Outdoor Frames

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Framing St. Louis

Grumbler
Joined
Feb 11, 2004
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25
Loc
Chesterfield Missouri
We just got contacted about making an "elegant" frame for a golf course that will be hanging outside. It will be under a roof but still exposed to heat, humidity, etc. There will not be any glass.

Can I use standard wood moulding, if yes, do I add a layer of wax or something?

Thanks, Mike
 
Mike,

I did a number of these outdoor hangings for the Corps of Engineers for their outdoor shelters at Carlyle Lake to the East of you. I used metal mouldings for all of them.

Wood mouldings aren't finished for outdoor use at all, even under a canopy. They won't hold up under the weather conditions in your area of the country.

Framerguy
 
Originally posted by Framerguy:
Wood mouldings aren't finished for outdoor use at all, even under a canopy.
Click to expand...
I agree. Now the question is:
Is there some way of sealing them so they can be used outside?

I think you can but you would need to know what the final finish the manufacturer put on the moulding in order to use a compatable sealer like polyurethane, marine varnish or a clear latex product. Wax won't do it. You would also need to seal all sides of the moulding to help prevent warping. Like all wood products used outdoors they would need to be refinished, or recoated at least, every few years as the elements get to it.

[ 02-11-2004, 08:32 PM: Message edited by: Frank Larson ]
 
Mike -
Try Fox Moulding for a Emafyl "plastic" moulding
at their web site: http://www.foxmoulding.com/
Also - welcome to the Grumble
 
As much as I hate plastic, I must agree with Framerguy that no wood frame will last for long outside. We must put things at their right place; wooden frames belong inside while the plastic ones belong outside the house. So, ...out with your plastic frames, I say!
))
 
Originally posted by American Choice:
I must agree with Framerguy that no wood frame will last for long outside.
Click to expand...
So what part of the wood frame won't last? The wood? Let me think....I've seen fences, planters, decks, furniture, boats, houses and even cars (remember the Woodies?) made from wood and they all seem to last quite awhile. Heck even trees are made from wood and they last for centuries!

Maybe it's the "frame" part? Let's see...If we were to use an exterior rated glue and reinforce the joint with a spline or bisquits or maybe just screw them together would that last any less time than your fence or outdoor furniture?

Or maybe it's the finish? That is probably the most fragile part of the thing but still, if it's coated with a compatable weather resistant finish why would it not last as long as any other wood product used outdoors?

Inquiring minds want to know....
Really...I want to know.
 
Coating is not the only issue there, unless you plan to keep that frame in deep water. Besides, a well lacquered picture frame is no less appealing than an outer-space suit is sexy.
Of course, I was referring to the finish. Outside temperature variations alone is good enough of an agent to ruin a picture frame's finish. Why to take that risk when plastic frames preserve a decent look and weather the storm? We oughtta be fair and give plastic frames a chance. Poor taste and bad weather can not be argued with...
 
I am guessing here but would the plastic frames have a weather proof finish on them, veneer or overlay that would withstand the changes in outdoors environment and UV from direct sun?? I am just wondering about delamination of the finish on the plastic finishes from the body of the moulding.

I know that they are going under a canopy but the frames that I built for the Corps were under canopies also and they had daily morning sun on at least the bottom third of each framed poster or collage. And those that faced to the SW had evening sun in the same manner although I don't know how strong the evening sun is compared to morning sun.

I think I used a #75 Nielson profile for these framings or something close to that profile. I would use the powdercoated finish over the anodized finish as I think that it would take longer to discolor than the anodized under the sun and weather conditions.

Framerguy
 
As a former (20 year) St. Louis resident I gotta say - "It's not the heat that'll kill ya, it's the humidity!" Anyone from the northern climates know what a "humitemp" is? It's like a wind chill factor only it's heat and humidity to tell you what it really feels like outside. Whew! I'd rather be too cold than too hot any day. If you are cold you can always put more layers on - if you are too hot you can only get so naked and then you get arrested! :eek:

Back to business - My concern with the plastic frames would be delamination as well as warping due to the summer temps.

Designer Moulding has some very cool looking metal frames that might suit your purpose, depending, of course, on which golf course you are working with.

Just out of curiosity - which golf course? Oh, never mind I don't really need to know.

Coincidentally, I'll be in St. Louis all next week with my kids (winter break from school) to visit family and friends. I guess I'd better go break out the summer clothes tonight!


Cyndi
 
So, plastic frames aren't good for anything then?
))))))
Oh, yes, inside, as a substitute for the real thing...providing they don't exfoliate, delaminate and warp!
Wow, when I said in the past that a plastic frames/molding is disreputable to say the least, many had disagreed with me. Today, finally, I was willing to forfeit any outdoor competition between wood frames and plastic frames in favor of the last...
)))
 
Just tell them to buy another one when this one begins to look bad . they keep a fresh look and you have an ongoing source for business.
 
My Larson Juhl rep speaks of one of the frame shops in South Dakota who took a Craig Ponzio frame, laquered it 7 times w/ marine laquer, and now uses it outside on his building as part of his frameshop sign. The rep says it looks really awesome, and suggested that I do the same thing. (I haven't yet decided on a sign style.) Apparently it has been holding up well.

Emily
 
I did what Emily said with a wide Larson Castillano for my sign. It lasted about 8 years and today, even with the deterioration, it still looks good.

Pat :D
 
Just remember: Polystyrene frames are finished with the same materials as wood frames. All of the issues here are valid!!!!!

I used to work in the sign business and most "frames" were not real frames. They are carved out of plastic, coated and in some cases gilded.
 
Try using an oak moulding allied to a marine quality varnish.

The auctioneers at our local cattle market got me to make up a couple of frames for outside their offices a few years back to frame the brass nameplates for their business names.

I dont see why they wont last just as long as any other wood related product does outdoors.For pities sake I see plenty of wooden eaves lying exposed to a Scottish winter that have lasted for a couple of hundred years with a bit of maintenance.If you explainto the customer that a lick of varnish every few years will help to keep the thing intact then thats all you can do.

In my opinion plasic would look rubbish on a three hundred year old brass nameplate.
 
This forum is incredible, thanks for allowing me to participate!

I think we will play around with some marine varnish and see if we can leverage it's protective qualities but not ruin the look of the "elegant" frame we will use.

I'll also advise the customer that I can't be sure just how long this will look great. It's a very affluent country club and I suppose they can afford to replace this as needed.

As a follow-up, this frame will used around cork board, anything I need to know about getting a high quality cork board?

Thanks!
 
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