Hinging Art to Mat or Backing

jvandy57

SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer
Joined
Jul 5, 2001
Posts
1,410
From
Savannah, GA
Ok, Maybe I'm an idiot but I have a question.

When hinging artwork, and all other materials being proper, what is the difference between hinging to the backboard or hinging to the mat.
Is there damage that occurs to Artwork when hinging to the mat that does not occur when hinging to the backing? Please if possible cite references when possible.
 

Less

SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer
Joined
Jun 23, 2002
Posts
2,707
From
ZZ
When you open it

???

Duh!
 

jframe

SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer
Charter Member
Joined
Jan 1, 1997
Posts
4,251
From
Fort Worth, Texas
I know you aren't a beginning framer, jvandy (CPF), so I have to wonder if this is a serious question. :confused:
 

Ron Eggers

SPFG, Supreme Picture Framing God
Joined
Jul 6, 2001
Posts
16,932
From
Wisconsin
I'm not gonna look it up for you, Jerry. I'll bet you have the same books that I do. But the rationale that I've always heard was that the weight of the art could stress and deform the mat.

I would imagine that this would be less of a problem with those big honker mats we're all selling these days, but we are very traditional.

As a practical matter, with smaller prints in none-c/p framing, I often hinge them to the back of the mat for easier positioning. I especially do this if the mat is a collage with about 300 little windows for snapshots.

I even have a light table built into my fitting table to simplify this process.
 

Less

SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer
Joined
Jun 23, 2002
Posts
2,707
From
ZZ
I often hinge them to the back of the mat for easier positioning.
I don't understand how this is any easier.

But then again, I get easily offended

I know I read this somewhere? Funny Ron, a book does talk about sagging.

My biggest concern would be from physical damage when opening the mat, especially those ATGed

[ 02-05-2004, 06:38 PM: Message edited by: lessafinger ]
 

Hobbes03

SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer
Joined
Dec 4, 2001
Posts
1,727
From
Torrington, Connecticut, USA
I agree with Less. Way back before I knew any better, I would hinge to the window mat. I thought it was a real PITA lining everything up evenly.

-Mike.
 

B. Newman

SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer
Joined
Sep 5, 2001
Posts
4,859
From
Kodak, Tn. USA
I've often wondered about this myself. I know what you're supposed to do, but when opening the frame from the back, then lifting off the backing, it just looks easier to have the item(s) attached to the mat and not lifted up with the backing.

In doing multiples, it's a whole lot easier to move the mat around to accomodate the pieces than to try to get them all just right on the backing while moving the mat up and down several times.

Unless there's an easier way to do that...

Betty
 

smitten

CGF II, Certified Grumble Framer Level 2
Joined
Sep 11, 2003
Posts
452
From
new england
the expansion and contraction rates of a solid material with a hole cut in it are far different than a solid piece of material. (The mat will expand and contract at far different rates than the art will thus tearing or stressing the hnges and or art.) The backing board beeing solid will have a much more stable expansion and contraction rate and one that proportionaly matches the art thus less strain on the hinges and the art.

Now lets talk hinges...
 

jvandy57

SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer
Thread starter
Joined
Jul 5, 2001
Posts
1,410
From
Savannah, GA
Originally posted by jframe:
I know you aren't a beginning framer, jvandy (CPF), so I have to wonder if this is a serious question. :confused:
No Jo it's a serious question, I know what some of the books say about sagging, I say Bull****.

I also have the expansion contraction explanation and I still have serious doubts. When I do a limited edition print or any fine art I always mount to the backing with mylar corners or Hiaku hinges, because it is what I was taught.

I've gone back and looked at some of the stuff that we did YEARS ago (and yes we still have some around) and they do not look any worse for wear.

My question is based on my scientific nature and background. Things are accepted as fact by alot of framers that has come from somewhere and I'm trying to nail some of it down. If I apply the scientific method combined with logic to some of the statements that have been made and are accepted as fact, then sometimes 1 + 1 does not equal 2.

Now, what are the facts!?
 

Rebecca

SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer
Joined
Feb 28, 2002
Posts
3,339
From
Vancouver, B.C., Canada
Hi JeRy,

I agree with Less. Unframing pieces hinged to the window mat is scary.

I like to look at the front of the art while cutting hinges free. A lot of time adhesive etc. has oozed down between the front of the art and the window mat, and that complicates removal.

Also, sometimes one doesn't want to cut the hinges, and it's difficult to handle art that is only attached to the window mat - if you don't lift the glass with it, free part of the paper can slip through the mat opening. And sometimes the glass has a crack, or is broken...

There are ways around these obstacles, but in my experience the easiest framing packages to remove have the window mat hinged to the backmat, and the art hinged to the backmat.

Rebecca
 

GUMBY GCF

SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer

In Memorium

Rest In Peace



Joined
Dec 7, 2001
Posts
4,585
From
oHIo
Jerry
I know I have to meet you someday!
 

Rosalyn

CGF II, Certified Grumble Framer Level 2
Joined
Sep 22, 2003
Posts
374
From
Kansas
To help arrange and hold photos when doing multiples I have made several small glass weights from scraps (1x1 2x3 etc) that will sit on the photo and allow the hinged mat, with opening cut, to be opened and closed over the photo until perfect placement is achieved. Then mount to the backer.
 

AndyPan CPF

MGF, Master Grumble Framer
Forum Donor
Joined
Jun 29, 2002
Posts
617
From
Lincoln, RI
Business
Get The Picture
From "The Framer's Book of Materials and Techniques" by Paul Frederick:

"The artwork is attached to the backing board, not to the backof the mat. This is to allow the replacement of a faded or soiled mat without remounting the artwork." (pg. 168)

For years, I attached the art to the mat, because that how I was always shown, and in some cases, like ron mentioned, if the art is small enough, I still will.

The passage I quoted there makes a lot of sense though. If someone brings in something and all you are changing is the mat, then I think it's a heck of a lot easier to do when you only have to deal with the mat, and not have to worry about handling the art. Especially when you are dealing with the unknown methods of mounting.
 

jvandy57

SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer
Thread starter
Joined
Jul 5, 2001
Posts
1,410
From
Savannah, GA
Originally posted by Rebecca:
Hi JeRy,

I agree with Less. Unframing pieces hinged to the window mat is scary.

Rebecca
ReBeCcA,
I value your experience, and I have experienced the Art slipping through the Window Mat before.
So, like I said, when I do valuable works of art they are treated accordingly. But, you didn't mention the mat had sagged or the expansion and contraction had caused damage, these seem to be the prevalent "Reasons" why you shouldn't hinge to the Window Mat. If I do something that is of value at the time then you won't be taking it apart, cause we'll both be dead.

Sidebar: I have never had trouble getting the image in the window when mounting to the Mat it's a lot easier than mounting to the Backing and Hinging the Mat to the backing.
 

jvandy57

SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer
Thread starter
Joined
Jul 5, 2001
Posts
1,410
From
Savannah, GA
Originally posted by AndyPan, CPF:
From "The Framer's Book of Materials and Techniques" by Paul Frederick:

"The artwork is attached to the backing board, not to the backof the mat. This is to allow the replacement of a faded or soiled mat without remounting the artwork." (pg. 168)

Thanks Andy,
That makes since too.

See, Isn't this FUN!!!!!!!!
 

Hobbes03

SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer
Joined
Dec 4, 2001
Posts
1,727
From
Torrington, Connecticut, USA
Originally posted by jvandy57:
Sidebar: I have never had trouble getting the image in the window when mounting to the Mat it's a lot easier than mounting to the Backing and Hinging the Mat to the backing. [/QB]
I know sometimes I'm thick, but how is this method easier? I'm not trying to be argumentative, but when you have the artwork lined up with the window mat, wouldn't you then have to pick both up, turn them over to hinge, without the artwork shifting on you?


-Mike.
 

jvandy57

SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer
Thread starter
Joined
Jul 5, 2001
Posts
1,410
From
Savannah, GA
Mike,
I either do it at the edge of my table and scoot the mat of the edge so I can get to the art and mat at the same time, Or I place the hinge on the art then place the mat on top, and press when it's where I want it....Easy.
 

JPete

SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer
Charter Member
Joined
Jan 1, 1997
Posts
1,993
From
Huron SD USA
Hinge the mat to the backing first and then place the art work under to line up and attach. It's the original art work that comes in from artist taped on all sides to the back of the mat that is difficult to redo. Must be all of these self-taught artist, no offense intended who do that.

We have a print which came back for new frame we did in 1981. We used best materials available in our area at the time which included Newport blue rag, 2ply rag backing (work hinged to it)and beyond that who knows. This print was badly yellowed in the window opening. When I lifted the mat the print was white under the mat but the 2 ply rag was discolored everywhere but the opening area of the window mat. Even the linner hinging tape was yellowed. I would guess it was the light source and the frame. Other than that the print had no buckles etc.

I also recall back then reading it was recommended to change mats every 5 years for preservation. Would it have made a difference?

I hinge small things to the back of the mat if it is not of great value.
 
Top