I’m starting this thread so this discussion does not dilute Framer’s thread about Metric length being billed a 10ft.
Less from other thread:
I believe part of the reason our moulding costs are so high, is due to the lack of quality control, inspection, and proper packing. The throw a stick it a box and ship it policy must cost these companies as much time and money as it cost us, and it is the time that really costs the framer.
How much time can it take to have an inspector who knows a little about framing to inspect each order before shipping? This type of policy would probably reduce the cost to the company, the framer, and ultimately the consumer.
John Richard’s reply:
Sorry, I also wanted to address Lessa's question regarding inspection. If sticks are already unbundled, then measurement, quality ect is reviewed by the puller. At the end of each rack we have a 15' measuring device in 6" increments. Color is checked if more than one stick is ordered (all sticks basically the same). If one stick is ordered color becomes secondary because the odds of it exactly matching either the catalog or your wall sample are slim. If bundled there is zero inspection. Your receive it just like we do from the factory, same with box programs. Most distributors can offer length discounts because in bundle or box quantity the lack of inspection and handling time can be passed on to the framer. Over the course of any given day, our pullers can pull over 5000' of length in both here and Troy. These same people are also pulling your mats, supplies, glass, foam, cardboard ect. This factors into the equation of measuring / inspecting bundled and boxed mouldings. There are not enough hours in a day. If were to hire more people then moulding prices would rise and probably more than once per year.
Less:
Hi John, thanks for the reply.
I don't want to divert from Framer's complaint, but I'm not concerned with $1-$2 ft mouldings, and I'm not going to send back moulding with minor defects from a bundle. What I'm talking about are large sticks & chops that cost me $5 - $20+ ft. When I get a length or two of an expensive 4" moulding with the wrapping still on it and it has obvious pre-shipping defects or damage, that has to cost everyone a lot of money in handling time, shipping and replacement costs. Poor packing just aggravates the problem. I get the feeling and have herd that the distributors factor in the waist and pass the cost on to us.
I still believe if distributors/manufactures carefully inspected and pack the larger and more expensive mouldings everyone would save money & TIME.
John Richard’s:
Rick...I couldn't read your message, it's dark in here! Lessa - I agree that inspection is more important on the expensive stuff, but most of our more expensive stuff is individually wrapped then bundle wrapped. I'm afraid of damaging more moulding trying to rewrap. Waste is only factored in on chops, not length. I like the dice idea. Framer...I checked and our system (and probably others) will only take 1/2' measurements. I can't do 9.85. (we buy in meters) Sorry. I'm going to try in incorporate a little bug in next years price list to indicate mouldings that are meters. PS: One thing nice about the european imports is that length is consistantly right on the money. From domestic manufacturers we can get lengths from 4.5' to 15'. Crazy when trying to sell box programs.
Ellen:
The suppliers sure wouldn't save time OR money if they inspected all the stuff that comes through their hands. It takes Time to unwrap, inspect, and rewrap the sticks. And if the stick isn't perfect and they don't ship it to SOMEONE, then that costs Money too. I don't see where those of us who buy length should expect perfect sticks. That is why we buy chop... Entirely different animal. Kind of like going to the grocery store and buying oranges. You can buy them in a bag (cheap, like length, but you gotta take the good with the mediocre) or you can buy them individually (not quite so cheap, like chop but the store has more waste because there are some oranges that never get chosen and have to be discarded) or you can buy them already sectioned in a glass jar (like join, not very cheap at all, but you are saved a LOT of work) However much labor& wasted materials you want the fruit companies to have expended on your behalf then that is what you must pay for. It's the Capitalist Way... More convenience costs more money, but you are then allowed to be pickier based on the more you spend per unit...
Class dismissed....
Less from other thread:
I believe part of the reason our moulding costs are so high, is due to the lack of quality control, inspection, and proper packing. The throw a stick it a box and ship it policy must cost these companies as much time and money as it cost us, and it is the time that really costs the framer.
How much time can it take to have an inspector who knows a little about framing to inspect each order before shipping? This type of policy would probably reduce the cost to the company, the framer, and ultimately the consumer.
John Richard’s reply:
Sorry, I also wanted to address Lessa's question regarding inspection. If sticks are already unbundled, then measurement, quality ect is reviewed by the puller. At the end of each rack we have a 15' measuring device in 6" increments. Color is checked if more than one stick is ordered (all sticks basically the same). If one stick is ordered color becomes secondary because the odds of it exactly matching either the catalog or your wall sample are slim. If bundled there is zero inspection. Your receive it just like we do from the factory, same with box programs. Most distributors can offer length discounts because in bundle or box quantity the lack of inspection and handling time can be passed on to the framer. Over the course of any given day, our pullers can pull over 5000' of length in both here and Troy. These same people are also pulling your mats, supplies, glass, foam, cardboard ect. This factors into the equation of measuring / inspecting bundled and boxed mouldings. There are not enough hours in a day. If were to hire more people then moulding prices would rise and probably more than once per year.
Less:
Hi John, thanks for the reply.
I don't want to divert from Framer's complaint, but I'm not concerned with $1-$2 ft mouldings, and I'm not going to send back moulding with minor defects from a bundle. What I'm talking about are large sticks & chops that cost me $5 - $20+ ft. When I get a length or two of an expensive 4" moulding with the wrapping still on it and it has obvious pre-shipping defects or damage, that has to cost everyone a lot of money in handling time, shipping and replacement costs. Poor packing just aggravates the problem. I get the feeling and have herd that the distributors factor in the waist and pass the cost on to us.
I still believe if distributors/manufactures carefully inspected and pack the larger and more expensive mouldings everyone would save money & TIME.
John Richard’s:
Rick...I couldn't read your message, it's dark in here! Lessa - I agree that inspection is more important on the expensive stuff, but most of our more expensive stuff is individually wrapped then bundle wrapped. I'm afraid of damaging more moulding trying to rewrap. Waste is only factored in on chops, not length. I like the dice idea. Framer...I checked and our system (and probably others) will only take 1/2' measurements. I can't do 9.85. (we buy in meters) Sorry. I'm going to try in incorporate a little bug in next years price list to indicate mouldings that are meters. PS: One thing nice about the european imports is that length is consistantly right on the money. From domestic manufacturers we can get lengths from 4.5' to 15'. Crazy when trying to sell box programs.
Ellen:
The suppliers sure wouldn't save time OR money if they inspected all the stuff that comes through their hands. It takes Time to unwrap, inspect, and rewrap the sticks. And if the stick isn't perfect and they don't ship it to SOMEONE, then that costs Money too. I don't see where those of us who buy length should expect perfect sticks. That is why we buy chop... Entirely different animal. Kind of like going to the grocery store and buying oranges. You can buy them in a bag (cheap, like length, but you gotta take the good with the mediocre) or you can buy them individually (not quite so cheap, like chop but the store has more waste because there are some oranges that never get chosen and have to be discarded) or you can buy them already sectioned in a glass jar (like join, not very cheap at all, but you are saved a LOT of work) However much labor& wasted materials you want the fruit companies to have expended on your behalf then that is what you must pay for. It's the Capitalist Way... More convenience costs more money, but you are then allowed to be pickier based on the more you spend per unit...
Class dismissed....
You didn't pay for it why should I?
OK alot.