PFG, Picture Framing God
Jan 1, 2001
Houston, Texas
There are some questions on framing I can never seem to get a definitive answer for. I'm sure there are many, but two spring to mind.

1. Why do we seperate metal frame samples from wood? Other than "that's how we've always done it" I mean. With so many really great metal frames out there, there's really no reason not to use a metal frame if it's right design-wise and makes for a quality frame package. No reason other than old prejudices. So why not mix the gold metal samples with other gold, black with black and so on?

2. If a canvas and backing package sit below the back of the frame and there is extra rabbet space, maximum preservation standards (at least as defined by the PPFA) call for offset clips installed reverse to hold it all in. Why not points? I understand that the idea is to hold it all in just a tiny bit firmly but not snug, a little on the loose side. But why not points? I asked this question of Paul McFarland, who seems to be regarded as the most knowledgeable in the industry when it comes to work on canvas. His reply: "It looks more tricked out." Anyone have an answer beyond it just looking cool?
Originally posted by FramerDave:
2. Why not points? I understand that the idea is to hold it all in just a tiny bit firmly but not snug, a little on the loose side. But why not points?
I am also interested in the answer to your question #2. I thought long and hard with this situation just yesterday. I went ahead and did the points but questioned it in my mind. Why not?
(1) Mostly personal preference / habit but it also occurs to me that metal frame samples are very sharp making it probable that you could more easily scratch and damage quality wood samples if they were intermixed.

(2) It's interesting to ponder this point in conjunction with this adjacent thread ... it might be more appropriate to fill the back rather than using reverse offset clips!
I always separated the woods and metals because:

A) I used the Nielsen rails and clips instead of Velcro to hang the metals

B) Metals ARE different - sometimes superior. For one thing, the smallest metals are MUCH stronger than the smallest woods. And while rabbet-depth limitations in woods are somewhat forgiving, they are much less so with metals. If the package is 19/32" thick, you'd better make sure the frame isn't 17/32".

I always used points (Fletcher Multi-points, most recently) to fit canvases in deeper frames. I guess I didn't know any better.
1. We put the 'Elements' line in with our wood frames for just this reason. Looks good, too!

2. Oh, my. I always figured that if there is room to shoot points, then that is the preferable way. No dustcover lumps that way!
I've always used points (or brads) when they fit, rather than fuss with offsets. The only reason I can think of for offsets being superior is that they make it easier for a customer to change out the canvas inside without mucking up our nice frame.
1. Why do we seperate metal frame samples from wood?
For the same reason I don’t let peas touch my mashed potatoes – it’s abhorrent.
Off set clips upside down? That seems like an awfull lot of work. I prefer 2 1/2" drywall screws.... They hold that sucker right in place.


as for metals... I always thought they didn't like the wood frames so I just keep them away from one another. Perhaps in today's more accepting world, they CAN live in harmony. ;)
Framerdave I too use points when ever there is room inside the rabbet ,even if i back fill it. I also occasionally use points that I insert in the back of the moulding and bend over if the package extends out the rabbet by less than say a 1/4 of and inch and then cover the points with some form of tape and cover the entire thing with a dust cover. But then i am never going to be considered a canvas knowledgeable framer by any standards.LOL

But while we are on that topic could you explain what Paul meant by "It looks more tricked out" ?Tricked out to whom. My customers only care if it looks good and last . I don't think they know any Framing "TRICK" unless I teach them to them or one of you did.LOL