Making display copies to preserve the original

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Rebecca

Rebecca

SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer
Joined
Feb 28, 2002
Posts
3,338
Loc
Vancouver, B.C., Canada
I just came across this on the textile distribution list - Timothy Vitale (one of the big name paper conservators) uses Epson 9600
large format printer with UltraChrome inks to make copies. The quotable quote was "It isn't cheap, but it works quite well."

So for those of you who are into that kind of thing, this may be an option to explore.

Rebecca
 
I made a Xerox of a cross-stitch once, years ago, on one of those big machines at a copy store. I was astonished at the detail - with double matting and under glass, the original and the Xerox would have been nearly identical.

That is a great idea, Rebecca, because we all run into customers who want priceless fragile, rotting fabric art framed and yours would be an ideal solution. Then the original could be stored safely in a dark location.

Thanks! You are so great to give us all these terrific tips, hints, and ideas!
 
Mar - he was actually refering to paper artifacts, like newspaper, photographs etc., but the query was started by some one wondering how this was done:

http://www.byardart.co.uk/gallery/SN.htm

He thought it was done by scanning. As art images, they are quite striking, but I don't know about being stand-ins for the original. However, if you had luck with your sampler... There certainly have been textile treatments that have used scanned images printed on fabric to create underlays for areas of loss.

Isn't there an ad on TV that goes "Oh, the possibilities..."?

Actually, looking at thoses images and the "photogram" title, I had a long ago friend who did photograms, and I think the process involves laying things on photographic paper and exposing them to light - it wasn't a scanning process. Sometimes these things make my head spin!

Rebecca

[ 03-26-2003, 11:50 PM: Message edited by: Rebecca ]
 
Makes my head spin as well. We've been dealing with issues such as these at many times over the last few months. I agree, totally, that if the original image is in 'delicate' condition or there is value issues that arise, the best senario is to copy the image and frame the copy while storing the original is a safe, dry, acid free enviornment.

The methods of reproduction could be another entire thread (probably alrady is).

Ted
 
Rebecca--we use an epson 7600 with ultrachrome inks to print reproductions of old photographs, newspaper articles and other works that are best treated as non-display originals. Works great, once you have mastered scanning, photoshop & digital printing.
 
We do the scanning and digital editing but then have our digital files printed by a professional photo lab on real Kodak photo paper. Not inkjet prints - these are high quality prints printed on standard photo paper exposed from the digital file and then developed as usual. They are available at our lab up to 48 inches by 96 inches. As with standard photo prints these are easily drymounted laminated and they have a long life. Rebbeca - in Vancouver this service is available at ABC Photocolor - great quality!! And they will do all the digital work for you if you're not into it.
 
That's good to know John - thanks. Can they be printed as silver gelatin on fiber based? At the moment I'm not really interested in doing this myself, but it's good to have places to refer people to.

Rebecca
 
The machines John's labs use probably are printing on RC paper. We use Fuji color paper and Kodak black and white in our machines. Labs can get different paper surfaces (gloss, matte, semi, etc), but I believe fiber based paper is going to be used only by hand printers in trays or table-top processors.
 
All the current digital printers being used by labs use only RC paper. It is the same paper the professional labs have been using for the last few years, just a different way of inputing the image. We have been sending all our images out for the last year as digital files and getting regular RC prints back. Fiber based was never something that could be used on an automated printer, it's always been only for those who could use an enlarger and trays. My husband still occasionally does some in his darkroom.

Rebecca, I think you just answered a question for me. I have a project that involves printing the photo and bio on about 500 people from our area who served in WWII. They will all be framed for display and I was debating what was the best way to print them. I think I'm going to go with printing them on our Epson 1280 (it's a smaller cousin of the 9600 and 7600's) on an archival paper using archival inks. They are going to be 8 1/2 by 11 when done, so we don't need to use a big printer.
 
A question for Anne (or anyone else for that matter!)

Is the archival paper different than RC? In conservation circles RC isn't considered archival, so if what you're refering to is different, I'd love to know brand names. Thanks.

Rebecca

[ 03-27-2003, 09:16 PM: Message edited by: Rebecca ]
 
Archival (inkjet) paper and RC paper are for completly different uses. RC paper is only for use in traditional photographic processes. It needs to be processed using chemicals and can't be run through an inkjet printer. The archival paper I'm refering to can't be used for traditional photographic processes, it is a rag paper coated to accept archival inks from an inkjet printer. The only paper that is archival for use with traditional photographic processes (using chemicals to develop it) is fiber based and that can only be used to print black and white photos. All color photos are on RC.
 
Rebecca--Two sites I use for inkjet papers are MIS Supply and Digital Art. Crane Museo is a nice, thick, nongloss paper with a fairly smooth surface. Not sure how to draw the line on archival for RC papers. I don't think anything beats a hand print on fiber-based paper that is fixed properly. Fuji claims crystal archive RC is good for 60 years; I believe Kodak puts 28 years on its color.
 
I'm glad I tracked into this conversation--was researching educating on archival issues--resurrected PFM 10/99 magazine p.110 by Paul Messia re RC Photo Deterioration: RC papers are resin-coated, layered-- those from the '70's have been "losing cohesion", self-destructing via oxidation process from the titanium dioxide used
in pigment; also notes that these RC papers degrade similarly to textiles and watercolors--so very strong recommendation for UV-filtering. Messia recommends archival storage of original material/negative and display of high-quality print on fiber-based paper. I can't tell if the RC process has shifted since then so that this is not a problem, or if it's with the time and tide of 30 years that we're seeing this...anyone up on this?
 
Early RC photos where very unstable, photographers would start see problems only a few years after they were printed, especially on the color ones. The last research I saw, which was about 10 years ago, was that the newer RC papers were much more stable and the photo companies have continued to improve them. Of course, like anything, you get what you pay for. One of the problems is you can only do black & white prints on fiber based paper, the only long term color photographic process is a cibachrome and that is becoming something of a lost art.
 
Ah, but it's polyester plastic. Nothing outlasts polyester. Isn't it nice to know that all those '70's leisure suits will be with us for a long, long time?


Rebecca
 
RC (Resin Coated) photographic paper - the photo isn't in the paper, it's in the coating. The top coating with the emulsion in it can be easily stripped away from the paper. That's how we make canvas photo prints. The difficult part is not preserving the paper, it's preserving the image.

Rag paper used in inkjet printers is also coated to receive the ink, again the image is not on the paper.

Old black and white photos on fiber based paper suit paper conservation techniques to greatly extend the life of the picture. Photos on coated papers may have their life extended somewhat by paper conservation techniques but preserving the actual image may suit more practical treatments such as copies or digital storage.

Our shop has recomended making copies for framing and storing originals in suitable materials in the dark for the past 15 years.

And as I have mentioned on this forum before, being able to prepare good copies also results in more framing as more than one copy needs more than one frame.
 
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