Internet Framing and You

Less

SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer
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I did not think that the Internet would seriously compete for a share of the market. I now believe I was wrong. I am seeing more and more different types of clients buying art and framing online

I am framing for a client who saw several prints in a high-end New York frame shop. She came to me to see if I could locate these prints and have them framed. I searched and found them online for her. It turns out that she also found them online and had a great time designing frames online. She actually brought in the down loaded designs.

I asked her, why she did not just buy them off the web? She replied, that she wanted my opinion on the quality of the print, as well as frame design recommendations. Basically she wanted someone to tell her that she was making the right decision. I guess we better act like the experts we claim to be. I informed her, that you get what you pay for, and that if she had quoted apples for apples, I would likely be able to meet or beat their prices, and she would also has someone she can turn to when she has questions or problems. She also revealed that she now buys many items online that she had difficulty finding throughout her travels, and she actually misses the thrill of the hunt for items that she thought were rare. She misses the shopping experience.

I have had other clients that admitted shopping online for posters and frames. They came in to look at my catalogs to see if they still looked good, and compare my prices. Sometimes I got the job, and other times I did not. I am quite sure that several never had any intent to do business with me. They just wanted to borrow my catalog.

I’ve already described another recent story about an art and framing client who often buys their (big bucks) “fine art” online. She was responsible for buying the decorative art for the corporation she worked for. She had already bought several framed posters from Barewalls.com. Luckily, because she has great taste she recognized the quality of what she had purchased, and wanted something better. She wanted the advice and quality that an “expert” could provide. It was important to her to impress her boss with the decisions she made. Again, going to a professional took some of the responsibility from her.

What concerns me, and should also concern the rest of you is that for the average person who just wants to hang sometime on the wall, can now get it at every department/furniture store, and now they can sit in front of the computer, pick the poster, design the frame, and with the click on a button, buy it online. The better the Internet experience becomes, the more market share they will get.

So you better figure out how you are going to keep your share.

Me? I’m going after the market that appreciates quality service, quality products and expert advice.

Is anyone else starting to feel this trend? Ask your customers why they come to you. Ask them if, what, and why they buy online. We better start educating (marketing) our customers what we can offer them that the Internet and the Big Box cannot. My only hope is that they will be hurting the Big Boxes more than the type of shop I choose to be.
 
In the past month, I've had two customers bring in work that they purchased online. Both needed the mats changed as the colors they selected looked horrid w/the prints. One of the framed prints was to be a gift. When she presented it to her significant other, he told her to bring it back to me and get the whole thing done all over again as he thought the frame was terrible too! I don't stock many prints, but I do get alot of customers who purchase them online and then bring them in for me to mat and frame. So far, I'm pleased with the way online framing is working in my favor!
 
they can sit in front of the computer, pick the poster, design the frame, and with the click on a button, buy it online.
Less, I guess we'd better make sure we're better designers than most of our customers.

Even for the people that have the taste and experience to pick their own designs and live with them afterwards, there is still a problem with judging colors and scale on the PC monitor. I used a program for a while from Wizard called Integrated Framer. In conjunction with a searchable DVD database of images, you could design mats, fillets and frames for whatever image you chose and view the "finished" frame in a variety of room settings. It's great fun and a very good learning tool for the novice designer (like my daughter, The Digital Diva.) The problem is that you often would not recognize the mats and frames on the monitor. When you start pulling real samples, the comparison is disappointing and sometimes hideous.

As the technolgy improves and people become more accustom to using it this way, the competition may heat up. Whether you should be alarmed may depend on how many years you are from retirement.
 
I buy a lot of things on line. I've not made any secret of the fact that I don't get around very well, and have to have a scooter. "The Other Half" also walks with a cane. Therefore, shopping, for us, is a real chore. The internet has opened up a whole new world for me, that had been closed for almost 10 years. That's how long I've had problems walking very far. With today's famlies mostly having both adults working full time more and more people are shopping on line, because they can do this at any time of the day or night - even when their favorite store is closed, and even in their jammies. My feeling on this is that we all need to get our own web sites up and running, and keep them up to date. That way, when our customers go out there looking for framing, their old reliable framer is listed right along with those others that they are buying from now. No. I don't have my web site up, yet. It is just a matter of time. This is the wave of the future, and, if we don't get on this wave, we will get left in the sand.
 
Internet?

Sure, it makes it's way into our shop:
Ebay Ebay Ebay Ebay Ebay Ebay Ebay Ebay Ebay Ebay Ebay Ebay Ebay Ebay Ebay Ebay Ebay Ebay Ebay Ebay Ebay Ebay Ebay Ebay Ebay Ebay Ebay Ebay Ebay Ebay

The more they buy the more they frame.

I had a customer bring in an Etch-a-sketch like one of these
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1780847156
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1781298851
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1781620693
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1781799147

perfect shape with the original flyers and promotional slicks.

Yep: Bought on e-bay for about 10.00

Framed for over 250.00

We had one customer who brought in a complete Flinstones Cigar Astray Collection, like these, but better :
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2065415435
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2063651726
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=727524790
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1781147844

Along with Flintstones cigar bands from the licenced Cigars that Hannah Barbera let get made.

If I recall there was a Flintstones Ligher in there too (get it: flint-stone = lighter).

As well as one of these
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=728593884
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=728866630

All from ebay.

He bought all the items specifially to frame.

When he had bought all he wanted in the frame, he came in and spent some more with us.

This happens all the time.

Forget about losing a poster, go for the gravy.

Find a way to get all those people who are buying back bits of paper, and small 3-d items that relate to thier childhood to want (or need) to frame it in your shop.

That's the internet money train.

I was going to take a guess at how many items a week come in from e-bay/internet.

Instead, I'll spend this week getting an actual hard number for you.
 
Unless your monitor is calibrated to the correct color space for the program or site you are using, it would be very hard to judge colors accurately when buying framing on line. The only way I could see it working is if there were a limited number of selections for a given piece that had been preselected by a designer. Then they could guarantee that it would go with the print. If you have access to too many choices, things could get ugly in a hurry. :eek:
 
This approach is exactly why we're showing nothing but higher quality limited edition prints.

I got tired of having all those people look thru all those catalogues then ordering online. Or using some high quality frames and mats for a $30 p-oster then seeing the same poster at Kmart framed for $80.

Like Marc said "go for the gravy". Or "go for the higher end customer"
 
I have to say that one of the reasons that I have framed up so many examples of keepsakes is to get customers to think outside of the box. There is a lot more to frame than just formal artwork. It has done pretty well for me. I have done several keepsake type things for customers. I've done a couple of baby shadowboxes. I have done a couple of old indian jewelery, an old indian purse. All the ones I have done I know I have gotten the business off of the client seeing my examples.
 
Less makes a point that we should take note of - Have we reached a point where a change in the pattern of behavior may start to become noticable in our own businesses, good or bad?

While I'm not bemoaning these changes, the the e-bay factor has not affected my clientle. I realize that you can always find a way to react to change. But even with the shortcomings of technology, it will only be a matter of time before those issues are overcome. Even if at first there is no money to be made on the marketing side of it, the technical solutions will present themselves sooner or later. It will get cheaper, the market will develop behind it.

Just think how long ago the idea of being able to shop for a poster on the internet was just an idea . Pick a frame for it? Just an idea. Have a CD-ROM with 40,000 posters on it? A few years ago it was just an idea.

Here is why I am very interested in this topic.

I have had this crazy idea to open a poster shop next to my frame shop. (or work it into existing space) Lots of poster inventory. LOTS! And ready mades, artsy stuff, etc . . .

I have read many others comments about getting out of stocking posters. Talking about getting stuck with dead inventory, and wanting to just burn all of it.

AM I TRULY CRAZY?

My shop is rather conservative and would not attract the typical poster shopper. So I thought a seperate space with a funky, upbeat, trendy persona (like an alter ego) could bring in a good mix.

AM I TRULY CRAZY?

Will I suffer from being the 'showroom' for the online outlets as Less described?

Is now the time to make a move like this?

How can I see my idea become a reality, and yet incorporate the correct reaction to the changes in the market caused by the online factor?

Opinions please. And there's no need to be humble!
 
I really admire folks who, after sweating all day running a business say, "You know? We could start ANOTHER business!" I say, Go For It! You don't need much sleep anyway! Of course, Roger and I feel some days as if we are running at least two different businesses ourselves... custom framing and a regular retail store of art supplies, drafting supplies, craft supplies, hobby supplies, and anything else which we think will either turn a buck or make good Christmas presents for our family if they don't sell...
 
Eric, I just moved my print bins down to my basement. Nobody is allowed down there but me. I realized the space they were occupying could be better utilized by having a couple of chairs and a table with some consumer magazines (Veranda, Architectural Digest, Midwest Living) to inspire customers while they wait. Sometimes they're waiting for me. More often they're waiting for their spouse to make a decision.

I won't be putting any print catalogs on that table.

I'm not convinced that the internet is impacting my framing sales, but my print and posters sales - which were never a significant portion of my gross - have declined steadily over the past five years.
 
How about encouraging customers to shop on line? I'm considering producing a guide to print shopping on the internet and even an online work station in the store where people can search and tell me which prints they want. After a deposit I'll order it and have it waiting for them to choose framing. Kind of an onscreen print bin.
 
Ron, are we connected somehow. I did the same thing in January this year. I put the prints to mildeo in the basement. I will write them off this year. I went out and got a nice leather sofa for customers to wait on,when I'm busy. I can not have a sole come in for 5 hour and three different clients show up within 2 minutes of each other. This happens several times a week.

framer
 
We get a fair number of people in our shop that frame art and other items that they have purchased via the internet. If they want to get a piece for a great price and bring it to me to frame that is fine.

We have Art Information set up on a PC in our showroom for customer use. It's thirty couple thousand prints on a searchable CD. Some customers come in and look for a while and then order prints through me.

Why not build traffic with those prints that are in the basement. Pull out enough of them to fill one print bin. Put them in the bin and mark the bin "all prints $5 each." Roll the bin out on the sidewalk in front of your store. it will stop foot trafic. People will look. People will buy and frame these prints. People will have to walk into your store to pay for these prints. Maybe people will come in that have not been in before. It is an inexpensive advertising campaign to get new customers into your store. and you will unload some of that unwanted inventory.
 
Eric,

Is there an open space actually next to your shop?

Do you (think) you have extra cash to rent it?

If yes: Let's start another thread titled; Fantasy uses for ERIC's open space, or soemthing like that.

Poster shop? Not my first choice.

If you want to try and capture the lower end, open a gallery with "cutting edge" art (I'll explain later why). And get the framing virgins early in the curge.

Or go high end. Fancy fancy - nice nice.

And have student (JC or HS) exihibitions every other month (more framing virgins).

A coffee bar is good too, just ask Po'framer.

But then again, you really don't need sleep, it's over-rated.
 
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