Integrated framer and canon s2 questions...

JbNormandog

SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer
Joined
Apr 8, 2004
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NJ
Hi all,

Got it all hooked up and everything is talking to everything else.

A few questions.

The camera is powered by the power cord and I pulled the batteries so they don't corode the inside of the camera. Also it is wired to a timer to turn it on and off. I looked in the booklet to find out how to get it to stay on all the time and don't see an answer. I would like the timer to turn it on and off. It turns off great but when the timer turns on the camera stays off.

Also, the white and cream mats look gray on screen. I am using a flat screen (for room on the table). The colors are otherwise ok, not great but ok. Is it a lighting thing or screen thing?

I ran the calibrate mode and it said I should have a smooth curve or straight line. I don't, it plunges a bit once or twice in the middle. I can run it back to back and get different results every time.

My design table top is a wash of slate, rust and light gray, should I put something more white on top to help IF?

My mouldings look dark a good portion of the time.

If lighting is a problem, is there a way to set the camera so that the flash always goes off. As it is now it does not alwasy go off. Keep in mind my design table is affected by daylight through two big windows. Not a direct source of light but it does effect things a bit.

So what do you think?
 
ok, unfortunately, I don't have an easy solution for you, but to understand the problem ...

Lighting matters. The color cell receptors in the camera matter. The color balance of the software matters, and the calibration, both balance and correctness, of the monitor matter.

ONE way to get a "ok" color match is to color calibrate your system. First, get a color control kit (Kodak used to sell them, but I haven't looked in about ten years?) which comes with software and a color "target" (patches of different color). You take a picture of the target then run the software to create a color profile for the camera. (Most software supports the use of profiles for color correction.)

Then, you get a Monitor color calibration kit which comes with a "monitor sensor" and software. You stick the sensor to the monitor and run the software. The software will display many color patches which the sensor will read. The software will then generate a profile that can be used through your video driver to "color correct" the monitor.

Then, as long as the white point of the ambient light remains constant your colors will be good.

The "kits" used to cost between $300 and $1500 each depending upon the accuracy you were trying to achieve.

Short of truly correcting for the device dependent color properties, you can "play" with lots of stuff to make it look ok, but you have to remember, they all matter.

That didn't help at all, did it?
 
Exactly what Cliff said about color calibration.. its not an easy thing to do, but fortunately the entire graphic design industry has the same problem and there's many tools out on the market. The Monaco EZColor system is a good example of this.

For the other questions:

The camera is powered by the power cord and I pulled the batteries so they don't corode the inside of the camera. Also it is wired to a timer to turn it on and off. I looked in the booklet to find out how to get it to stay on all the time and don't see an answer. I would like the timer to turn it on and off. It turns off great but when the timer turns on the camera stays off.
I personally wouldn't bother wiring it to a timer, I would just keep it on all the time as it uses practically no power while it's waiting there to take a picture. At my shop I've plugged it in to a power strip that I can simply switch on and off if I need to, and others like Mike have installed a fancier X10 remote since his camera is plugged in the ceiling.

I ran the calibrate mode and it said I should have a smooth curve or straight line. I don't, it plunges a bit once or twice in the middle. I can run it back to back and get different results every time.
I'm pretty sure your problem here is that the picture is coming out too dark. The calibration currenty needs a good bit of contrast for it to work properly. I've addressed this already in the next version that's coming out in Atlanta, but for now I would first go and take a normal picture, but crank up the exposure value to at least +1. Then go back and run the calibration and you should get a better result.

My design table top is a wash of slate, rust and light gray, should I put something more white on top to help IF?
That tends to have the opposite effect, as the camera will adjust to the extra white by making the picture darker unless you're doing a custom white balance. I'd have to look for Jim Miller's post about the new surface material he bought for his countertop, but basically what you want is a neutral grey - just like how photographers use an 18% grey card to determin their exposure.

And as far as flash goes, I don't have that enabled fully yet as I had some problems with our S2 (works great with our A620 however), but it should be in a near-future update.
 
Thankyou for the replies.

I am way camera illiterate. (but I can take apart a 74 stingray and put it back together with my eyes closed)

I'm guessing the exposure level to +1 is a setting on the camera?

I will hit the manual and let you know what happens.

Steve, the timer (plugs into an outlet that was already up in the ceiling panels so I didn't really have to do anything) goes on before I open and off way after I close, like the x10 remote or the power strip I think there has to be some kind of setting on the camera to leave the power on continuously so that when you hit your strip the camera is already in the on position.

Other wise I think that it would turn off ok but not still turn on.

Wow after reading this back it makes little sense to me. I hope you do better.

Thank you for the posts, I will try them out.
 
It's going to take awhile but I've started putting each mat corner sample on the scanner and scanning them into Photoshop. Then I adjust the density and color so they look like they should on the screen and save them in a file with the mat number as the file name.

Then I'll do the same with many moulding corners samples.

Then I'll only have to worry about getting the image of the art to look right on the screen using the camera.

With the art on the screen, I'll open the mats and moulding files - IF allows you to toggle between a number of files.

My tests with this approach gives me a good representation of the design on the screen.

I think the problems of trying to get a number of elements correct on the screen using 1 camera will eventually lead back to data base visualization software. just take a picture of the art - the rest by stock number.
 
Bandsaw,

I saw at the New York show they just scanned in the specifiers for the mat companies.

It was fast and easy for them, would this work for you?
 
Hey Cliff,

Is this something like you were describing? Allegedly corrects monitor and corrects for changes in ambient lighting on a real-time basis.

Pantone Huey LCD & CRT Monitor Calibrator

I'll let you know how it works later next week when it arrives. It received decent summaries at the PMA Orlando show this year. This is the lower-end device and there are 2 higher grade "professional" devices but right now, I am not putting myself into that category.
 
Hi Rick,

yes, that looks like a "next generation" version of what I used to work with. The link Steve posted is to product by X-Rite which is the sensor device manufacturer most of the "color companies" purchased from. (There are a couple of others, but they used to be the best.)

It's been a while since I was paying attention to that field, but color "variances"/"device dependent differences" in devices has long been the biggest problem for production color applications. I have contended it is the single thing holding wide spread web purchasing of things like cloths/furniture/"real art" were color is important. When they lick the WYSIWYG color problem for everyday computer users, there will be a LOT more brick and mortar companies closing their doors!
 
I did a bit of tweaking and so far I see an impovement.

Thanks for the advice.
 
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