET THE WOODEN BOX.

Clive.
 
Quote by Me: "InfoTech didn't e-mail back..."

Oops, I meant TechMark (Who the heck is InfoTech??) It was late, long day. Early morning, this...woke up at 3 when husband left for work, couldn't sleep (that's another thread..cherry juice!), decided what the hey, came here, it's 4:45 a.m., already have 4 finished!)

Clive (hi to your wife, I'm harmless, and who has time to fool around anyway??), I will call TechMark this morning, thanks for the testimony. And I will check the rabbet supports, then figure out how to adjust that, something's catching somewhere! First I've heard of that one. Learning, learning!

What wooden box? From TechMark?
 
Val I was going to suggest tha you do just whatClive suggested ,only I would look for any thing that may be even faintly comming in contact with the cutting edge at the point of that reoccuring nick. It sounds very much like something is out of alignm,ent and evenif very slight with cotinual use it can make a bog differance not to mention if you cut a harder wood the thrust made change the amount of contact.

It is TOO much of a coincidence that both blades have the identical nick in the same place .Any imperfection (nick or even a rolled edge that wasn't stropped) will cause a bad cut.

I have never had a problem with Tech-Mark as far as getting information. If you do a search ( even before 2004) you will find a few references to them. But especially one from John ranes where I think their addresss,phone number and even a contact person was listed. They were and still are ( unless something has changed0 the Official Moroso Technical representitive here in the USA. I think John even spoke to the true Owner ( I can't remeber Her name) and she gave recommendations about the blades and then He suggested Tech-Mark.

But it sure sounds like something is hitting the blades and util you correct that you willbe sharpennig blades for nothing regardless of who are where.
BUDDY

PS Mike Labbe posted these that may help:

Here are some other previous threads that may contain some gems:

http://www.thegrumble.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=006915

http://www.thegrumble.com/cgibin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=000669

http://www.thegrumble.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=001700

http://www.thegrumble.com/cgibin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=005603

http://www.thegrumble.com/cgibin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=006349

This is one of John's first comments about Morso owner's thoughts.

John Ranes II, CPF, GCF

SGF Supreme Grumbler
Member # 309

posted 08-14-2000 10:48 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Interesting,
This discussion ran it's course on the PPFA On line Exchange a few months ago. The concept made sense, but when I went to check my own blades (22 years with a Morso), I found that they are NOT Hollow-ground, BUT they've been cutting just fine. ? ? ? ?

Wanting the "Whole" story, I stopped by to talk with Tove Peterson, owner of Morso during the Birmingham Spring Fair, back in February. Here's what I learned.........

The Hollow grind is done on such a large wheel that it is very subtle, and difficult to see. It does improve things, but only slightly over a straight grind (IF IT IS GROUND WELL).

By the way, the sharpening service we use is based in Minneapolis, and probably grinds about 95% of the Morso's in a 5 state region.

Always wanting to know more......

John

Also if you don't have this link look at the PHONE NUMBER;

http://www.tech-mark.com/

Val ,Baer mant to tell you he uses his Morso in the kitchen in the place of a "Vegga-Matic" and he gets the sharpeners confused with his other cutlery.LOL

[ 07-25-2006, 10:56 AM: Message edited by: BUDDY ]
 
I have been using Quality Saw for several years with good results.

Some outfits (like Quality) offer a reusable, wooden shipping container with pegs and foam so that the blades won’t get knocked around during transit. The boxes are sealed and opened with wood screws.

The blades are returned with a removable plastic coating so that they don't corrode or oxidize while in the box waiting to be used.
 
TechMark will send the blades back in a really spiffy wooden box, if you ask and pay the $20.00 extra for it. The box has bolts (the same size as the ones that hold the blades onto the chopper) that secure the blades. I always worried the blades would slice straight through the styrofoam and take a couple of fingers with them on the way to the floor. Love my wooden box.

Clive.
 
I shipped them overnight to TechMark yesterday. They sharpen on M-W-F, so will get there in time to do them today. Jill, on the phone, said she'd look for them herself. Nice people! And then return it overnight this afternoon. They're sending the wooden shipping box with it (Thanks Clive and Co.) and a blade bolt (one got lost years ago and was replaced with a too-small bolt!) I should have them back tomorrow, sharp as a whistle! AND, I will send the other set right after that, in the new box.

Jill also said they might be able to tell what's out of adjustment by the location of the nick in the blade, and will call me today about where I might look. That's why I sent it there, she said "We're Da Man for Morso stuff!"
I ordered a handle from them earlier this year. Good, fast service and a friendly voice on the other end.

Oh, btw, the mobile service came right up to the frame shop door on Monday and looked in (I didn't see her) and left, thought she had the wrong address. She was looking for a "construction office", and didn't think of a gallery/frame shop as needing a sharpening service. Duh! I won't be sending my chopper blades to them! I'll send them it to Da Man!!
thumbsup.gif
Thank goodness she left, or my blades would be there now and I wouldn't get them back until next Monday, when she comes back to Carson! No coincidences.

Hmmmm, just had a thought...I wonder if that wrong blade bolt might be one cause of the maladjustment? Same side as the nick, both sets. It's tight, just the head is the wrong size (small).
 
Sounds reasonable to me .there is a retightening pattern suggested by MORSO as well as a alignment when reattaching them. If the Bolt has a bit of slack in it it could very well putthat Knife out of alignment.

It would be prudent to call TechMark and advise them of your alteration and where it is in relation to the knick( they may not be aware of any differances from the norm).IMO
BUDDY
 
Jill at TechMark just called, 10:30a.m. our time (Pacific). They're sharp and on their way home in their new box and a new bolt. She said they should "cut like butter". They were a MESS, had been sharpened improperly and even that could have caused the nicks. They re-ground (regrinded?) them for $50, next time will be just a sharpening at $25.

So, someone before me saved money by going local, but in the long run LOST money and time and quality for tweaking the joining a poor miter, filling, sanding, and now, the corrective grinding. Man, am I glad that person walked away on Monday!

Another lesson learned at Grumble School! :D
 
They DO cut like butter! And a perfect mitre! And without a ton (any)of adjusting. The Morso was adjusted properly the entire time, but the blades were the culprit, and now we know. No more chewing up the back side, no sanding to make them fit, no filling...as it should be!!! Geeze!!

What a TREAT not to have to dink with them!

BTW, they re-ground (regrinded?) them to hollow-ground.

Lesson learned......CHECK THE SPARES! DON'T ASSUME...DON'T PUT OFF....and...GET 'EM SHARPENED BY THE PROPER PLACE!!! (I'm yelling at myself there.)

Now back to work.

I'M SOOOO HAPPY!!! :D :D :D
 
Me too!

After reading all of the recommendations for Tech Mark on this and other posts, I packed my up and send them off last week. Got them back in the nice little wooden safety box yesterday.

They literally cut better than when they were new, and this is the first sharpening on this set. I did fill the gap on the fence this time with silicone as also suggested and let it dry overnight.

Even the treaded black moulding with the shell finish are chopping with out chipping on the money side against the fence. Don't know if it is the sharpening or the silicone gap filler, or a combination of both, but I am loving it. The second set of blades is backed up and ready to go to Tech Mark. :thumbsup:

Gotta agree though with another comment or two, that their return postage is high. They could get their boxes from UPSP flat rate for free. USPS would pick up for free. Priority postage is only a little over 8 bucks about 1/2 of what they are charging. At almost $50. including postage both ways it is a little expensive, but the results are great!
 
Is that for one set? I can sharpen a set of blades 10 times (literally) for that price and have the back same day.
 
Yea, that is the price for 1 set with shipping both ways.

$25.00 ($27.00 after July 1-07 ) for hollow ground.
There is a double charge if they have to regrind them back to hollow ground if that has been changed on prior sharpenings

USPS shipping there was $8.50 I think
UPS return shipping was $13.45

But as I said, they cut better than new!
 
Ditto what J Paul said. I've been wondering about the large discrepancy in return shipping costs. You would think they would get better rates since they ship out a lot. Plus, the blades are a little bit lighter on the way back.
;) Rick
 
You think they do some special voodoo on chopper blades? That craft is as old as this one and any surely any experianced shop can sharpen chopper blades.

But hey, 20/20 had a special a while back about parents that gladly pay over $100 for kids jeans even after learning about how there was no difference between the designer pants and the much more modestly price generics.

I prefer to sharpen my blades 5 times for what you pay in shipping alone and still take my wife to the movies with the money saved.

Carry on.
 
You think they do some special voodoo on chopper blades?
I guess I do, having tried at least a half dozen places over the years that don't compare to TechMark.

I prefer to sharpen my blades 5 times for what you pay in shipping alone and still take my wife to the movies with the money saved.
Hey, if you can, go for it. Not everyone has that luxury, apparently.

Carry on.
Carryin'
 
Ed needs to raise his prices. I just figured that every 'boro in North America had at least one professional that could sharpen blades for under $50. I just didn't realize how lucky we really are. I hope Ed doesn't find out what a special special service he's offering.

You have me just about interested enough in this hocus pocus to try these cats out. Do you have to send in a pigeon bone or a lock of hair with the blades or do they have their own special brew?
 
Jay, if your guy is doing a good job for you and your happy that's all that matters. Is he doing "hollow ground"?

I was sending mine out with one of my suppliers on their delievery truck and then they send them to their local guy, back to them, back to me. $30.00 and three weeks later and they seemed to cut OK. But not has good as the one's I just got back from Tech Mark.

I would hate to risk a $250+ set of blades to a local guy here who sharpens lawn mower blades and hedge trimmers, if he had never done these before and didn't know how to do them right.

Now, I'm not being a smart a$$ but if your guy knows what he is doing and for $5.00 you ought to ask him if he is interested in doing mail order. USPS Priority mail $8.50 each way + $5.00 to sharpen is only $23.00. Taking your blades to an untested guy, could be a $250+ mistake.
 
$250? I just priced a new set of chopper blades for my Jyden and they were a lot more than that!
 
I'm not anti-TechMark at all. I don't recall a single unsatisfied customer but their prices are often questioned. I just want to let others know that there is options. Often a LOCAL company doing QUALITY work is much FASTER and CHEAPER. If you're not interested in trying, then don't. Its ok with me.

Are there shops ruining blades? Its not a common occurance here on the G. Wouldn't that shop have to buy a replacment?

Why would you be so skeptical of a local shop but are willing to send them to a guy who sends them to another guy and have em sharpened. Thats an odd contradiction.
 
Why would you be so skeptical of a local shop but are willing to send them to a guy who sends them to another guy and have em sharpened. Thats an odd contradiction.

Because presumably this supplier/moulding vendor knew who they were dealing with and since they were reselling the service they bore the responsibility.

All I'm saying is you got a local guy, good prices, great. I don't know a local guy with experience, that's all.

Over and out!
 
I would like to find someone local, but reputable and with experience sharpening these things, and get them done soon. Who do I call, what do I ask and what do I look for? The other shops in the area only have saws, except one and I'm sure he won't divulge any "secrets", he's not very nice. I may have to send them away. Help quick! I have chopping to do!

Val, sorry to be so late with this answer. I have been working on several deadlines. We use Standard Saw Works in Oakland. They have sharpened our blades for 30 years. Great people, perfect work. They pick up and deliver. Jeff handles the details, but I do know we have several sets of blades, not just two. I'll ask him tomorrow what you should look for in a sharpener. Otherwise you could buy a third set and send them off to Standard Saw Works.
 
Thanks Kirstie. That was posted nearly a year ago. I've been sending them to Techmark, and very happy with them. They reground both sets to hollow ground and took the chips out the first time, and normal sharpening after that. Turnaround time is less than a week, or sooner, if I need it, and they will send overnight. I have a commercial FedEx account so shipping isn't an problem. Nice folks, too.

I would be willing to try out Standard Saw Works though. Think they'd pick up and deliver in Carson City? (wink-wink!)
 
Well that shows how far I am behind! I'm glad you found Tech Mark. Maybe we should try them sometime.
 
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