Mat Design Epiphany

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Ron Eggers

Ron Eggers

SPFG, Supreme Picture Framing God
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Originally posted by Rick Granick:
Ron & Edie the FG:

You have me intrigued about this "epiphany". Could you start a new thread regarding this mat color discussion? It sounds like good Grumble material!
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Rick,

Lately (just the past few months) I have been doing more and more designs with very neutral mats - often paper-base white, 8-ply rag, maybe with a painted bevel. I was thinking, "This is wrong, but it looks good to me." Then, in Atlanta, I took a design class from Greg Perkins (I highly recommend it) and he talked about guidelines. Things like "never use a mat that's lighter than the highlights in the image, darker than the shadows or brighter than the brightest colors. Except white looks very good with many images, especially with water-gilded gold frames that sell for about $75/foot." (You understand I'm paraphrasing. I left my notes at the shop.)

Then, after a quick showroom lunch on Sunday with Edie, MerpsMom, Mel and others (the dream lunch,) we started talking about mats. Edie said she likes to use neutral mats with really nice mouldings and maybe a fillet or two.

That probably doesn't sound like much of an epiphany, but Mel and I sat there and went, "Ah, yes," and I felt like I received some special goddess dispensation so I can cut my white mats and use more of those pricey moulding I have all over the wall.

Maybe Edie or Mel can explain it better. I'm sure they can.
 
I'm in total agreement about the wonderful "look" that is achieved when using only neutral rag mats and a fillet. Customers in my area have been a little slow in liking the "look" at the design counter. But whenever I have a finished piece framed in neutrals and hanging on the wall awaiting pickup, customers seem to be drawn to the picture.

It's always nice when customers drop their work off and say, "Just do whatever you want and I know I'll like it" amd it turns out to be a print or photograph that looks beautiful in neutrals!
 
I was about to write in and tell you guys what a big liar I am... and I walked around my house to just see how many framed pieces had colorful mats on them...
Living room:
Ten canvasses/oil on boards
-stacked frames, frames with liners or frames with fillets or all of the above.
Three watercolors
-two matted in 1604 and one in antique white
One aquatint
-1604 once again
One colored pencil
-1604 again
Seven antique snapshots (somebody elses' families)
-antique white.
One large polaroid
-mounted "edges exposed" on black rag.

The walls are red and I like those warmer whites in there.

I did find one dark green mat and a red linen mat in the orange kitchen.

I tend to be very opinionated and I don't always base it on anything rational! I think my fixation on neutral mats came about when I started painting my walls strong colors. I liked how the art seemed to pop, especially when the mats were clean lookin. But this ain't nothing new- I have noticed many customers these days coming in and telling me about their dark green halls and faux-finished powder rooms, not to mention wallpaper and it seemed to make sense to let the mat be somewhat of a visual "oasis" around the art.
Although I have also noticed that it is possible (and advisable) to totally break the rules now and then- I have seen some absolutely resplendent presentations that should not have "worked."
Like Ron said, I love to throw a fillet onto a frame- even more so than on the mat. There are always those archival concerns, but I like the way a fillet transforms the shape of the frame- that touch of further customization is the next best thing to a totally custom finish.
Wow, Ron, "an epiphany," I think I owe you ten bucks now!

Lately I have been on a few new mat kicks...
I like those gray/beige stone putty tumbleweed colors- especially on diplomas. And if they're a solid core, all the better. In fact, solid cores in any color looks yummy to me. I once framed some prints from Paris that came to me already matted- in a solid core turquoise! Goosebumps! Could a slightly grayed turquoise be the next new neutral?

Did anyone see the framed models at the Max Moulding booth -wow, were those creative and elegant. I saw watercolored mats- that looked splotchy-ish, almost like foxing! And a beautiful randomly gold-leafed 4-ply bevel- rough and refined at the same time. And I believe I saw some newspaper and decorative paper collaged onto the surface of a mat- a very subtle touch. Time for a play day!
edie the antiquewhite goddess
 
I use a lot of neutral mats too, usually on top with a hint of colour underneath. I really like browns, greys, and blacks, and earthtones in general. I can usually justify it to the customers by telling them that while that while four inches of BRIGHT blue looks good right now, there is a fair chance that they're going to get tired of it much more quickly, and it won't be as versatile if they decide to move the piece to another location than where originally planned, or redecorate.

I love bright white mats on anything with very bright colours like a lot of contemporary art and abstracts, and green-tint, blue-tint or truer black and white photos. Sepias I usually go for something like Mustang or Fawn suede as a topmat, or else one of the cream-coloured 4-plys. I don't care for the look of 8-ply mats except in the bright white and I'm not a big fillet person. I attached the wood fillets to frames much more often than I use them on mats. I really like the fancy faux-fillets with the handmade paper looks and swirly finishes, but they're a bit out of price range for most of my customers. The other framer will paint the canvas liners different colours for people, but I refuse to do it because I like them neutral and I haven't seen one of them finished that I thought looked decent.

I love subtle texture... most of my orders use the stone-look paper mats, suede or other fabric mats. I hate the kind of grid pattern on the paper of the regular matboards, so even when I don't use a printed or fabric mat I usually gravitate towards one of the smooth ones or the 4-plys.

I do have an irrational attraction to Noel suede. Whenever we get in one of the 40x60 sheets I always want to put it on the floor and roll around on it. I have no idea why, and none of the other colours do it for me.

Everyone else in the store comes and gets me whenever they need help designing something or get stuck (or they have a problem customer
), so I must be doing something right. Either that or my coworkers are just closet colourblind.
 
Originally posted by Jin Wicked:
I can usually justify it to the customers by telling them that while that while four inches of BRIGHT blue looks good right now, there is a fair chance that they're going to get tired of it much more quickly, and it won't be as versatile if they decide to move the piece to another location than where originally planned, or redecorate.
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Yes!! Greg Perkins talked about the neutral mats as a better value for the customer. While it might seem like good business for them to bring back the frame every few years to change the mat as the wall color and decor change, you can build more customer loyalty by giving them a more timeless look. Beside, who wants to spend their days replacing all those avocado mats.

I hope others will share their design philosphies. I suppose this belongs on the design forum but . . . it's like herding cats. :D

BTW, this is the kind of stuff total strangers would talk about on the 7 minute shuttle ride from the hotels to the Expo in Atlanta.
 
Jin,

Don't be surprized if Grumblers start showing up at your shop with a camcorder in one hand and a sheet of Noel suede in the other.

Does anyone know why so many mats have that cross-hatch texture that most of us hate? Did it start out as a more forgiving surface to hide overcuts? Is it easier to manufacture? Anybody?

I will get to the bottom of this!

And Edie, I think what we do for ourselves has not much bearing on what we to for our customers. We can do outrageous mats and, if we tire of them, we can change them any time. Also, we'll have only the little voice inside saying, "What have you done???" instead of hearing that from a paying customer. I even use some of those non-C/P decorative Whitecore Crescent mats on my own work cause I'm pretty sure I won't come back in ten years and sue myself. (No offense to Crescent, but why did you put the Elizabeth Dow Collection on rag and the Decorative Specialties on Whitecore?)
 
This is a very interesting subject for me. One of my weakest areas. :(

Your ideas are great.

Ron,
Didn't you purchase a book on design? What was it and do you think it will help someone like me? Mabe FG should teach a class. Sorry I missed the one she taught at lunch, but I was checking out a Wizard at the time. :D
 
Neutral mats are especially useful for polychrome
items. Warm, light grays can provide a value that
is, as Greg suggested, below the lights in the work, while they do not emphasize any of the hues
in the work. Brigtht colors can be great
for decorative applications, but they can heighten
our perception of the hues in the work that relate
to the color of the board. A neutral shade allows
all the colors of the work to speak for themselves. Fortunately, there is an ever expanding range of neutral shades of board on the market today.

Hugh
 
Great Topic! I missed the class in Atl on Design. I can't get away from nuetrals and love solid rag.
Framing Goddess wrote "two matted in 1604.. and one in antique white...One aquatint..1604 once again...1604 again"
I'd have to ditto what she wrote.

Someone please answer Rons Question's
"Does anyone know why so many mats have that cross-hatch texture that most of us hate? Did it start out as a more forgiving surface to hide overcuts? Is it easier to manufacture? Anybody?"

I'd like to know also.
 
Regarding the cross-hatch pattern on matboards, I was told by somebody years ago at one of the ABC shows that it was an attempt to give certain matboards a "canvas" look.

I don't believe this individual had anything to do with matboard manufacture so the grains of salt are over on the other end of the post! ;)

Framerguy
 
We use a lot of the neutrals for all the above reasons, and I'm glad to know that it isn't just laziness on my part from a design point of view.
But I also love v-grooves. Adding them seems to give the whole neutral palette a subtle extra. I especially like them on the solid core boards. Anyone v-grooved an 8-ply with success? I'm afraid to try it :( but would love to use it on an up-coming TopMat project. Any encouragement or tips from y'all?
 
In paper making processes, cores and surface papers are pressed together, usually between rollers, and textures make the bond stronger. I suspect there were some problems with surface papers separating and a cross hatching embossing roller was added to make the bond between surface paper and core stronger.

Long ago as an engineer I worked on projects to keep the layers together in 2 ply toilet paper - we called it ply bonding. This eventually led to the textured papers of today. They sell you air instead of paper - 30 years ago there were 1000 sheets on a roll. I have seen rolls as low as 180 sheets lately, and the roll is just as big.
 
Originally posted by John Gornall CPF:
Long ago as an engineer I worked on projects to keep the layers together in 2 ply toilet paper - we called it ply bonding.
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I just knew we'd get to bottom of this - in the end! Thanks for helping to wipe out ignorance, John.
 
John,

That makes a heck of alot more sense to me than the "canvas" theory that I heard.

Ron, do you suppose we could ................... "wipe" the slate clean on this mystery?

FGII
 
Many of the surface papers (not pebble!) from Crescent are available as Canson art papers at art supply stores. I thought the various patterns were there to provide "tooth" for pastel, charcoal and pencil. Which came first, the paper or the board?

I wonder if Nona or Hugh know more about this. Maybe Ellen does too, she sells art supplies.

I don't like the crosshatch when I see it in a corner sample, but from across a room I can't tell it's there unless it is hanging next to a smooth mat.
 
Speaking of Canson, has anyone used the Canson mat boards with Mi Tientes (sp) facing papers? I know everyone has seen these- they have those lovely flecks in them and come in a myriad of grays, beiges and some darks- like burgundy. They have a nice tooth to them. I think they are alpha cellulose. I saw them at a booth in Atlanta of a place in Connecticut and ordered a corner sample set. I like the idea of matching a mat color to the artwork paper color (which is another way I got hooked on neutral mats)... wouldn't it be cool to have the burgundy mat exactly match the burgundy pastel paper?
 
This is why trade shows pay for themselves--on the bus, lunch, standing around waiting for the floor to open--people/framers share.

Yes, Edie should teach a design class because class is what she has. Sitting between Edie and Ron while having this discussion, I indeed had that ephiphany. Now that I was feeling confident with those complex design, I found myself questioning their lasting attraction. (Kit or MM can clean up this sentence.)

After the lunch/class, and on my way to UMS to put in my order, I paid special attention to the matting at the various booths. Almost without fail, the moulding suppliers matted in neutrals, with a fillet or faux fillet/BevelAccent, with 4 to 6 inch mats and a to-kill-for moulding. The samples at the booths of the matboard companies were almost always complex and/or colorful. The neutrals were definitely elegant, the triple mats with fancy cutout corners were crafty.

Now, I think there is a place for each. Many customers want the crafty look, and some of what they want framed isn't hurt by it. But I have to agree with all of the foregoing posts that those beautiful, wide, perfectly flat offwhite mats are gorgeous. Besides they're a perfect set-up for our best mouldings. ;)

PS: Edie, do I gain a teensy bit of FG status by truthfully admitting Wheat (1604) is one of my favorite mats? Also TY's York (2143). Rolling around on them hadn't occurred to me though. :rolleyes:
 
Just a tad off-topic but now, when I read your posts, Mel, I can see your face and hear your voice. That never happened before Atlanta and it's a priceless and magical feeling.

Thanks to all of you who talked me into going to the Expo. I can see your faces and hear your voices, too.
 
I have to agree with Jin here. My current favorite mat is Bainbridge's Chinese red silk. I use it as many times as the art work (and the customers) will allow to absolutely ZOWIE effect.

I would estimate that about half of the framing I do is for decorative purposes. The art and its presentation are both chosen to be part of a room's 'look'. When the look changes, so does the art. Since the customer and I both know that we are dealing with a temporary arrangement, it frees us to experiment with things like bold color and funky design. Often the art, mat color and frame are of equal importance.

At the other end of the spectrum is 'framing for the ages'. This is the sort of job where conservation/preservation are the primary concerns and the color of the sofa isn't mentioned. The item being framed is the only important element in this sort of presentation and neutal mats are mandated.

Another instance where I prefer neutral mats is when framed pieces are grouped - especially when the grouping is a work in progress. This morning on my way to the kitchen for coffee, I counted thiry-one framed pictures hanging in my stairway. All of them have neutral mats; there's no way color would work in that situation.

So it looks like I come down at either end of this discussion; either bold, strong color or no color at all.

Kit
 
Mel, a teensy bit? Hardly!
You are a full-fledged Framing Goddess.

I wish wheat came in a solid core.
And 8 ply too, while we're at it.

***********************************************************
PSSSSSST-Don't tell anyone, but we are all Framing Goddesses! Even you, Ron!! ***********************************************************
 
Great discussion!

I think the surface texture you are referring to is known as a "laid" finish paper. (No remarks, Ron). In traditional papermaking this texture is created by the screen on which the paper pulp is laid. In commercial papermaking I assume it is embossed.

Personally, I am a big fan of the flannel textured mats, so I tend to pull these out first for top mat use. They have a nice range of neutrals, with tints from cream to green to blue and brown, as well as some deeper shades. I feel that the flannel texture cuts the starkness of the top mat a bit, and is comfortable for the eye to view. One of my absolute favorite mats is Alpha8881 Feldspar (w. blue core). I also like C1637 English Stone, A8802 Aztec Sand, A8803 Mesa Pink (miss that pink-core version!), and TV2143 York. Another one of my favorites is the raw silk B4961 Mink.

For you solid-rag color-all-the-way-thru fans, have you seen Crescent's new series of 8ply colors? Some nice solids in sage green colors and green-grays, etc. Very nice!

I agree that one of the nice things about going to a trade show is talking with strangers who are actually as fascinated by these kinds of topics as we are.

:cool: Rick
 
Oh yes, Rick! I love the Mink silk, especially on old photos. The bright white core is nasty on great grandma, though. Just have to sell 'em a fillet.

Kit
 
Just a tad off-topic but now, when I read your posts, Mel, I can see your face and hear your voice. That never happened before Atlanta and it's a priceless and magical feeling. "

That is so true, Ron. I have always said the camaraderie was the #1 benefit of PPFA. I guess you can say the same for the Grumble.
 
Originally posted by markg1:
Didn't you purchase a book on design? What was it and do you think it will help someone like me?
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The book I bought was Color & Design for the Picture Framer by Nona Powers. I already had a 10-year-old spiral bound version with hand-pasted color photos that was signed by Nona before she became my new best friend. I think I might frame that one.

This book is $30, it forms the basis for Nona's classes and I think it can help anyone - even you, Mark. It's available from Decor, the PPFA bookstore or, presumably, from Nona's website (See any of her posts.) I bought Decor's display model, so I guess it sold pretty well.

I don't mind giving Nona a plug but, honestly, you can hardly go wrong with any of the books from those first two sources. Hers is the best on design and color that I've seen, though. When I ran down to the Decor booth (thanks for the reminder) I grabbed everything I didn't already have and probably a few that I did. I came away with $234 worth of books that will go a long way toward updating my library. And thanks to Framerguy for lugging them all over the 3-mile trek to my van so I could carry my new AMP mitre sander.

Next year I'm bringing a little red wagon.
 
Ron,

I bought that book In January at the WCAF in LV. I read a chapter a month to digest it slowly and to get the design 'truths' into practice. It is the clearest explanation for why some things look good and why some don't I have read. Mark, you do want this book.

Jo, you must get there next year to add your face and voice to our repertoire.

Magical Mel
 
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