Location, location...destination?

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framebots

framebots

CGF II, Certified Grumble Framer Level 2
Joined
Sep 26, 2009
Posts
232
Loc
King, NC
Well, after 10 years, we're investigating the move to a new location. We had invested heavily in what we thought was a great high traffic location, and as the economy turned (and a little before), we were unable to draw the traffic we needed. So, my question is this(and I know it can and will differ greatly from shop to shop): After 35 years of business and a pretty loyal clientele, how important is a highly visible location?

I know we always want the ideal situation, lowest rent possible with the most (and best) traffic. I also realize we, more than ever, need to be drawing in new and younger customers. I was just wondering if any have made the difficult decision one way or the other and how that decision has played out?
 
You have to pay every month in advertising for a bad location.... if you don't business will stop
So you pay it to the advertisers.
If you are creative and love to advertise this is a viable one..
.
One thing about advertising you have to do some no matter where you are.
.
You also pay every month for a good location.
This one you pay it to the landlord.
You still have to advertise some but not as much if you stop advertising with this one. Your business will slow but probably not stop. That is until the location does not generate enough customers to pay the landlord..

Something you might do before you move. Figure up how much more you would be paying in rent. Then see how much advertising that can buy you for a year. Then put that money in advertising for one year. If your business does improve more than what you paid out stay? But don't forget to ADVERTISE CONSTANTLY!~

Is it your location or the demographics in your area. Demographics = good Location

You may have done the above if So then Move and Move quick....... But when you do advertise the new location really heavy the first three months I would use up half my ad budget the first year in the first three months then use a 3rd for Oct Nov Dec the rest for the other 7 months.
 
This is a little different, but when we had the sign shop, after 10 years me moved it a block off the highway. Most of our customers where establish and it wasn't and to find. It was a better, larger location with better packing. We still managed to gain additi customers.

How many of your customers find you by driving or walking by? We've only been open a year here and it would be a death sentence to move right now. We are constantly having people find us by driving by and seeing us. But also people that call and ask directions. I just know for us it would be bad. In 5, 10, 15 years? I think it would fly.

Also depends on your competition. If customers have to drive one or more frame shops to get to you, you know some of them are going to the other shop (sometimes even think it's you).

not sure if that helps or not, but there it is!
 
One thing I always look at is buying patterns. Where are your customers doing their other shopping. For me I try to go into the same center as the major grocery in the area. In my area that is Kroger or Giant Eagle. These anchors pull in just about everyone from the area on a weekly basis. They can't help but notice other shops in the center. It also gives an easy landmark to tell people where you're at.

Yes, I do pay a premium for that space, but I still think it is worth it.
 
Location, location, location... That's old school thinking. Nowadays it should be, "Website, website, website."

If you have an awesome website, it makes up for a lackluster location. If you're thinking of moving to a low traffic, poor visibility area, make sure you have a polished, highly optimized website.
 
I see on you website that you have 2 locations, one in Winston-Salem and the other in King. The second location looks to be in an industrial park rather then a retail center and I couldn't actually find your other location on Google street view. I think you might be in the center with the Dollar Tree. If so, this is not what I would call a high end property or a place that would draw customers that fit the demographic that a frame shop needs.
 
Masterpiece said:
Location, location, location... That's old school thinking. Nowadays it should be, "Website, website, website."

If you have an awesome website, it makes up for a lackluster location. If you're thinking of moving to a low traffic, poor visibility area, make sure you have a polished, highly optimized website.
Click to expand...

Matt, what software or template did you use on your site? Is that wordpress or another CMS?
thanks,
 
I was downtown....in the middle of a strip surrounded by a workout place n antiques....
I moved out to the main drag in town and have been busier than when I first started.... oh and I don't have a web site. Facebook...... way easier to change. :popc:
 
our shop is just a few blocks from city centre. Rent is cheaper, we have easy car parking, easy access. I think this is essential as 70% of customers are women, and probably half of those have kids, so ease of getting in out quick and easy is more preferable then have to park in town and walk with kids and artwork etc.
We never advertise, not even in yellow pages, no website, just word of mouth and direct marketing.
No other shops near us, definitely no walking traffic.
There is however a school next block down the road, which means every year there are always new customers.
Thought of moving once, and the first thing i started to notice was getting to a new location,having to drive around a block, do uturns, number of parks etc. instead epanded our shop when the shed behind came vacant.

If you are looking, look from a customers point of view, how easy is it to get there, find, park. As for demographics, yes close to a school is good, or a large store. But unless your selling giftware or a gallery, a custom framer does not need to be near high traffic, your reputation will bring them to you.
 
i-FRAMER said:
...We never advertise, not even in yellow pages, no website, just word of mouth and direct marketing.
No other shops near us, definitely no walking traffic...

If you are looking, look from a customers point of view, how easy is it to get there, find, park. As for demographics, yes close to a school is good, or a large store. But unless your selling giftware or a gallery, a custom framer does not need to be near high traffic, your reputation will bring them to you.
Click to expand...

And how do these customers find you to begin with so that you can get this reputation?
 
Small sample size, so reader beware. In St. Louis I am aware of 4 frame shops who moved from long term "retail" locations into industrial park/out of the way locations. All failed. The thinking that they will follow you is a powerful one and somewhat accurate. But the truth is that you always need new customers and many of them might not think to trek to some out of the way place to do biz with you the first time.
 
framebots said:
Well, after 10 years, we're investigating the move to a new location. We had invested heavily in what we thought was a great high traffic location, and as the economy turned (and a little before), we were unable to draw the traffic we needed. So, my question is this(and I know it can and will differ greatly from shop to shop): After 35 years of business and a pretty loyal clientele, how important is a highly visible location?

I know we always want the ideal situation, lowest rent possible with the most (and best) traffic. I also realize we, more than ever, need to be drawing in new and younger customers. I was just wondering if any have made the difficult decision one way or the other and how that decision has played out?
Click to expand...

What prompted you to look for a new location?
Rent too high in the current one?
Not the amount of traffic you were expecting? Why did you expect that, and why hasn't it happened?

Like you, I am looking at new locations. Right now I am in a destination location and almost not visible to passing by traffic (I have no front windows, no outside walls, just a small door). People find me through my website and word of mouth. When they are looking for framing; that's when they find me.

I want to be appealing to the younger customers as well and reach them through social media. What do you want to offer them? What product would make them come into your shop? Most of them are not that interested in framing to start with. You have to plant seeds into their minds (wedding photos framed...baby photos framed.....art for the young professional etc.etc.) and I think that the best way to do it is with a website and social media.

For me, based upon my current customers, the most important thing about location is parking close to the store. Easy parking, easy access. That is my priority when looking for a new space.
Windows in front would be a close second.
 
It's still location...

framebots said:
Well, after 10 years... ...We had invested heavily in what we thought was a great high traffic location, and as the economy turned (and a little before), we were unable to draw the traffic we needed. So, my question is this(and I know it can and will differ greatly from shop to shop): After 35 years of business and a pretty loyal clientele, how important is a highly visible location?
Click to expand...

Visibility and Easy Access play a big role in a framing business success. Despite a solid advertising plan, good customer service and creative framing, we find the fact that convenience often outweighs all of these when it comes to drawing new clinetele. :shrug: "I just drove by and saw you" will often trump fantastic marketing.

We have observed that despite our 34 years of reputation, marketing, and a highly visible location with heavy traffic, that our move in 2009 has draw tons of new people through the front door, as the newer location is "even more visible".

framebots said:
...I know we always want the ideal situation, lowest rent possible with the most (and best) traffic.
Click to expand...

Finding that right combination at a good price is the trick. Investing in a premium location means finding landlords that aren't GREEDY. High priced real estate is as much about individual greed as it is great location....so shop around. Deals can be made and there exist realistic property owners.

framebots said:
...I also realize we, more than ever, need to be drawing in new and younger customers. I was just wondering if any have made the difficult decision one way or the other and how that decision has played out?
Click to expand...

You may have read the thread, where we expanded into a larger and more expensive location in 2009, so YES...made that difficult decision. [thread=41465]The Big Move[/thread]

Attracting "new and younger customers" is not as simple as abandoning a good retail location or dropping conventional advertising and just rely on a website and social media. It's just not that simple. You need to do it all. :thumbsup:

Ylva said:
..I want to be appealing to the younger customers as well and reach them through social media. What do you want to offer them? What product would make them come into your shop? Most of them are not that interested in framing to start with. You have to plant seeds into their minds (wedding photos framed...baby photos framed.....art for the young professional etc.etc.) and I think that the best way to do it is with a website and social media...
Click to expand...

That's it.... visibility.. website.. social media.. and emotional offerings that appeal to their desires/needs...



Good luck and best wishes in your decision...

John
 
We're located in a plaza with a Bed Bath and Beyond. It's also off a 6 lane road that becomes a highway heading Northwest out of Tucson. We get a lot of drivebys and walk throughs because of the pull of the large anchor store. We don't advertise much (mailers and such). But we always ask how new customers found us and the answer after "so and so recommended you" was, "We googled custom framing." Being in a large anchor store plaza helps for people to find us very easily. I also think being in a location that's easy to get into. I know I avoid stores if I feel I might get into an accident if I just make a simple right hand turn.
 
FramerDave said:
And how do these customers find you to begin with so that you can get this reputation?
Click to expand...

Word of mouth mostly. We went to all the art societies, photographic club, etc and offered their members a discount card.
We went a visited all the galleries to offer our services and the quality products that we use.
So by direct marketing and targeting groups, and providing the best framing possible our business has grown every year.
We now do work for all the major galleries here, and they refer customer to us as well. Just about every new customer says to us i was recommend to you.
We even have customers from other towns (which have other framers there).

New galleries when they open always come to us, because we do work for most galleries and they want/need the same quality.

We don't do anything cheap, as we don't want our work to look cheap. If a customer is not happy, we do it again at our cost.

Please note, that we are a customer framer, not a gallery, we don't sell anything else, not even premade frames. We only do custom framing. I have tried a bit of retil here and that failed, as we have no walkins just looking. Customers are only coming to us for custom framing.
So if you do have a gallery or sell other items, then i do believe you need good exposure, and be in the right traffic.
I have seen plenty of business fail here in cairns because they were just around the corner or in the next block and missed all the walking traffic.
we strive for 100% satisfaction, i would rather not charge somebody if they were not happy and i couldn't please. (and i have done this, although they insisted they still pay)

Perhaps the fact that there are no other shops around us, makes us stand out. Not lost in the crowd so to speak.

please note that we are not a gallery or sell anything else -not even premades. We are just custom framers.
If you are a gallery or sell other items, then yes you will need good exposure.
I have seen many business fail here because they were around the corner or next block down, from the major walking traffic.
 
Great responses one and all, but then again what would you expect?

Yes, we currently have two locations, one a very nice gallery space in a decent sized city, the other a small frame shop in a small town. When we moved to our larger store, we were betting on higher visibility and the foot traffic of Panera Bread to bring in a good client base. It has worked to some extent, but not enough to justify the expense.

I have focused significantly on our website and SEO, we currently rank pretty high in those areas. In my opinion, this is one of the most important aspects of our business, especially when it comes to drawing in a younger clientele.

The "out of the way" location I am talking about is in a shopping area that was once well regarded, but (due to internal situations within the family) has been vacant for years. It sits adjacent to a VERY high end, established neighborhood and the new managers are aggressive in both their pricing and their commitment to reviving the area. The clencher is the other new tenant that would be moving in beside us, a very well known designer/furniture store with a good reputation. This in and of itself could create a nice destination for our products.

I'm pretty sure the decision has been made depending on how we can work with the landlords, and I will keep you all posted.

Thanks for all of the great responses, much food for thought!
 
Glad to hear that you have a little bit more clarity. Sometimes all it takes it typing out your thoughts to get the flow going again. Sometimes I will ask questions here that deep down I already know the answers to. It just helps to bring them to the surface.
 
Exposure

Exposure. How important is it? How much value will it bring? What should I pay for exposure?

Depends.

If you are exposed daily to every pet in town - in itself, it brings no value - they aren't your clients.
You need to define your target client - your ideal potential (& existing) paying wallets. You need exposure to them!
Thats where the value is.
Simply volume doesn't pay your bills!

You also need to have what they want.

You need to let them know you have it, and they want it!

You need to make it easy for them to get it.

If you are the only one that has all four of these, you can maintain higher prices & therefore profits.

If you are a custom framer & locate where everyone has easy access and you try to model your store
to sell everything to everyone - good luck!

If you provide low end framing at super discount prices & work on volume, locate beside McDonalds or WalMart.

But if your main market is automotive art, you'd be better off located right beside
Andy's Auto Museum thats been in the quiet light-industrial part of town for 50 years - traffic is low but
rent is cheap & you hit all the car buffs with your neon sign!
 
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