Oxidation of Engraved Plates

Create a Post
J

Julia

CGF II, Certified Grumble Framer Level 2
Joined
Feb 11, 2003
Posts
395
Loc
Portland, Oregon
Has anyone ever had issues with aluminum plates continuing to oxidize after framing causing spiderweb like ghosting around the letters? We had a plate engraved and then oxidized so the letters appear black. Put together the shadowbox with the plate (under a mat opening) and 6 months later we go to photograph the box at the clients office and they point out this obvious blurring of the letters. Any thoughts? I've contacted the company that engraved the plate and they've seen this before with another framer. I've never run into this before, so any help will be greatly appreciated.

_2_08D0617008D05E900065B5DA.jpg
 
Julia said:
. Any thoughts? I've contacted the company that engraved the plate and they've seen this before with another framer.
Click to expand...
My thoughts. Looks like they re passing the blame onto the framers, saying it only happens when framers are involved. I'd go to another engraver and get a second opinion. I have not heard of any of the plaques I have framed under glass being crazed like that.
 
I have mostly used solid brass plates but none of the aluminum ones I have had done have done that or come back. I just got up and looked at the aluminum ones I have used and none were oxidized (aluminum was chosen because of the range of colors available). So it must be the oxidation - and I bet the engraver did not do a final fixative on your plate - so the reaction continues.

Actually, if it were an art form, it would be pretty danged cool. But not for a serious plate.
 
I've never seen that before. Not a metal expert, but it looks to me like some sort of
substance was used on the letters, then crept along lines in the plate having a reaction.
The two shapes at the top look like if someone had something on their fingers when
they touched the plate, which reacted with the metal over time.

Hopefully, you can find a local supplier you're happy with, but if you'd like another
option, try Mountain Enterprises in Kalispell, Montana. She's great, and the plates
always turn out well. She's prompt, too. 1-800-600-2101
 
shayla said:
I've never seen that before. Not a metal expert, but it looks to me like some sort of
substance was used on the letters, then crept along lines in the plate having a reaction.
The two shapes at the top look like if someone had something on their fingers when
they touched the plate, which reacted with the metal over time.

Hopefully, you can find a local supplier you're happy with, but if you'd like another
option, try Mountain Enterprises in Kalispell, Montana. She's great, and the plates
always turn out well. She's prompt, too. 1-800-600-2101
Click to expand...


mmm... Shayla... those ARE fingers...reflected in the metal.:shutup:
 
lol.....:icon19:

Every now & then, I tell my husband, "Can you see why I wouldn't make much of a private detective?"
He just smiles.
 
We frame and engrave. We have been framing for 37 years and engraving for 13. We use brass and aluminum. When engraving an aluminum (or brass) plate, you start with a solid piece of aluminum that has a thin protective coating, the engraver digs down through the top coating to expose the “raw” aluminum underneath. Then we spread the oxidizing liquid over the exposed letters, let the chemical turn the letters black, then rinse with water.
I have never seen this in 13 years. It looks like the top coating on the aluminum may be compromised.
I wonder if you removed the plate and rinsed it with water if there would be any change?

I would be happy to re-do this plate for you at no charge. Just PM me the details.
As an engraver, I would stand by my work, and if anything strange like this happened, would fix it.

If your engraver won't replace it for free - I will! Just let me know!!!
 
I have seen this before. It was probably caused by not rinsing it thoroughly after etching. The acid eventually compromises the surface.
 
Thank you for all your responses-this is why I appreciate the Grumble so much! And SusieQ, your offer to redo the plates was most generous.
My colleague, Roger, was intrigued and looked up the oxidation process and we found out that protective coating should have been applied after the oxidation was complete; this was not done. The engraver offered to do another oxidized plate but could not guarantee this would not happen again. Our solution: etching in a silver plexi plate that looks almost identical to the aluminum and an aluminum with the text silk screened on the plate.
We're presenting both to the client and will have him decide.
Thanks again for the referrals and information!
 
I have seen this before. My guess (which is worth as much as you are paying for it) would also be that it wasn't washed thoroughly enough and/or lacked the final coating.
 
Julia said:
Our solution: etching in a silver plexi plate that looks almost identical to the aluminum and an aluminum with the text silk screened on the plate....
Click to expand...
The guy who does my engraving locally uses a material he calls Flexi, which is a flexible plastic material with a gold or silver satin surface and a black core. When the text is engraved, it is very clear and sharp and easy to read, with no oxidation issues at all. I know many people think the brass plates are "classier", but my customers seem to love this look.
:cool: Rick
 
I would also say that a gold on black flexi would do much better than that old style mechanical engraving has done for you. We use both aluminum and brass and different types and thicknesses of flexi and rigid plastic and we laser engrave everything or do either a black or color disublimation to give the lettering a crisp clean look. About the only things we use the old mechanical engraver for is odd shapes of glass or metal, certain kinds of curved surfaces, or presentation swords and knives for the military. Almost all of the plaque and trophy plates we do now are either laser engraved brass or aluminum or disublimation transfers which leave the plate clean and ready for mounting onto whatever it was made for. We do have to clean the laser engravings with alcohol to remove ash and discoloration from the laser, though I have not seen anything that a wipe of alcohol would cause to come anywhere close to that mess you have.
 
Tom Reigle said:
...About the only things we use the old mechanical engraver for is odd shapes of glass or metal....
Click to expand...
Some years ago I had a local trophy shop engrave on the bottom rail of a Nielsen #97 metal frame, which looked really nice. Do you ever do that?
:cool: Rick
 
Create a Post
Back
Top