I can't take it anymore!

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stshof

SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer
Joined
Sep 16, 2002
Posts
1,194
Loc
Ohatchee, AL
I probably should wait until I calm down a little to post this.
I just had a lady bring in a canvas replica photo and her own "frame", 16 x 20. Asks me to put that nice paper and wire on back. No problem - finish your errands and come back, says I.
Has anyone seen a ready made in China frame that is ornate compo over a very poor quality wood and when you turn it over, the back is not wood - it's gray paste board that has been rivoted and stapled to little blocks of an MDF type board that sit INSIDE the hollowed out frame? I'm probably not describing it well and I couldn't look behind the gray paste board very easily. It might actually be molded sawdust paste with compo over it!
I been disillusioned for a while but I'm done. As soon as the holidays are over, I'm retiring. :icon20: :(
 
Why? Because I'm an old fuddy duddy, I guess. Because people don't care about quality anymore. Because the customers who come in and tell me that the work I did for them 18 years ago looks as good as the day they took it home are not today's customer that don't care because they'll throw it out in a couple months.
Time to let some young, enthusiastic person take over!
 
Take heart

There are people who will drive 20 miles to save $1 on underwear....or buy cheap shoes, or questionable art......

LOTS of people care about quality, lots of people care about each other, are kind, are helpful, don't spit on the sidewalk or what ever else seems to be unraveling the fabric of society......
That's why we are here.... to keep things together, keep the wolves at bay.

Maybe you just need a vacation.....

Smile away

Nancy
 
Have faith Sue. She is only one person. Don't let her bring you down. She probably doesn't know how bad the quality is. But, there are people out there who do know and care. I believe the pendulum will eventually swing back a bit from our 'disposable' society and quality will be the standard. I just keep waiting...
 
This time of year can be very stressful - so busy making things happen for other peoples' Christmases - no time to sort your own out.

I have about 15 'last straws' a week this time of year - from worse customers/jobs like yours to employees of neighbouring shops that park in customers' spaces all day for the sake of a 90 second walk to work.

For therapy - find a nice restaurant - hand the maitre d' a large potato and ask him to turn it into a nice plate of fries for you.
 
John,
that's a great idea! Mainly because he would probably be the only one working at the restaurant who doesn't have access to a knife!

In the states we don't have Maitre 'd's. We have hostesses. They would probably just give you a blank look and tell you there's a 45 minute wait and here's your pager!

Sue,
this has been the year of the DIY customer! I am cutting tons of mats, inserting lots of old pictures into yard sale frames, and cutting down existing frames to reuse.

I don't think I can afford to be this busy! Something has to change.
 
Don't feel bad Sue, you're not alone.....

I just finished repairing the corners and re-mounting a filthy, stained, large liner and frame for a realllly ugly painting that fell off the wall and they guy just has to have it back by Friday ( he left it yesterday!) for a big party. It looks like it was fished out of a dumpster and now I want to go shower....ick!!! I have it hidden in the back, finished, plus he gave me the wrong phone #. I only got it done so fast because I want it out of here!
 
A few weeks ago a customer brought me in 3 sillohettes (sp) of her kids from kindergarten to frame, but she didnt want to spend alot so she brought 16x20s she got at Target. Wanted them back to hang over thanksgiving. Floated them on an offwhite mat with a double mat around them Off white with dark grey so as not to make the no longer black silohettes look worse and convinced her to let me put Cons glass in them so the constructioin paper wouldnt fade as quickly as it would behind the thin plexi that was in them.

So there is so much black plasticy stuff over these "real wood" frames that the corners are rounded on the inside and my 16x20 mats and glass wouldnt fit. But after much fighting with them and alot of trimming (did i mention that pulling the flexi points that came with them out let little pieces of this black crap get everywhere and it kept getting between the mats and glass...) I got them together.

They are still waiting to be picked up. And we did not charge a "crap-@$$ readymade" charge. But it is now officially on our pricelist.
 
M s has some stuff like this. They look like poor finished corner frames, but they are plastic, resin, compo? Then they have a wood or mdf under it in order to pin the contents in to the frame.


PL-
 
Today a customer (For want of a better word) came in - in fact it was a couple - fairly elderly.


No artwork - how much to frame something 'A4 size'

('A4' is a standard European paper size - about 11 x 8")

Usual questions - is that the size of the IMAGE - as it may well require a MAT, which would make it BIGGER - say 3" all round - so 17 x 14" maybe????)

Oh no - it already has a 'mat'

(Thinks - yeah - OK - so - say it's a 2" mat - that now makes the image 7 x 4" - ah well!)

OK - what sort of frame ....?

(customer points out a LJ Aurora)

"That would be £45"

They look at each other, then at me - she says "That's a lot of money, isn't it?"

I answer honestly ...


"Yes"

(Can I go back to work now?)
 
I've gotten a lot of DIY this year too.
Then there are the calls from the price shoppers.

Yesterday and artist called me wanting to know how much I would charge to frame half a dozen paintings by next Tuesday.
He had been getting his frames from a local "wholesale" chop service that doesn't require their customers to be business owners and expected me to beat or meet their price of $50 for a 30 x 40 frame.

I thanked him for thinking of me but told him I couldn't compete with that price.


I've also had customers come in to have me put hangers on the cheap frames they've bought in "home decor" shops and have had to refuse on more than once.
If there isn't a hanger on that frame there must be a reason and I don't want to be responsible when it falls off the wall!
 
Last Friday...late in the day, getting ready to leave... a well dressed middle aged woman walks in the door. She had gone to the upholsterer next door and just saw my shop. We talk for about a half hour about these poems she would like framed, but doesn't have with her. She picks out some moulding and I give her a ballpark figure of between $50 and $75 dollars each. She asks if I can be in the shop around 8 the next morning, as thats the only time she has available. OK, no problem.

Early Saturday.. I get to the shop at 7:55 and well dressed lady shows up promptly at 8. I spend the next hour helping her choose mat colors. She leaves happy and looking foreward to her framed poems.

Monday morning... message on my machine:

5:00 am... "uh yes, Frank... I spoke with my mother... and she thinks that's awfully expensive and she says she can get them framed for half that, so don't order anything... I'm sorry, but I'm going to have to cancel the order...."

what a way to start the week...
 
Yep, this is the time of year that the cheapo's come out of hiding. They've waited till the last minute and want us to bail them out for a dollar or two. Yesterday, I had an artist (?) with 9 pieces. They were all different sizes. She wanted me to cut from her mats and have them ready by tomorrow. Told her I only cut from my mats and I definitely couldn't put her work ahead of people who brought work in prior to Thanksgiving.

Next guy that came in wanted me to cut 3 openings (just alike) in 4 mats. He was shadowboxing flags, certificates and pins. He's never done ANY framing. Didn't bring in the stuff that he's gonna be framing. Just said, "The stuff is standard (?) size". I turned that job away also.

But, I have a soft spot for the older folks that need to get something framed even if they want it done very cheaply. It's hard for me to say no to them. I often wonder if they will be around for another Christmas. I always try and help them out.
 
We have a photographer on our island (actually won best gallery on island) who always wants it in a rush plus a big discount and pays with credit card. We finally told her our accountant said no more than 10% with cc and 15% cash or check.
Now she is starting to bring wal mart frames to have her photos put in for customers. She wants us to take apart and call her so she can sign the cardboard mat then mount photos and but together with dust cover and wire hanger.
Yesterday she came in with 3, need by Friday. I gave her 3 pieces of masking tape, said here sign these and I will stick on mat as I do not have time to wait for her to sign. We have NEVER had her refer a customer to us so if she wants special service she IS going to PAY.
Her response, there are plenty of other framers on island that will do it.
NOT!!!
There are 4 of us and we all know her WELL.
Actually tonight we are having our first annual framers Christmas party and I am sure her name will come up.
HA HA HA price fixing you say:beer:
Think she is going to be such a lonely girl boo hoo tisk tisk
Well enough venting now back to the good jobs.
 
Gotcha!

I had a rather abrupt woman come in last week and wanted an 8 x 10 mat for a 5 x 7 greeting card. After she picked out the mat color, she asked, “That will be a three inch border, right?”

“No,” I said, “we’ll cut it 1-1/2 inches all around”.

With great exaggeration like she was trying to explain nuclear physics to a slow 6 year old, she took a piece of scrap paper from the counter and wrote “10 8” on it, and just beneath it “ 7 5”. She slowly subtracted 7 from 10 then 5 from 8 and, lo and behold, got 3. “See,” she pointed out, “it’s three! It should be three inches!”

Okaaaay …

So, I cut the 8 x 10 mat with the three inch border. The opening was, of course, 4 x 2. I place the finished mat over her 5 x 7 card. “Here you go, your three inch mat!” (I took great pains to demonstrate the width with my tape measure.) She looked like a deer caught in headlights.

Before she could say anything, I piped in, “It’s all a matter of taste, but if this were mine I probably would have shown a bit more of the image. Did you really want a bigger opening?”

She merely nodded. I took the scrap paper she had originally used, drew a line under the three she had written, placed a two under it, an equal sign, then wrote “1-1/2” and circled it (with a dramatic flair).

I cut the mat down without saying another word.

Clearly, I embarrassed her to the point where she will probably not return. But it gave me great satisfaction to demonstrate her own stupidity – especially when she was so condescending in the first place.
 
I'm new to the business but have already had some interesting customers.

Have an Interior Designer that I agreed to give a discount to (I'm new and stupid and agreed to this BEFORE reading the Grumble). While in my gallery she noticed a photo I have hanging of a green door -- printed on glossy paper and mounted on gator. I explained that I offer digital photo services and that I can take any photo, tweak it, blow it up, mount or frame it, etc. Two days ago she brought in a client to show her the photo and asked me to explain the process which I gladly did. Client said she had 15 photos that she would like to have done and how much would it cost. I gave her a ballpark figure for each. Designer pipes up and says "I pass on my discount to all of my clients so she would get x% off of that price, right"?

I'm still steaming! Now I understand why she came to my shop...probably all the others have already told her what she can do with "sharing" her trade discount.
 
I have not had a client try to share their discount with another, but I think I'd agree under one condition, that the original client guaranty a certain dollar amount per year will be reached through their referrals, and if not a check would be cut to make up the difference at years end... let's see how many agree to that...
 
I had a customer yesterday who wanted 4 large, ratty, held-together-with-scotch-tape pieces custom framed and matted by next week and asked for a quote first. When I did, he turned blue and said "Well, the guy that used to be here would do each one for $35!" I said "That's probably why he's not still here!" So he came back later with four plastic $3 ready-made frames from M's, and wants them matted and put in those, but mats won't fit in them! So now he's "thinking of what he's gonna do...":icon45: Well, not by Christmas now!
 
Sue, I was wondering, since you are a little older than I was when I "had enough", are you serious, or just blowing off steam?
 
I'm serious!

It's been coming for a while and yes, I'm serious! I own my property and selling it will probably be the biggest hurdle. If I can get my asking price, give or take a couple thousand, then I'll just liquidate. It's easier and my husband completely supports my decision which helps a lot. I'm a little tired, a little frustrated, a little sad - but I'm mainly just a dinosaur that's not willing to change with the times. I recognize that about myself and I'm ok with it! :kaffeetrinker_2:
 
A very nice couple came in last Fri to frame a 24x30 acy. painting. They wanted 3" mats w/fillet and a large frame. While I was trying to design (20 minutes), between the two of them they had or made 12 phone calls. they practically got to the final choice, but - oh- they were just too distracted to finish. Left the artwork so I could measure and do the final paperwork. (we needed to finalize the mat choice.) "that will be 40-50% off retail right - that's what we always get" I thought they were joking.

they came back on Sat, finalized the mat (I'm off) and they wanted me to call them on Mon with the price. Gave them their $950 price @our sale of 20% off - and he couldn't understand why it was so much!

"didn't I get a 50% discount" No "well xxx, or yyy, or zzz shops always give me 40-50% off." Well, I'm sorry, I can't offer that to you here.

Later we figured out, the shops he mentioned sold original artwork and it is their policy to give 40-50% off - if you purchase their artwork & frame it THERE!!!

He's picking it up......
 
Sue....are you anemic again? Checked your iron levels lately? Wasn't that you awhile back that had the downs so bad, and figured out you were anemic??? And felt all chipper and positive and optimistic when you got your blood levels leveled?

I remember when I made the decision to close my first shop. It was agonizing. But I did, moved away, started a whole new life but missed framing so much. I framed for several other shops over the years....even a BB.....and it was never the same, and I still missed it so much and wished I ha given closing more thought.

Here I am, back at it for myself again, and I have a new appreciation for the Christmas Crazies, and a different outlook, and I'm so much happier. But then, that's me.

Check your iron level before you make any decisions....and keep talking about how you feel....it helps to read yourself say it out loud.
 
Val, you're quite a gal! :thumbsup: I will admit I've had quite a year. I had surgery to fix a hernia surgery that was such a mess that the new surgeon told me to get my affairs in order. I was diagnosed with "syndrome x" - diabetes, high blood pressure, and high cholesterol. (You were close - it was blood sugar, not iron!)Finally got my meds sorted out for all that and fell and broke my leg in two places! It's been 9-10 weeks and I'm walking and standing fine - just a little discomfort that may last up to a year according to the doc.

I'm hanging in until the first of the year and I'm taking the week between Christmas and New Year to straighten things up here and give it some more thought. I'll let you tell me "I told you so" if I change my mind. ;)

I just returned the finished work to the customer and asked where she got the frame(see original post). It was Michael's. I told her about her "wannabe" frame - very nicely, too! I don't think she cared at all. :(

Hey, Pam, I'm waiting to hear from you!
 
I might be the only one here who truly can relate to how you feel. You are a little older than I was when I started feeling exactly the same way.

I put my last shop up for sale with the thought that if my "retirement" wasn't meant to be, the shop wouldn't sell. I had a buyer in less than a month.

It has been 2 1/2 years, and I don't miss framing at all. I hang around here because I still love the industry and the people.

Maybe someday I'll want to put on a framing apron again. As of right now, I would have to say I doubt it.
 
Sue,

I’m not a doctor (I just dress up and give free physicals) but you may be suffering from Seasonal Affective Disorder.

In all seriousness, my wife has a mild case of SAD and during the winter she gets depressed, seems to be tired all the time, puts on weight, has trouble sleeping … the whole works.

Before you make any drastic life changes, check it out.
 
Oh, yeah. People who love framing can't imagine not loving framing. So they think might think you are a little crazy, maybe overworked, stressed out, feeling sick and everything will be okay after you've had a little rest.

I think you sound like your mind is made up.
 
wow, that response sounds like someone has some old unresolved issues!!

Your getting alot of advice from people who are concerned and care about you Sue. I'm sure you will make the right decision no matter what it is.

I'll be thinking of you!
 
Pam...your not going to go postal on us are ya??

Listen if you need good humor in your life I highly recommend the humping dog thread! Better than therapy in my book!
 
Life-altering decisions need to be made in less stressful times than this time of year can be - see it through and evaluate, would be my advice - IOW don't change horses crossing a stream.


stshof said:
......broke my leg in two places!
Click to expand...

and don't go back to those two places either!!!
 
Sue, I opened my shop on New Year's Day this year, 3 months later had 2 total hip replacement surgeries 6 weeks apart, my shop flooded, I had to put my old dog to sleep, battled with insurance company over hip surgery #1 (and won!), daughter's wedding last month, hobbling around with a walker/cane/knee brace most of the year, darn near died from rat-poison-disguised-as-blood-thinner-meds last summer, cancelled 2 knee surgeries that were scheduled for last week and next week (what was I thinking??) and now in the middle of Christmas Crazies and working 16+ hour days alone, because my helpers have lives and can't come in......

I'm not trying to out-suffer you there, just say that I know what you're going through right now.

Trust me....you can get through this.

Hang in there, Girlfriend!!!
 
I hear you, girlfriend, and I love your positive attitude! :beer:

It boils down to you're so-o-o happy and I'm so-o-o NOT happy.

I do agree with Pam - you guys are really great! Thanks for all the good thoughts!
 
Hey Sue,

I'm so sorry you're feeling so down. And there is nothing wrong with change. But I'll always remember something a neighbour said to me when I was feeling down about our (now ex) neighbourhood: " Rebecca, just remember where ever you go, you'll still be dragging your sorry ### around!" Not only did it make me laugh, it made me realize that happiness is an internal thing.

That being said, we did move, and I'm glad we did!

As long as it is a decision made from the right place, go for it.

But if it is an internal thing, light therapy (tanning salons yeah,! use SPF lotion), fish oil - enough to give you about 1000mg EPA, exercise ( need to work up a sweat), meditation, and good quality multi vitamins, can work wonders. Ask me how I know : )

Whatever, you have friends here XXX

Rebecca
 
From Thanksgiving until Christmas, we gently turn down refit jobs, mat only jobs and glass only jobs. It's amazing how many more custom jobs we can finish without attending to the pesky problems that crop up with reused or cheap frames. I started this policy three years ago and it has saved our sanity.
 
First, "fitting" a customers frame with their artwork is NOT the same as fitting an empty clean new frame.

It was fit with snot glass, paper, and backing by a monkey with a pnumatic stapler at best. And those dang things take for ever to get out.... as well as the snot glass that never wants to be clean because it's made from recycled beer bottles and poured on Gobie sand.

So in our shop it is a "special fitting" or a "re-fit" depending how cheap the frame is.

Sometimes it is a wonderful excuse for education.

We have one gal who buys the Pier one "ethnic" crud... has me take the frame "out back" for a little beating up.... slaps museum glass and rag mats in it and is happy to pay me for all the "headaches" [her words] that go with it. Her customers just love the "authentic native" frames. :icon11:

Sue, I'll also vouch for the tanning beds. I've got a deal with my tan guys... because I only zip in for a 5 minute dose.. it's 1/2 price... they also throw me in the "oldest bulbs" bed... I'm not tanning.. just need the intense light.
 
Boy, I miss Bob Carter.....

quote:
From Thanksgiving until Christmas, we gently turn down refit jobs, mat only jobs and glass only jobs.


Not me. I do anything I can to say yes to a customer.....and I charge enough so I'm not muttering under my breath cussing while I'm doing it. This time of year, I encourage people to use in stock items (scrap mat or frame) so we don't have to depend on a supplier and I can get it out more quickly. It's not long until those $50++ odd jobs add up to another thousand or two on the bottom line - and I'm using up all those fallouts and leftover frame stock. Turning potential trash into twenty dollar bills.
 
I don't think I have any unresolved issues. I'm sitting here trying to figure out how I gave that impression.

I think for her to hear from someone who has felt exactly as she feels now is needed just as much as a pep talk.

If you really love your work, you get through all the trials and tribulations that happen in life and continue to love what you do.

I could be wrong, but this is not the message I'm getting from Sue's postings. Taking a vacation, getting a massage, eating better are all short-term, feel good solutions (maybe) to the ongoing problem of not being happy at work.

I am not trying to put a damper on the rest of trying to make Sue feel better. I am just trying to be realistic.
 
stshof said:
It boils down to you're so-o-o happy and I'm so-o-o NOT happy.
I do agree with Pam - you guys are really great! Thanks for all the good thoughts!
Click to expand...

Everyone here is so supportive but Pam, you hear me. Maybe it's because you've been there, done that - I don't know. I've been able to rally a couple times but it doesn't last. If I can unleash the financial straps holding me here in business, I'm gone.
 
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