New frame shop near other framers

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Rozmataz

Rozmataz

SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer
Joined
Jun 13, 2002
Posts
2,773
Loc
Fingerlakes Region of NYS
I am not sure how to approach the title to this subject.

I am a new frame shop in a community where an older frame shop's owner retired over a year ago (partly the reason for my location choice)... where there are 2-3 other framers in the area.

Do I reach out to introduce myself to them or is the ball in their court. I have done extensive advertising and pr in the area - so they know I am here! And my business is doing quite well after just over 3 months!!

I do have friends and associations with other framers in the area but not the ones in my own back yard.

What's the take on this?!!
 
Roz, I would go in and introduce myself and hope for the best. Don't expect any of them to be anymore than cordial. For some reason in this industry people are a little stand-off-ish (I know... generalization.)I've been working as a framer for (gulp) 33 years and have always been open to others but it's never been reciprocal until "the Grumble". I think most will tell you this except maybe two guys out in Appleton, Wisconsin that seem to have a very good relationship.
 
You know, I think if it was me, whether I was already there, or if I was the "new kid", I would go introduce myself. One reason is, I think it's the right thing to do. But another reason, not nearly so civilized, is I want to be in control of the situation. If I put out my hand first, then the other person has to respond (positive) or react (negative). Either way, I can control my position in the situation. If my motives are honest and pure, I don't have to answer for how they perceive me.

Betty
 
When I was forced (by city redevelopment) to move two years ago, the city gave me a short list of possible locations based on my needs and budget. #1 on the list was a place two doors down from a frameshop/gallery. I thought they were insane. (These were ideas only. I was free to move anywhere I chose to.)

I went and talked to the owner of the other shop. It was someone I've had a friendly relationship with for some time. Between us, we decided it couldn't help OR hurt either of us.

As it turns out, I think it's helped both of us. The other business is about as different from mine as two shops could be. They send me the jobs they don't want to deal with. I'm not talking about troublesome customers. I'm talking about shadow boxes, specialty mats and other projects that seem basic to me, but not to the other shop, which deals in volume and low prices. They've told me that they consider me to be the "A" framer and themselves to be the "B" framers. I think that's an astounding statement to make, but I can live with it if they can.

In turn, I have no problem sending print customers to them, since they stock at least 5,000 compared with my 250 or so.

We've helped each other out with supplies and sources and it's been a very happy relationship for the most part.

It would probably be a far different story if our respective niches were more similar.

The other factor is that I'd been in business in downtown Appleton for 23 years when I moved. Still, I can't see how it could hurt to be friendly. If the others prove otherwise, you can always take a step back.

BTW, for years, John Ranes and I had combined Christmas parties for our employees and families. Now that's being friendly! (I don't know if I ever told John how much I appreciated that.)
 
Send them a note explaining how you are going to crush them. Offer to purchase their supplies and equipment at a nickle on the dollar. Tell them they are fools to pass up on this very generous offer.


Another aproach would be to go over and say hello. It's not a big deal & you will probably discover you have a new friend. That's assuming your operation is not some huge, mega operation that could possibly cause their business serious harm. If that's the case, by all means, go over and see how you can avoid doing harm to them, find out how you can both work together, & how you could help them. If your the "big" guy, don't expect a big hug when you show up at their shop. Hopefuly, when you leave, they, and you, will feel much better about you being there.


John
 
Don't overlook the possibility of doing combined supply purchases to take advantage of quantity discounts, save shipping or meet minimum purchase requirements. This isn't something you probably would want to get into during an initial visit, but it's worked for me and my neighbor who, as I mentioned, I've known for some years.
 
I went and introduced myself to the shop two doors down that decided to put some frames in his photography studio to bring in some "bread & butter" My shop wasn't in the location yet, I was working from my studio 3 miles away, but I thought it was the right thing to do; I had the lease on the space and was renovating. I had heard what he was going to do, so I thought I might save him some effort! The only thing I didn't tell him, was that I was going to knock his socks off from a framing business standpoint!! I don't believe that anyone should start framing to bring in "bread & butter" sales, if they are not "Professional" framers; it gives the rest of us a bad rap if they don't do a good job.

My 2 cents!

Elaine
 
I suggest a friendly introduction to the owner or manager, along with an offer to help if they ever run short of a matboard or a roll of ATG, etc.

But avoid talking with anyone else -- the one in charge might think you're trying to steal an employee.

Most will be nice, some won't, but you will at least have taken the initiative to be a friendly competitor. And you might start a mutually-beneficial business relationship or two.

I have never understood why neighboring framers are often unfriendly. Maybe some are afraid other framers want to steal their framing secrets. If so, the joke's on them -- a framer who thinks his/her secrets are worth guarding is probably years behnd the curve anyway. In my limited experience, the most knowledgeable framers are the ones most friendly and helpful.
 
Originally posted by JRB:
Send them a note explaining how you are going to crush them. Offer to purchase their supplies and equipment at a nickle on the dollar. Tell them they are fools to pass up on this very generous offer. :p
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John, I LOVE your style!!

I have little to contribute, because I am mostly a Warper, but I would go and introduce myself and offer to help out in little ways, if I could.
 
Competition is a funny thing. We have experienced both sides of "friendliness towards our fellow framers". On one hand, we have two competitors that cannot do enough to discredit us. Then, on the other hand we have two other competitors that share equipment, ideas, knowledge and supplies with us and vice-versa. The competitors that "didn't like us" were poster-non-conservation framers, and we came into the community with new ideas and conservation framing. They were forced to change their ways. The others were open to the changes and appreciated our input and we now share volumes of knowledge with each other.

I feel that going to introduce yourself to your fellow frame shop owner is a great idea and encourage you to do so.

Manny
 
Just to clarify my comment on poster-non-conservation framers. What was happening was they were putting non-conservation materials on valuable artwork.

Manny
 
I would definitely go and introduce myself if I were you. A lot of shops are one person shops and have little interaction with other framers.
I have talked to almost all the framers in my area and have met quite a few of them. There have been times when they (or I) need a mat or lite of glass in a hurry and someone has come through.
For some of the smaller volume shops I have done mounting or cut oversize mats. I don't have a computerized mat cutter, but a shop not far from me has one and she'll cut mats for me on occasion.
There's a shop that I also went in with on buying prints or ordering supplies... saves on shipping costs and meeting minimums.
All in all, I've found most other framers to be friendly, even if they were suspicious of my motives at first.
And of course I try to get them all to come visit The Grumble. :D That reminds me... there's a shop I haven't been to yet. ;)
 
With me presently being the President of the Ky/Tn Chapter of the PPFA, I would say go to them introduce yourself and tell them that you will respect their business and hope that they would respect yours. Offer to share horror stories and fixes and create a commradery that can benefit you all.

Seeing as I can only get two (SO FAR) framers in the KY/TN area to even respond to my last mailing!
 
Jerry,

I spent a week backpacking (lost, actually) in the Smokies once, so you can put me on your mailing list if you want.

I respond to everything!
 
Originally posted by jvandy57:

Seeing as I can only get two (SO FAR) framers in the KY/TN area to even respond to my last mailing!
Click to expand...
I swear, it's on my kitchen table somewhere. I'll find it tomorrow when I move stuff for dinner! I promise...

Betty
 
Go, introduce yourself.

You never know who you'll meet and what friends you'll make. I had an unusual beginning here since I bought the shop from my Dad. Another shop owner and my Dad would share purchasing and freight to make minimums or just save money. I continued the arrangement and since I've been here, I've enjoyed a friendship that has solved framing problems, listened to gripes about customers and gone on trade show trips to save on hotels, etc. When we do take advantage of sale moulding, it is always interesting that neither seems to choose more than 10% alike.

If that sounds hard to believe, we also have another friendly competitor in town to trade mats and problem solve with. We have been known to refer people to one or the other of us according to our specialties or equipment suited to the job.
In a medium sized community like this, it is rather nice to have friendly competitors. In moments of desperation it is good to know there is someone close by to hunt for that suede mat scrap because you just goofed up your last piece, or give you the phone number of a supplier to solve your latest predicament("Sure, I can frame that") or just listen when you want to vent.
It's not a daily exchange but it makes for a feeling of community (much like the Grumble).

Life is too short... :cool:
 
We "Competitors" in Hagerstown do even better. Four of us go to breakfast every two weeks! We rarely talk about business, but we DO get to exchange nuggets of gossip about customers (complete with warnings about the nutcases who occasionally make the rounds) and share purchasing. Our shop is open on Wednesdays until 8pm, so if the Larson guy is running late, he will leave everyone's orders with us. Sharing matboard scraps of course, and occasionally doing a multiopening Wizard mat.. as well as rejoicing together over triumphs, and sharing sadnesses. So ask one colleague to go to breakfast once. Then include another and voila! Competitors become colleagues and friends as well...
 
Please go and say hello. I have worked for frame shops in the past that would not consider "talking to the enemy" and that is exactly how they veiwed it. And these were the folks that resisted change and tried to keep an iron fist on all aspects of their business. I have also worked for wonderful people who believe that we are all on this planet together, and why can't we all just get along? My last employer was the new shop in town when she opened her place, and she imediately became friendly with the other framers (2) in town. She firmly believes there is enough work for everyone, and was even able to get a mat board or piece of glass from them in a pinch (and vice versa). I believe it stunned them at first, but then they realized that life is too short to be suspicious. They would refer customers to us (for jobs they didn't want or feel they could do) and we would send folks their way (both businesses also had other items that we did not). Mutually beneficial with no hard feelings.
 
Just another vote here for becoming friendly with your competitors...
There were four of us framers here in about a 3/4 mile stretch, now there are three of us. We have ordered supplies together, used each others' equipment, spread the word about troublesome customers, and commiserated during slow times. I wouldn't have it any other way.
It could not hurt to introduce yourself.
-edie
 
I would also like to say go introduce yourself. It is good to know the other framers in your area. You may need their help someday and it is much easier to ask it of someone you already know. I've found most people in this industry to friendly and helpful. They may become friends too.
 
The obvious bias being presented here is causing you to get only one side of the picture. This presents the risk of YOU being infected with this auspicious view of the world, and that it something you should give serious thought too. This unreasonable bias can only be attributed to one of the qualities that seem to be prevalent among members of the Grumble:
They’re great people!
(did you think I was being negative? Gotcha!)

Seriously, it’s no coincidence that you have received 100% support for you to go and meet your peers. This very act captures the spirit of what goes on here, 24/7 and around the world. So it’s just natural for a Grumbler to do the same in their own neighborhood.

I want to draw attention to a word I used – peer. This is 180 degrees in meaning from the word ‘competitor’. When you walk into another frame shop, allow the meaning of peer to affect who you are: equal, colleague, contemporary, friend, cohort. If the other framer gets it, and appreciates what you are trying to do, it can only be ‘a good thing’(thank you Martha).

So next time you are looking for a lame excuse to not have to do something, like walk into a strangers business and say “Hi” while the entire shop comes to a complete standstill, don’t look here. We as a breed wouldn’t let such a humiliating moment deter us from getting to the prize – another cohort!

P.S.- now go back and reread the beginning of my post to get the double meaning. :D
 
Eric,

Your posts almost always make sense, so I'll assume for the moment that that one did too. I'll read it again later and decide.

I've visited lots of frame shops. I usually identify myself (a practice I might adjust since I've been active on The Grumble) and the worst of them were much nicer to me that the people at Taco Bell, for example. Sometimes I get little clues, like the crossbow hanging, locked and loaded, behind the sales counter, that make me assume my Secret Shopper Persona - Bob the Browser.

I might point out that it was another Appleton framer, John Ranes, who pointed me to The Grumble about a year ago. I haven't decided yet whether he did me - or you - a favor.
 
Being friendly and sharing orders can lead to some interesting situations. Like the time I had a woman come in asking up front for 'just an estimate'.
After she left with just the dollar total of her estimate while I kept the details, I called one of my friendly competitors to see if our mutual order had arrived. It had and I left to pick it up.
Yes, you see what's coming. This same customer was at the other shop getting an estimate and I walked in and gave her a big smile while she turned beet red. After while I found out that she had just told the other framer that 'she would never go to anyone else'.
It was a priceless moment, even if I didn't get the order. ;)
Linda CPF
 
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