Hanging art with removable adhesive system

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josephforthill

josephforthill

MGF, Master Grumble Framer
Joined
Mar 25, 2004
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Loc
Massachusetts
Our local art guild is planning to hang an exhibit using these removable adhesive type things (3M Command strips?). This will be on a newly painted wall, and the building management does not want to have nails in walls any more. The art is to remain up for approximately 8 weeks. The exhibit arranger is asking for artwork to be weighed, so they can get the appropriate size hangers.

I have never used these, but would not feel that comfortable with them, particularly for artwork with glass. I am not in charge of this project, but felt it might be prudent to get some input from this group. Any experience with these things? Are they headed for disaster?

Thanks,
Joseph
 
I have used Command adhesive with excellent results for small pictures -

-but I just came from a house where all of the pictures installed fell off the wall because the installer did not know how to use it.

I have had the most success using Command Adhesive with Command Hangers, doubled up (two per picture) - and the framed pieces hung from wire attached to the back of the picture.



The house where the pieces fell attempted to attach the command/velcro type hangers to the wall (they all held fine) but also to the DUST COVERS of the pictures where that part failed. The mating velcro was still mated with the wall portion of the command hanger with a residue of brown kraft still attached to the velcro.

Command will only work on a smooth non-friable surface. That is why I recommend a Command Hanger (doubled up) on the wall and a wire securely fastened to the art. They are rated at 8 lbs each - doubling them up, however does NOT double the rating of the hanger.

I do not recommend them for newly painted walls and suggest that you wait at least a week or more after painting. 30 days would be best.

If this is a permanent exhibition space and having holes in the wall is an issue, I would recommend a tensioned cable system such as those made by AS Hanging. http://www.ashanging.com/en/tensioned-cable-system A tensioned system also allows for a "security" type installation that makes it much more difficult to remove the pictures. Alternatively, AS also makes a Gallery Rod system that can also be security installed. http://www.ashanging.com/en/anti-theft-secure-rod-kit/
 
I always appreciate your tips and info, Rob.
You are the go-to guy for installation, especially commercial installation, in my opinion.

I would hesitate to use an adhesive, removable system like that in a public exhibit.
People will mess with stuff if given the slightest opportunity.

I go camping in an area out in the boondocks in Arizona that has a short trail leading to ancient petroglyphs.
There are signs that say "please don't touch the petroglyphs as the oil in your hands can damage these treasures".
Then you see where idiots have driven hundreds of miles to view these and have scratched their initials in the petroglyphs with their car keys.:mad:
The funny thing is that they are all over keeping your dog on a leash, but I think some of the humans visiting need to be on a leash.

If something falls in a public exhibit, someone will be looking to sue over something.
Just curious about any feedback on this. :kaffeetrinker_2:
 
neilframer said:
People will mess with stuff if given the slightest opportunity.
Click to expand...

Sad but true, Neil.

In this case, however, the only way to get to the command strips is to remove the picture to get to the "pull tabs" to remove the hangers.

I failed to mention, these hangers can "damage" walls if improperly removed or if the paint is not fully cured before application.

Personally, unless these pieces were VERY SMALL and either did not have glass or were framed only with acrylic, I would be wary of using them in a public (or even private) space.
 
3M's Command Adhesive hangers are excellent for tea towels, dressing gowns etc. but, in my humble opinion,( backed up by a shopfull of repair work,) they are useless for hanging pictures. I have had so many repair jobs from people using these hangers that I should buy some shares in 3M or at least send them a "thank-you" note.

There are two main problems with them:

Most film type adhesives work fairly well on glossy surfaces but most interior walls in most houses are painted with matt paint which has a roughened surface so that only half the adhesive is in contact with the paint.

You are not sticking the hanger to the wall but to the paint on the wall so you had better think about how well the paint may be stuck to the wall. If the paint job is relatively new or was done in a fast and dirty manner chances are your hanger and frame will finish up on the floor with a lick of paint stuck to the back of the hanger.

Best bet if the gallery owners won't let you drill holes is to use free-standing partitions or similar. Anyway, if this is a serious gallery why don't they have a proper hanging system installed? There are plenty to choose from.
 
Thanks for the comments - this is not a gallery, so while a rod/wire hanging system is best solution, it is not an option. Oddly enough, when they did this before, I commented to the facility manager that hanging art displays with traditional hangers was going to damage walls, and she said that the maintenance department had no issue with constant nail hole filling and repainting. Apparently she was mistaken. So, I welcome comments, but only comments regarding the usefulness (or lack thereof) for these strips will be pertinent to the discussion.
 
If they have a acoustic ceiling tiles you can hang them with wires strung from the grid that runs along the edge. To avoid putting holes in the newly painted walls I bent some hangers to make hooks to attach to the grid and ran wire down to the pictures.

Peter
 
peter@prestoframe said:
If they have a acoustic ceiling tiles you can hang them with wires strung from the grid that runs along the edge.
Click to expand...

Good suggestion, Peter -

AS Hanging has a system already made to do just what you are describing:



If you all have not spent some time on their site, it is worth your time. Many articles, photos, suggestions and a whole host of products made to display and hang art.

www.ashanging.com
 
josephforthill said:
I welcome comments, but only comments regarding the usefulness (or lack thereof) for these strips will be pertinent to the discussion.
Click to expand...

Not quite sure how many more comments you need unless you are waiting for validation that a Command Hanger that is only capable of holding 8 pounds is appropriate for use on a freshly painted wall in a commercial/public setting - which it isn't.

As someone who's business is art installation and who teaches installation at the WCAF, I think that using Command Hangers (in this application) is completely inappropriate.

I have used them and they work well if properly installed for an appropriate application but I would not do so in this case unless the pieces were extremely light (less than 8 pounds), did not have glass, and the painted walls were fully cured.
 
Rob Markoff said:
Not quite sure how many more comments you need unless you are waiting for validation that a Command Hanger that is only capable of holding 8 pounds is appropriate for use on a freshly painted wall in a commercial/public setting - which it isn't.

QUOTE]

Believe me, if this was my project, I would not have even considered this option (and now you know why I didn't volunteer to help them). Since I had never used them, I don't think they are convinced by my opinion; I had hoped to be able to gather enough first-hand opinions from professionals to either convince them not to do this, or worst case, alert them to the pitfalls should they pursue this.

One thing is for sure, they ain't getting one of my framed pictures for this if they plan on this method!
Click to expand...
 
I instinctively distrust the casual use of adhesives under stress, even slight stress.

Certain adhesives are appropriate for certain applications when they are properly engineered and all conditions are taken into account. For example, the adhesives used to hold wings on airplanes are carefully engineered, thoroughly tested, and completely dependable. On the other hand, if you use ATG to support a CD jewel case in a shadowbox, it will fail every time.

Will any version of Command Strips hold frames with glass on a painted wall for 8 weeks? I don't know, but I wouldn't accept any responsibility for that installation. The least the exhibit organizers could do is recommend acrylic glazing instead of glass.
 
josephforthill said:
Our local art guild is planning to hang an exhibit using these removable adhesive type things (3M Command strips?). This will be on a newly painted wall, and the building management does not want to have nails in walls any more. The art is to remain up for approximately 8 weeks. The exhibit arranger is asking for artwork to be weighed, so they can get the appropriate size hangers.

I have never used these, but would not feel that comfortable with them, particularly for artwork with glass. I am not in charge of this project, but felt it might be prudent to get some input from this group. Any experience with these things? Are they headed for disaster?

Thanks,
Joseph
Click to expand...

I have used these type of 3M hangers for years. The only problem that I have seen is when they are used in a particularly dry environment such as an apartment with base board heat, they tend dry over time. Under this type of circumstance I would suggest replacing them every year. But since you are talking about only 8 weeks, I don't think that drying out would be an issue. As Rob said though, use at least 2 per picture. The other thing you may want to be aware of is that you should not hang anything from the hangers for at least 24 hours after attaching them. They won't damage the wall, but need to cure a bit before weight is added.
 
Jim Miller said:
Will any version of Command Strips hold frames with glass on a painted wall for 8 weeks? I don't know, but I wouldn't accept any responsibility for that installation. The least the exhibit organizers could do is recommend acrylic glazing instead of glass.
Click to expand...

If this is a public exhibit I think it is mandatory to use acrylic. I might be wrong, but something in the back of my mind is remembering a time when I was framing for display at GM and they told me that because it was for public display, it must be acrylic. That may have just been their own in-house rules for liability reasons, it was so long ago that I don't recall. But you may want to have this customer check into it before they hang any pictures where they used glass instead of acrylic. Glass is dangerous no matter how it is hung when it is for public display. All it would take is some unruly child to slam into one of those pictures and it could be disastrous.
 
Being able to cut and paste some of the comments from this thread brought the group to their senses (well, at least closer). So, their next exhibit at this location has a reasonable chance of staying on the walls. I helped with another one of their exhibits this week, and at their next meeting I plan to speak about what is meant by "wired and ready to hang". One item fell off the wall due to a hanging device that was too bizarre to even describe here.

Thanks for the inputs.
 
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