Proof of pickup??

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Paul N

Paul N

SPFG, Supreme Picture Framing God
Joined
Jun 10, 2005
Posts
17,354
Loc
CT, not far from the LI Sound
I never thought of this till today:

I got a call from an older lady who said she never received a call from us to pickup her art and whether it was ready.....?

I did some research and told her I remember that we did call and she did pick it up. She said, "yeah, maybe you're right, probably I did pick it up and I forgot...."

And suddenly it hit me: What if somebody picks up something really valuable / unique / of major sentimental value, etc and after a few weeks / months / years, shows up again and asks for the same piece?? Unless we have have a name+ signature + time + date showing it was really picked up, one could be in deep trouble.

Do you keep such a signature pickup book (like the pharmacy does!)??

I don't but now I am gonna!!
 
Then you should have records in your POS, procedures that you follow. When customers pick up here, we record that they have done so in the POS, and it prints out a final receipt, even if they had already paid in full. So somewhere in your POS records, items should be marked as "picked up."
 
And I'm wondering why they've been so careful to keep the receipt, but they can't find their darned artwork?
 
We have a "received by" stamp that is stamped on each work order and the customer signs and dates that they picked up each piece. No exception- same for deliveries, everything is signed for.
 
Aha - you all thought I was mad insisting that work is paid for on collection.

So - what exactly did you pay for, Mr Smith?

Unless the whole job is paid for up front you'll have the same proof anyway.
 
Yes John, ideally, but:

Good customers: You can't always ask them to pay in advance. Just yesterday a VERY good customer dropped off a piece and left in a hurry.

Others: Have forgotten their checkbook / wallet, etc or are in hurry, the kids are in the hot car in the sun outside, etc, Do you really want to insist on payment or they could take their art and leave?

Just 2 examples, but there are circumstances where we cannot control advance payment. Heck, sometimes customers don't even wait for their receipt (work order copy or even credit card receipt)

Although I get paid in advance about 90% of the time, but still, one of those 10% jobs could come back to haunt you.
 
Rob:

A "Received By" stamp is a great idea.

But sometimes (especially in the hectic season (November - December) I am designing something with a customer, 2 are waiting and one (or more) is picking up, I might easily forget (or don't have the time to do) the Received By routine....

But I guess I should really make it a habit.
 
Paul- it is all about establishing routine and protocol. When you are busy do you also "forget" to ask for a deposit? "Forget" to collect a balance due? You get the idea. YOU are in control. You just have to do it.

We added the "received by" protocol after a situation similar to yours where a client swore they had not picked up a piece and we knew we didn't have it. We spent hours looking for the piece (did it get sent to the wrong store? was is mislabeled with another customer's name and in the wrong bin?) Remember that we frame hundreds of pieces per month and we need to have a system of checks and balances.

It turned out that the husband had picked up the piece and failed to tell his spouse. If we had a signature, we possibly could have told her what had happened and saved a lot of stress on both our parts.

Do you use a POS system? If so, can't you put a flashing toggle that reminds you to ask for a received by sig? Or, how about pre-stamping the work order/pick up slip or whatever paperwork you have so all you have to remember to have the customer do is sign?

We also have a "date" line next to the "received by". Some of our designers were "forgetting" to confirm that the date was filled in and their excuse was that "the customer didn't fill it in." So now the designer is responsible for filling in the date prior to asking for the "received by" line to be signed. It is part of the sales protocol and a part of the designer's review process addressees their ability to follow the protocol completely.
 
We have a detailed deposit receipt, One copy goes with the customer who is supposed to bring is back as a pick up receipt. Half the time they forget it.

So then we tried a big binder, with explicit instructions to the framers that each customer would sign it upon pick up. Half the time people forgot to grab the book. I think we need to dig it out and enforce it again.

Now we are back to nothing but giving them their copy of the work order.

Maybe we should get it signed and keep it. But people want the complete work order and are used to getting it. And it would be one more piece of paper to file.

A wireless computerized tablet to sign which would store their pick up signature? Is there such a thing?

Thanks for bringing this topic up.
 
As Mr. Markoff said it is a matter of setting store policy for your business. You are the owner, the boss, and the one accountable for any mistakes made during the course of conducting business in your store. It is too easy to make up excuses for not doing something when a little bit of effort on your part will establish guidelines that will ensure that something is done as a policy of the business.

We have a number of policies in our gallery. For example, my boss didn't want to fool around with people leaving deposits for little jobs and then having to go back and do double the paperwork to take the balance upon pickup so she established a policy that all custom work under $500 would be prepaid to cover the cost of materials and to ensure that the customer would return in a timely manner to pick up their framing. The second part doesn't always work but in most cases the customer comes back within a reasonable time to pick up the finished framing when they have already paid for it in advance. And we never get stuck with jobs that people forget about or just don't come back to retrieve at a later date. And, as was also mentioned, there can always be special circumstances to which exceptions can be made. You are the boss and can make changes if needed, that is part of operating your own business.

On most POS programs you can add policies or time limits or whatever information you feel is needed at the bottom of the invoice or the workorder. A simple "Received by" with a line next to it and below it "Date picked up" with another line is sufficient to prove when a piece was picked up and by whom. You should have full control of this situation as owner or boss of your business and it is simply a matter of educating your employees to get a signature when a customer picks up a piece ................... period. In lieu of a permanent entry on all paperwork generated by your POS program, the stamp idea mentioned would be a very good alternate method of proof of pickup.
 
Kirstie said:
We have a detailed deposit receipt, One copy goes with the customer who is supposed to bring is back as a pick up receipt. Half the time they forget it.

So then we tried a big binder, with explicit instructions to the framers that each customer would sign it upon pick up. Half the time people forgot to grab the book. I think we need to dig it out and enforce it again.

Now we are back to nothing but giving them their copy of the work order.

Maybe we should get it signed and keep it. But people want the complete work order and are used to getting it. And it would be one more piece of paper to file.

A wireless computerized tablet to sign which would store their pick up signature? Is there such a thing?

Thanks for bringing this topic up.
Click to expand...

Kirstie,

Don't you use a POS program for your framing?? On most of the programs you can set the number of copies that will be printed for any document that has to do with the workorder or invoice of a job. In FrameReady I can generate up to 3 copies of the workorder or paid or unpaid invoice. We don't make it a policy of handing out workorders to our customers as we prefer that they not take it and do any comparison shopping at the competition. There is information on a workorder that isn't really needed by most customers and we usually print out a "blind" copy of the workorder or print out a proposal for the customer to take with them if they request something. With over 90% of the work we do being prepaid, we usually attach their copy of the credit card receipt to a printout of the paid invoice. We get very few checks or cash payments but those also are entered on the computer on the payment line on the invoice, printed out, and handed to the customer at the time of payment.

The customer is supposed to sign the shop copy of the workorder when they pick up their framing and that is retained in a completed workorder file for future reference. You simply can't get away from some kind of paperwork to file no matter what you try to do to streamline things. I am sure that there is some kind of electronic signature pad that you could use similar to the swipe pad that is used in most stores now but I don't see a need for it as you or one of your employees are right there in the customer's face as they pick up their work. What difference does it make whether they sign a pad or they sign a physical workorder, the time taken to monitor the signature is the same for you??
 
We put on the work order "called 4/5/06" or "LMOM 4/5/06" (left msg on machine) or "No Ans 4/5/06" depending. This stops "Well, no one ever called me" "We left a message on 4/5/06" "Oh."

Then we write "bal pd Visa" (or whatever) then "p/u 4/5/06" The only problem we have had is the time of the divorcing couple. We called to say it was complete, the husband picked it up and then the wife came in to get it. "I'm sorry, it has already been picked up. We called this number (which she had given us in happier times) and left a message. He paid for it with a MasterCard" "Well, you weren't supposed to give it to him, because it was mine and now he won't give it to me." (Like I have ESP or something) And she hummpphh-ed her way out.
 
I don't think noting it in the POS gives you any kind of legal protection. (you can make the same determination by looking at the pickup bins to see if its still there). However, having them sign something might be a different story.

With the upcoming LifeSaver 5.0, due in October, you can customize a signature area that prints on the very bottom of the (framers) workorder. It would be a simple task to word this appropriately and have the customer sign it, upon pickup.

In our shop, we do it just like Ellen. We put hand written status notes on the workorder, when the job is complete. (called 9/27/08 Left msg w/daughter. etc) After they pick up, we also note this w/our initials - and put it in a special box for completed orders.

In our shop, the workorder also serves as our failsafe. When an order is complete, we fold the workorder in half lengthwise, and put it in a special box at the front counter. It serves to remind us what has yet to be picked up. In the event of a power failure, or if all the computers are in use, one could easily process pick-ups just from those slips. (They have the customer info, notes, balance due, item location, etc) Some shops tape the workorder to the finished piece, until the customer comes in.

In either case, it would be easy to have them sign and date the workorder. The result would be similar to Rob Markoff's rubber stamp solution.
 
Mike Labbe......idea for LS

Thanks all for your input, very helpful

I use LifeSaver and in its current release (I understand a post-Atlanta release is coming up soon) it doesn't provide a customizable copy of anything that can be setup to add things like:

Date Called on / Left Msg / Picked up on / Picked up by (full name)/ signature, Paid Balance, Paid with, etc

This might be a good recommendation for LS to add to the next release. I hope Mike will read this and relay to LS

Otherwise it will be a large book or similar thing done in Word like a table with the above info.
 
Paul: See previous message

I think we were typing at the same time :)

In that customizable section, you could do exactly as you said. One line for dates called w/result, and one for the customer to sign and date. I believe it has 3 lines that can be customized.
 
Yes we were Mike, LOL.

Actually right now I do it just like you and Andy (and Ellen):Work Order in folder with notes on it.

The customizable new release will definitely be helpful!:thumbsup:

That's why I love LifeSaver, they can read my mind as well!
 
I woke up this morning wth the answer. I understood that the pick up book kept getting misplaced all over the shop and that's why it was abandoned. Even I was forgetting.

I will get a stamp made up for our fail safe copy. That always stays in an alphabetical file the shop and can be pulled upon pick up with the customer copy. Stamped in advance, signed. Got it. Thanks for all the ideas.

Ordering that stamp on Monday. What do your stamps say?

(No Mike, we don' thave POS yet--long story, many computers needed for our shop, big set up, but we are planning on it in 2008. Researching now. Don't need reasons to get it. I do know)

Kirstie
 
We now have a situation where an old customer brought in something to be framed but never actually selected a frame. She came in with her daughter and then with her daughter-in-law (don't you just love when they do this) and then picked it up before Passover a couple of years ago and said she would be back after to frame it. Two years later she walks in to frame her painting that is no longer here! She remembers she left it here but doesn't remember that she picked it up.

I happen to have a superb memory for weird things and specifically remember that she picked it up because I remember being shocked that she didn't frame it by us and asked the sales person about it. She told me that the customer would definitely be back but who knows when as it can take this customer years to make up her mind.

At that time we were using Full Calc and it is marked as picked up in our computer and the date coincides with my memory of it being before Passover. I told that customer that there is no way we could go back now and mark a pick up with a date from two years ago in the computer. She knows there is nothing to be done about it as she doesn't have her receipt and we have it marked as picked up. However, every couple of months she calls and begs me to look for it (believe me we did despite the fact that I know that it was picked up). And although we go back a long time with the customer and she knows we wouldn't do anything to her piece she still feels that it is somewhere here.

ALL of this aggravation could have been avoided with having a signed pick up receipt. But how long must we keep these receipts? In this case it is over three years!
 
Many years ago, I had a customer come in to pick up her work on a very busy Saturday. I could not find anything, no receipt, she didn't have one, I couldn't find my copy. I was busier than ever, she is standing there glaring at me when I'm try to keep people from walking out. It was chaotic to say the least. I kept looking and trying to help people, she is getting madder and madder.

After I had about three people walk out, I had this great idea. I went into the back room and got on the phone to other frame shops in the area. I found her project at another shop. I went back out front and told her where her work was. She turned on her heel and stormed out, not even a goodbye.

John
 
Actually John, this happens more than you think!

People call the wrong gallery and ask for their stuff and get upset till they realize (fast enough if one is lucky) that's it's their memory that's been acid damaged.....
 
John, we had that twice in 24 years. One customer kept on calling and yelling at us and they actually framed at the photo shop across the street. The second customer came in and gave us a piece of her mind -- then stops, looks around and says "Oh my goodness. This is a really nice frame shop. I brought it to a real messy frame shop. Did you renovate?" With that description we knew exactly where to send her to pick up her piece!
 
I've had that happen too! A customer phoned and complained that we had not finished his job, I asked for some details and told him I did not remember him or his picture and after a quick look in the racks I told him that I could not find it.

I had a shop full of customers and they all heard what was going on. Some time later he phoned and appologised because he had looked for the number in yellow pages and instead of phoning the right shop he phoned me.

At the time, you don't have time to think clearly, because you are running around like a headless chicken, looking and feeling stupid. Next time, (if there is a next time), I will ask some very specific questions to find out which shop they think they are talking to!
 
I didn't read it - not that it would have meant anything - just recognised what it was and pointed her to the chemist 2 doors down.

It was probably a drug for amnesia!
 
we get 3-5 per year that come to pick up something that they took to another shop.
our work order has a place for noting calls on finished work, who we talked to, and if a msg was letf ,
no answers, etc. and also they must sign the work order upon pickup. we never give a copy of the work order to a customer, just a receipt, the work order has too much info that could be used for comparative shopping on the next potential order.
 
When we got our POS system, (FrameReady) we celebrated the end of paper. I must admit, it wasn't easy to let go but we finally severed the cord.

We now print out only one copy of the work order to use in the shop. When the project is complete, the customer is called and it is noted on the work order and computer. The work order goes to the designer who made the sale so they can write a personal thank you note to the customer. It is then put in a basket to hold for no more than a month. At the end of 30 days, they are cut in half and recycled as scratch paper.

Everything else is in the computer, order dates, completion dates, pick up status...and of course the framing details.

When a customer comes in for their completed work, we go right to the computer. It tells us it's status, if and when it was completed and by whom, where it's located, and the balance due. FrameReady has a customizable "location" box on the work order where we mark it "picked up".

Ah...(deep breath) no more paper!
 
When a customer comes in for their completed work, we go right to the computer.
Click to expand...

Steve:

What if a customer wants proof that they really picked up their original $####,## Chagall?? Or even a $275 poster framing job??

I doubt a computer system will have the same effect in court as customer's own signature.
 
hangupsgallery said:
Will it ever? Never say never but life is too short to worry about every little contingency. .
Click to expand...


I agree with Steve.

An airplane could crash into my building and cause me financial problems, but I am just not going to dwell on every little thing that could go wrong.
 
don't trust computers...too many bad things can happen..so a paper trail backup is needed anyway to be half way cover your ***
 
couture's gallery said:
don't trust computers...too many bad things can happen..so a paper trail backup is needed anyway to be half way cover your ***
Click to expand...

We keep two hard copies of every Work Order; a numerical file and an alphabetical file. We've done that since 1988. Call it administrative inertia.

That said, we really don't need all that paper anymore. We make daily backups of QuickBooksPro and FrameReady on spare harddrives and CF disks. Weekly we make multiple CF disk backups. Monthly I mirror the entire hard drive on each of our four computers holding critical data, onto three external hard drives we keep at home.

Our backups are triple-redundant. If all of our computers disappeared tomorrow, we would not lose much, if anything.
 
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