Nailbenders: my new competition??

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Beveled

Beveled

SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer
In Memorium
Rest In Peace

Gone but not forgotten
Joined
Oct 9, 2008
Posts
3,200
Loc
Harbor Springs, MI
A customer borrowed some samples for a very large mirror she wants. Like 95 x 82 large. When she came back, she had chosen a lovely ornate 3.5 inch frame. About $1800 for the frame. She also picked another smaller one for a TV frame. She blinked a little at the price, but then said, OK. I'll be checking on the mirror, and would I please check my sources too, she wants it antiqued.

Yesterday, her "contractor" came in and asked to see the frames. I showed him and he began with the questions. He wanted to know price per foot, overall cost, how I would hang it, etc. He wrote down measurements of the frame, the lip and the rabbet depth. Finally he asked what kind of paint is used on these frames because he can't possibly get them to look as silver polished as that. I said I had no idea. So he asked again. So I explained that I order the frames from distributors, I don't finish them myself. He asked a third time at which I responded with silence. There was an awkward staredown, and I said "Once again, I do not finish these frames, the manufacturer does."

For some reason he launched into a long schpeil about how he builds furniture and wants to finish some of them in this way. Maybe someday he'd also make some frames like this. I told him "good luck with that."

Does he really think I don't know what he was doing?? :nuts: I just don't know what the customer is thinking now. I seriously doubt that this was her idea. I need to call her, but I don't know how to say what I need to without sounding like I'm criticizing her contractor.
 
Sounds like the contractor is trying to hone in on your business without your client's knowledge or approval to me. He's also over his head.

You gave him more information than he needed to know. I'd let it go and not talk to your client about it.
 
Beveled said:
A customer borrowed some samples for a very large mirror she wants. Like 95 x 82 large. When she came back, she had chosen a lovely ornate 3.5 inch frame. About $1800 for the frame. She also picked another smaller one for a TV frame. She blinked a little at the price, but then said, OK. I'll be checking on the mirror, and would I please check my sources too, she wants it antiqued.

Yesterday, her "contractor" came in and asked to see the frames. I showed him and he began with the questions. He wanted to know price per foot, overall cost, how I would hang it, etc. He wrote down measurements of the frame, the lip and the rabbet depth. Finally he asked what kind of paint is used on these frames because he can't possibly get them to look as silver polished as that. I said I had no idea. So he asked again. So I explained that I order the frames from distributors, I don't finish them myself. He asked a third time at which I responded with silence. There was an awkward staredown, and I said "Once again, I do not finish these frames, the manufacturer does."

For some reason he launched into a long schpeil about how he builds furniture and wants to finish some of them in this way. Maybe someday he'd also make some frames like this. I told him "good luck with that."

Does he really think I don't know what he was doing?? :nuts: I just don't know what the customer is thinking now. I seriously doubt that this was her idea. I need to call her, but I don't know how to say what I need to without sounding like I'm criticizing her contractor.
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Why worry about that? Some behaviour deserves to be citicized. Did your customer actually place the order? If not, and she sent her contractor in to snoop around and see if he could do it cheaper, you're really not losing anything if she gets her nose out of joint.
 
OH MY ... you let the customer borrow samples? I never let a sample out the door. I allow my customer to choose samples and then I bring the samples to the home. That gets me in the door to compliment other artwork and suggest alternatives. PLUS, I can't sell a moulding if the sample is out of the store. Just sayin'! *snack time* :)
 
Sounds like the contractor is trying to steal your order. Who knows if he discussed this with your customer, but my guess is he did. He most likely told them how you were charging too much and how he could save the day and do it for them instead. I always want to be upfront and honest with my customers. If I were you I would call them to follow up on the order and just see what the deal is.
 
Framing Queen said:
OH MY ... you let the customer borrow samples?
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We loan them out on a regular basis. I do not have the time to go to that many homes to "consult" without charging for it. On occasion, for good customers, or large orders we do home consultation. I'd much rather loan them out than have the customer make a wrong decision. I've never had them not come back, and I always get the order coupled with "The frame we chose is not the one I thought I would. I'm so glad you let me take these to my home."
 
I loan out samples too...no biggy most people do.
You should have just told the contractor you use ( fill in the blank) oil paint and spray lacquer. Then after he botches the job she will come back and order the frame wanted. Or you could have told him to try Documounts :p
 
Heck, I would have told him you lay on a coat of gesso, then you apply gold leaf using 23-carat sheets. Two minutes of trying it on his own and he might appreciate a fellow tradesman!
 
Lol! You guys are funny!! I don't think that quick on my feet. And Yes Dave, I did tell him too much. He got alot of answers out of me before I realized what he was doing. I thought he needed structural information for positioning and hanging.
 
He is just trying to make a living...its not personnel just business.. Right?

When he asks price, rabbit etc. you could have just asked,
"Are you bidding on this job too? You are the second person who has asked what finish is on this moulding."
Just because people ask you a question does not mean you have to answer them. Does it?
Start asking questions of him.

As far as info on one clients frame job goes you should not give it.
It would be up to your client to give it to them. She had the frame corners in her possession.

As far as the paint & finish goes. Tell the truth, "You have no idea. The guy who does the finish is not local and he will not even tell you".
 
I've had a couple of contractors to the exact same thing. they are in the process of building a nice custom house for the client when they overhear that their client is about to pay $xxxx for a frame, they jump in and say, "you know my guys can build you the same thing for much less"

I mean really, all it takes is a couple of 2x4s and some spray paint right?
 
recently i sold a job with an ornate frame that is fantabulous with the piece, though as it turns out, the high shine of the outer edge of the frame is catching too much sunlight in the morning and it bothers the customer.

Our solution is to use rub'n buff on the outer edge and since she realised i could custom color it in many ways, i took the sample and gave her a series of different color tones i can achieve, despite how she was convinced one in particular was perfect. She brought the sample home and was happy to see that the one she favored at the store was no where near perfect and she picked one of the others instead.

So lending our sample saved the day!
:)
 
I loan out a lot of samples to my decorators.It saves me and them time ,they dont have to bring in their customer that way.
 
Trude, I think I would call the customer, just for a friendly follow up. I assume she is well aware about what the contractor was trying to do. She might have complained a little about the price, which means she is not happy in the first place and this contractor was trying to do it for less money. Makes him look good in the eyes of his customer...not caring about how it makes you look.

Maybe a little more customer education might help; explaining (without too many details) why this price is what it is and what it represents. I would involve her in a friendly chat and make sure that at the end of this, she is fully aware what she is getting for this price.

I don't see the contractor as the problem, your customer is not happy or she wouldn't have mentioned this to her contractor.
 
It's ignorance on the part of both your customer and the contractor. Almost everyone puts framing down at the four sticks of wood with paint level. Even the designers on TV promote the attitude with the DIY garbage they use on their shows.

Yep, it's just four sticks with a finish you can't duplicate easily, quickly or cheaply. The framing industry has a major PR problem.
 
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