lifesaver mat pricing

farmgirl1

True Grumbler
Joined
Oct 13, 2002
Posts
62
Loc
Centreville, Va
I've solved most of the pricing issues I've had with my new Lifesaver software. I think I will loveit when I am more confortable with it, but am having trouble with mat pricing. Question wasn't answered by the help desk, although others were. Previously, I would have a minimum price for a small mat to cover the price of matboard. Don't seem to be able to do that with this pricing scheme. The default pricing doesn't work at all. How have others set this up?
 
You can set a minimum charged for your mat. Go to where you price by the United Inch. If your minimum mat price is $5. and your regular mat price is .40 per UI, set up your table as follows:

1 UI 5.00
2 UI 5.00
3 UI 5.00
4 UI 5.00
5 UI 5.00
6 UI 5.00
7 UI 5.00
8 UI 5.00
9 UI 5.00
10 UI 5.00
11 UI 5.00
12 UI 5.00
13 UI 5.20
14 UI 5.60
15 UI 6.00...and so on, adding .40 for each united inch

this is why I've spent a gazillion hours setting it up. If anyone knows an easier way, please let me know.
 
Here's an idea: Lifesaver "defaults" mats into various classes, class 3 I believe--altho I'm home and don't have it in front of me--for paper mats and 5,6,7,8 for commonly used rag mts and 12, 13, 14 for those fabrics and specialties. Again, I'm guessing but you get the idea.

OK: and this is Jay Goltz's idea and I'm borrowing: divide your mats into these "brackets": up to 11 x 14, 11 x 14 to 16 x 20, over 16 x 20 to 32 x 40 and over this to 40 x 60. Then set your price into these "brackets"

Hence a 12 x 16 mat would fall into the 16 x 20 bracket; a 22 x 28 mat would fall into the 32 x 40 brakcet, etc.

Then price your mat classs according to these formulations. thus if a paper mat, for example, cost $5 for a 32 x 40, the 16 x 20 (one-fourth of the mat size) would be at a cost of $5 devided by 4. then markup as you please.

I don't like united inches, altho there is a Lifesaver mode for that too, because in the real world of business you're not using united inches, your using square feet and square inches.

Just another idea. We have found this to be the most helpful way in mat pricing and one which yields a good profit.

Again, thanks to Jay.
 
Hi

I'll try to clear up the confusion for all 3 grumblers:

MIKE: Lifesaver "defaults" mats into various classes
Actually this was the old method, which is no longer available in the new (Tru-Vue) version of LifeSaver. The standard version has an option in CONFIGURE called "Use Mat Markup table", which will convert to the newer mat pricing method, if desired. It prices the mats just like it does mouldings, with a multiplier and definable price ranges. We recently switched our shop over by checking that option, and highly recommend it.

FARMGIRL1: I think I will loveit when I am more confortable with it, but am having trouble with mat pricing. Question wasn't answered by the help desk, although others were. Previously, I would have a minimum price for a small mat to cover the price of matboard. Don't seem to be able to do that with this pricing scheme. The default pricing doesn't work at all. How have others set this up?
In most cases, the multiplier will more than cover the cost of a full sheet when you are only selling part of the sheet and retaining the rest as sellable inventory/stock. However, this question has been asked before and there is an easy solution. If you click on PRICE -> SPECIALS: NAME, you can define a new check mark on the ticket screen called "Mat Adj" to accomodate a slight mat upcharge. Be sure to click on price, hit the right arrow until you find this item, and then populate the price card with whatever fee you would like to add. At the ticket screen, you can check this new EXTRA to add a small surcharge. I hope this suggestion is helpful.

MARYANN: You can set a minimum charged for your mat. Go to where you price by the United Inch. If your minimum mat price is $5. and your regular mat price is .40 per UI, set up your table as follows:
this is why I've spent a gazillion hours setting it up. If anyone knows an easier way, please let me know.
Is your main menu all blue, or does it have some orange? The new Tru-Vue sponsored version will be all blue, and should NOT have the option to price mats by UI. It should show a multiplier system, just like mouldings do. If you are a new user and have an orange menu, I fear you may be working with an older demo version and not a live copy which was introduced in Atlanta. The pre-Atlanta demos were purely demos, the new ones can be registered and turned into full versions. If you are running strictly a demo version, you'll need to get the new CD. You may want to give the folks at LSS a call, or email me for a clearer explanation.

Best regards,
Mike
 
You're right Mike. I was confused. I set up the UI option for drymounting, not mats and wanted to have a minimum. I was working on it last night and realized I had posted wrong info. I do have the new version that I picked up in Atlanta.

My problem has been that I don't have a block of time to get it up and running. I've been working on it an hour one day, an hour the next. Can't complain though, business is good!

Trying to get all the prices set to my satisfaction. I'm starting to think that I just need to go with it and keep tweeking as I go along.

[ 10-11-2005, 08:37 AM: Message edited by: Maryann ]
 
Mike: now I"M the one that's confused. Am using Lifesaver 4.17.0 dated July 19 of this year and my program still shows mat classes. I also have a function in the "config" menu to price by UI but didn't like it due to its inflexibility so went back to the mat class system.

Are you telling me there's a new way to do it that has now eliminated mat classes?????

Clarification please
 
Maryann,

Excellent! Honestly, I don't think the price tweaking process ever ends. There isn't a week that goes by where I don't make some kind of adjustment/improvement here or there. Jump on in, the water is warm


Mike,

ok. So you purchased LifeSaver prior to the Atlanta show. (and it isn't a demo version). Yes, the standard version has the ability to price mats in two ways: A) The "old way" by mat classes and ui. B) The "new way" using a multiplier system that lets you group your pricing based on wholesale cost ranges. Ex: A mat costing $6 may have a 5x and a mat costing 8 may have a 4.5x (i'm just just making those up, they dont mean anything). It works just like the pricing in the moulding system.

On the classic version of LifeSaver: If you'd like to switch from the UI "mat classes" method (A), to the newer method (B), go to CONFIGURE and check "Use Mat Markup Table", and hit SAVE. Click on MATS from the main menu, and you'll see the changes immediately. Click on the Vendor Maintenance button to change the default markup ranges.

I hope I didn't just give you a headache!
If you'd like clarification, join me any time in the Live Chat system.

Best regards
Mike
 
Maybe someone would be willing to share their insight re the "multipier" system? After over 30yr on ui pricing systems I'm trying to figure out the lifesaver method. My question isn't about the multipier (mark ups) but about the "wholesale " mat price ranges. I'm having a hard time deciding where to set the ranges. Where have you set the ranges (from what to what) & why? Does that make sense?
 
Hi

Regardless if you are using a manual system or a POS, it takes some research of the local market and of your financial goals; to determine the appropriate pricing. Pricing varies greatly by area, and there are many reasons for this.

It comes 'out of the box' with an approximate/average pricing example, but every framer's goals and local market values will vary. It requires periodic fine tuning, just like a manual system. One advantage to a POS is that it will automatically mark up the retail price a bit, when there are wholesale price increases. It does this by using the new/adjusted cost times the multiplier you have chosen. The cost and item changes are transmitted regularly, and you can update at any time by clicking the "Update" button.

Perhaps it would help to do some exercises on paper, to compare what your old system would charge versus the computer/LifeSaver? By comparing the results side by side, I think it will make much more sense. It may also be a good time to re-evaluate this whole process, and do some comparative market research.

Some folks use the wholesale ranges, and others set them all the same. One example of it's use might be for someone who wants to charge a higher markup for "paper mats"(ex: 5x), and a regular markup for "rag, a/c, and archival mats"(ex: 3.6x). Their goal may be to minimize price resistance by making them closer in price.

This might be done by defining sheets costing 0.01-5.00 (the paper mats) with a 5x markup/multiplier, then 3.6x for 5.01-999.99 (everything else) The multipliers and costs in my example were made up, and shouldn't necessarily be taken seriously.

Markups can be defaulted globally, by vendor, or even by individual moulding or mat #.

Here are some tips compiled from a different thread: http://www.getthepictureframing.com/gfaq/LSS-TIPS.pdf

The mat markups are also explained in greater detail in the LifeSaver manual on pages 9-10 (hit F1 key while inside LifeSaver to get the manual on screen).

I hope this clears up some of the confusion. Feel free to visit the chat room if this isn't clear. Folks are there during business hours, every day. Don't be shy about stopping in any time. If no one is there to help, you also have the option to call LSS support.

Best regards,
Mike
Moderator
 
Okay, if we've got the doityourselfer stuff out of the way, how about the BUSINESS of professional framing? Anyone care to share their thoughts on how to divi up mat cost catagories in Lifesaver? I'm having a hard time narrowing it to 12 (I think that's the limit) with a cost range from about $5 to $105.
 
Oops posting at the same time. Just wanted to bump this back to the top. Thanks Mike. I'm working on it & I'll do some closer checking in the manual. But tell me if I'm looking at this wrong. These are just some made up numbers of course. Lets say in my old ui system I took mats with a cost of $6 to $8 & cut a 32x40 mat @ .50 ui. 72 x .5 = $36 & I've determined $36 is fair pricing on the $8 board & if I use a $6 board, well I make an extra $2. Not too bad. But if I use the same range ($6 to $8 cost) with a multipier the cost to the customer really varies for a very similar product, right? Use 6 for a multiplier. 6x$6 = the $36 I think I should make but 6x$8 = $48. I suppose I shouldn't complain but it seems a little unfair to the customer right? A small difference in cost seems to make too big a difference at retail with this method. And that's only a $2 increment in board cost. As mentioned, it looks like I have to account for $100 cost spread in 12 steps. What am I missing?
 
One thing that may need clarification:

The "From" and "To" price ranges are referring to the BASE COST of one full sheet. (before markup) ex: 72ui

My understanding is that it takes the wholesale sheet cost, grabs the multiplier factor that you set to calculate the cost of a FULL SHEET. Then it determines the cost per UI, and multiplies that by the size you are selling. The price will scale up and down accordingly, based on the size you enter in the ticket screen. ie: an 8x10 mat will cost less than a 30x30. As a result, you'll probably use very few of those from-to ranges. I would guess that most folks use one, but that's just a guess.

Is that any clearer? Stop into chat Friday if not, and i'll explain in greater detail.

Best regards
Mike
 
Thanks Mike. My wife likes this avatar better than your last. Did you know that computer monitors don't hold up well to being smacked by a shoe? Probably this day has been to hectic with too many distractions. I thought, in scrolling through the mat listing, it looked like all mats within a (cost) price range priced out the same retail for a given size. Perhaps not eh? Will investigate further tommorrow. Still think it would be interesting to compare how people have choosen to group mats by board cost ( not pricing, markups, multipliers or personal net worth just to clarify). What criteria have you choosen to use to do this? Sorry, I don't know chat for squat. Or is that squat for chat? Will investigate.
 
Haven't got it yet & now I've waited to long & help center has gone home so here's my dillema. I haven't got my mat prices where I'd like them yet. Useing the straight multiplier, if I get the prices set where I want them for small mats (0 - 36 ui) then I think the large mats are over priced & vice versa, if lager mats ( 37- 72 ui) are priced right then the small ones are too low. I need a way to add a surcharge to smaller mats. Is there a spot to do that? I haven't found it.
 
Hi Terry

I'm not aware of a way to do this through the multiplier. It calculates based on the UI of what you are selling, times the cost per UI defined with the markup. Also keep in mind that while this material uses a fixed formula based on size, other aspects of the sale are not - such as the labor/fitting table.

Solution A: (applies when a frame is included in the transaction)
One possibility is to compensate for this in the (UI driven) labor table.
@main menu: PRICE -> LABOR -> right arrow once to bring up the FIT price table. Then you can go through the table to make sure enough is being charged for the time to fit smaller pieces. This table IS driven by the size of the piece, and can be varied.

Solution B:
You could set up a "SPECIAL" misc fee for this purpose, which you could put a checkmark on when this is a concern. It will bump up the price a bit.
@main menu: PRICE -> SPECIALS -> NAME -> Add a new item such as Sml Mat Fee -> OK -> Specials -> PRICE -> right arrow over to this new item to see its UI price definition table. It works as above, but will be added only when you click it in the ticket screen.

Solution C:
If there's ever an instance where you think more needs to be charged for a special treatment, you can click INCLUDE MISC FEE in the ticket screen. It will prompt for a dollar amount, which will be added in to the price.

Solution D: ?
There may be another, and if anyone here has a better suggestion - please jump in and share.

Best regards,
Mike Labbe

PS: I think part of the confusion is due to the mention of "mat class tables", at the start of this (2 year old) thread. The original (legacy version) LifeSaver priced mats in this manner only. Due to numerous suggestions, this was changed in 2005 to the current multiplier method. All of the TruVue branded versions have Multiplier as the standard way, while the older copies allowed both methods - to give folks the chance to gradually switch over. By now, I think most folks have abandoned the mat classes in favor of the multiplier. One big advantage is that price changes will flow through automatically, as they increase, with a more accurate markup. The mat class method grouped them into broad ranges, which were shared by large groups of mats. This method wasn't as flexible. I hope that clarifies the remaining confusion.
 
Still struggling with this. Does anyone at all feel comfortable making little or nothing on a small, like 8x10, mat assuming the remainder will be used & you'll "make it up then"? Would you feel comfortable charging ,say, $55 for a single 32x40 artique mat?
 
Solution C:
If there's ever an instance where you think more needs to be charged for a special treatment, you can click INCLUDE MISC FEE in the ticket screen. It will prompt for a dollar amount, which will be added in to the price.

Learn something all the time by reading these threads. I never saw that button before. That is a most usefull button!
 
Doesn't that show up as an additional fee on the customers ticket? I don't want them to feel they are being penilized. I'm thinking more of correcting what I consider an "overcharge" with a discount instead but creating the tables are becoming a headache. Wish it (the software) would just allow me my prices. Seems like somehow it should. I have high hopes for lifesaver but am a little stymied over mat pricing right now.
 
Terry Hart cpf;302685 I'm thinking more of correcting what I consider an "overcharge" with a discount instead but creating the tables are becoming a headache..[/quote said:
I was glad to find that there was a misc fee button because sometimes you just need to add a few bucks for whatever reason.

Now the discount button I always new was there and it works in a similar manner, in that you can give a dollar or percentage discount to the whole ticket or to particular items like mats.
 
Correct. ... and the column header that says "discount" only prints up there when, in fact, a discount exists. If there is no adjustment, it will just be an empty section.

Mike
 
I think we'll go the dicount route for now but it's kind of a headache. Hopefully there will be a better fix down the road. I was told there would be a minimum price option in the next version. If that can be applied to to different mats at different rates that would be helpful.
Out of curiousity, if you are useing the straight multiplier are you priceing small mats cheap so that larger mats are (what I'd call, anyway) reasonalble or the other way around?
 
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