• Welcome! You will have to REGISTER a free account, before you can access the system. If you already registered, please LOG IN. (top right)
    If you can't remember your password, CLICK HERE to reset it. If you have questions, feel free to click the CONTACT US link at the bottom of this page.
LifeSaver Cloud from LifeSaver Software, Inc.

Glass Chipping

shayla

WOW Framer
Forum Donor
Joined
Apr 5, 2008
Messages
31,390
Do any of you line the bottom 'trough' of your glass cutters with something? We're frustrated with how easily glass chips in our Fletcher 3100. Hubby has taken a rasp to the right side bar at center, (middle photo), but it still happens at the far left end with oversize pieces.

glass chip image 6015 jan 2020.jpg glass cutter center image 6026 jan 2020.jpg glass cutter end image 6022 jan 2020.jpg

He's planning to rasp this far end, but it seems like better engineering would have prevented the problem. We're very careful when moving large pieces, and it still happens.
 

prospero

SPFG, Supreme Picture Framing God
Joined
Jul 16, 2007
Messages
19,246
Excalibur 5000.

Yes, I think everyone has this problem and basically I think you just have to live with it.
With full sheets especially, even if you lower them into the machine very gingerly it's tricky not
to fetch a bit off a corner.
I did try lining the channel with some thin wood, but this makes it hard to slide the sheet and
eventually you plough a groove in to wood. Same with matboard lining - it rips up.

I have some nice short-pile carpet offcuts. Might try that. Stay tuned........

:oops:
 

wvframer

Humble Picture Framer
Forum Support Team
Forum Donor
Joined
Oct 9, 2007
Messages
1,799
Check to be sure the channel is perfectly flat. They can develop barely discernable grooves that can cause problems. It causes the lite to catch from back to front. I adjusted my right support so that it is not perfectly even with the left so that it isn't as likely to chip there as I slide the lite in place. This helps and is ok if you don't use the right side scale. It throws it off a bit.

I get little dings occasionally, but not as substantial as what your pics show. I use 32 x 40 lites most of the time. If I am loading them horizontally, it doesn't seem to matter how carefully I lower it into the channel.

It might help to replace those channels, but it might be costly with no guarantee that it would help. It might be worth the time to try to track down an expert on the machine at Fletcher.
 

shayla

WOW Framer
Forum Donor
Joined
Apr 5, 2008
Messages
31,390
...I did try lining the channel with some thin wood, but this makes it hard to slide the sheet and
eventually you plough a groove in to wood. Same with matboard lining - it rips up...
:oops:
That's what I imagine happening. As in, it wouldn't matter how protected the main part of the channel was; the glass would bind or fall down in the edge between liner and back rail. I'm interested in hearing how it goes. It's frustrating with a 40 x 60, but with a 48 x 68, even moreso.
 

shayla

WOW Framer
Forum Donor
Joined
Apr 5, 2008
Messages
31,390
Check to be sure the channel is perfectly flat. They can develop barely discernable grooves that can cause problems. It causes the lite to catch from back to front. I adjusted my right support so that it is not perfectly even with the left so that it isn't as likely to chip there as I slide the lite in place. This helps and is ok if you don't use the right side scale. It throws it off a bit.

I get little dings occasionally, but not as substantial as what your pics show. I use 32 x 40 lites most of the time. If I am loading them horizontally, it doesn't seem to matter how carefully I lower it into the channel.

It might help to replace those channels, but it might be costly with no guarantee that it would help. It might be worth the time to try to track down an expert on the machine at Fletcher.
Thanks for the idea. We don't much measure with the right side, but pieces often rest on it. Seems like lowering it to reduce weight on the far left end would make it harder to square the pieces. As for contacting the company, perhaps they could help. But with the other flaws we've had to fix on this, it would seem that if they cared more, they'd have done it right in the first place. The round cutting rods were so flimsy we ordered replacements from elsewhere.
 
Beauty, Brawn, and Brains: Wizard Z1 CMC

alacrity8

MGF, Master Grumble Framer
Joined
Sep 22, 2009
Messages
766
Does anyone line the back of their glass cutter to prevent scratched to Museum Glass?
I have stopped letting my assistant work with Museum, as every sheet that she cuts is ruined before it makes it to the fitting table.

Brian
 

Ylva

SPFG, Supreme Picture Framing God
Forum Support Team
Forum Donor
Joined
Jul 14, 2008
Messages
15,150
I have never lined, I used to have the paper act as my liner when cutting MG. Now I’m just extra careful.

I don’t have much of that chipping problem either. Sometimes, but that is usually because I didn’t handle it carefully enough.
 

neilframer

PFG, Picture Framing God
Forum Donor
Joined
Jan 27, 2010
Messages
8,025
Does anyone line the back of their glass cutter to prevent scratched to Museum Glass?
I have stopped letting my assistant work with Museum, as every sheet that she cuts is ruined before it makes it to the fitting table.

Brian
Being careful is the key as Ylva points out.
You have to set the glass down very gently.
We always wear gloves when handling Museum glass.
I sometimes put a 2 ply board behind the glass on a large piece and even with that when I slide the glass, I hold it away from the back of the cutter so the coated side is not really touching anything.

Also, I've mentioned this before, I never slide the museum glass out of the end of the box as I do with regular glass.
I open the front of the box and lift the glass out the front.

We've got 2 Fletcher 3100's and 1 Fletcher 3000.
We don't seem to have problems with these cutters and believe me, they get used a ton.
 

shayla

WOW Framer
Forum Donor
Joined
Apr 5, 2008
Messages
31,390
We always lift the glass from the front of the open box. Large Museum scraps are stored in the boxes with interleaving; small scraps are wrapped in kraft paper and stored elsewhere. We don't put any board behind the glass in the cutter, but are super careful and rarely have scratches. That said, it sounds like a good idea to use one. After not wearing glass gloves for my first seven years of framing, (because the folks who trained me didn't), I started wearing them in '99 and have done so since. We only get this chipping with 40 x 60 and larger. Seems like just the weight of it causes it chip on that left end. We're going to try wvframer's idea of adjusting the right side. Now that I think of it, I sometimes have to lift that leading right lower end of the lite up a tad, or it can get stuck on that first right thing (shown in center photo). Maybe this is because it's a wee bit high, and it makes sense that could cause a problem with big ones on the far left.
 

Joe B

PFG, Picture Framing God
Forum Donor
Joined
Mar 29, 2008
Messages
5,111
About once a week I dampen a paper towel with 3 in 1 oil and run it run it along both rails, it not only really cleans the rails but also makes them very slick. If I cut a lot of glass in a week I will do it more often. The oil is only a slight film but if you leave it set for 10 to 15 minutes it seems to soak into the metal. That does seem to help a lot, just be sure that it is only a slight film so that if you cut mats the oil doesn't damage the mat. I too filed down the very front of the right rail because there is no way that you can get that exactly the same as the left rail.
 
FrameReady Special Offer - Call 888-281-2202

artfolio

SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer
Joined
Feb 16, 2007
Messages
2,681
I rarely used to cut glass in my Fletcher because I simply do not think it is a safe way of working. Mine was set up with the tray at around waist height and the thought of a lite cracking badly (yes, they do that sometimes) and dropping a big sliver across my legs (or worse;) ) was enough to have me cutting my glass flat on the table.

Not being built like Arnie Schwarzenegger I never used 2mm 60 x 40 lites as the one time I got a batch they were too heavy for me to handle safely anywhere. The way those things flexed and wobbled while I was carrying them was scary:eek: I reluctantly and very carefully used them but never bought them again.
 

wpfay

Angry Badger
Forum Support Team
Forum Donor
Joined
Sep 1, 2000
Messages
10,739
We wax the bed of the cutter so the lites slide easily. Never had that particular problem, but know it comes from small pressure points. Keeping the bed clean is essential. We have 2 3000 machines and they each have their own personality. Weird but true.
 

Joe B

PFG, Picture Framing God
Forum Donor
Joined
Mar 29, 2008
Messages
5,111
We wax the bed of the cutter so the lites slide easily. Never had that particular problem, but know it comes from small pressure points. Keeping the bed clean is essential. We have 2 3000 machines and they each have their own personality. Weird but true.
Sounds like a really good idea. Do you have any problem with wax buildup on the glass? Is it hard to remove if it does buildup? I do something a really different with the tube on my 3100. I spray Pledge Furniture Cleaner onto a paper towel and run that up and down the tube to clean the tubes and to make the cutting head slide easily. The Pledge doesn't build up and really cleans to tubes nicely. About every 4 to 5 months I will do a good cleaning with lighter fluid but I do really like the Pledge in between those cleaning. It keeps the head sliding smoothly longer than the cleaning with lighter fluid and Pledge doesn't stink like the lighter fluid.
 

wpfay

Angry Badger
Forum Support Team
Forum Donor
Joined
Sep 1, 2000
Messages
10,739
Joe, I apply a paste wax to the bed (what I call the adjustable steel pieces the glass rests on) and then polish it off. There's no build up. This is probably more effective for acrylic than glass, but we cut more acrylic than glass.
I clean the guide tubes with alcohol or mineral spirits, and that's pretty much it. I don't use any kind of lubricant on them.
 

Jim Miller

SPFG, Supreme Picture Framing God
Forum Donor
Joined
May 19, 2000
Messages
17,911
Yes, careful handling and keeping the track clean and seem to be the best ways to avoiding edge-chipping. We have always kept a 3" wide paintbrush with our cutter and use it to sweep those tiny shards and debris out of the track before every cut.

Waxing is a great idea, too. Oiling, not so much, as it could increase the cleaning task.
 
Rian Fabrication Services  www.rianfabrication.com

framah

PFG, Picture Framing God
Joined
Mar 15, 2001
Messages
8,804
I put a sheet of suede matboard beind the Museum glass and slide them together so the glass never moves against the suede except to make that final adjustment to the ruler.

As for lubing. ..remember when we used to lube the rod on a mat cutter where the cutter head glides? Don't use now as I have an Eclipse.
Clean with lighter fluid and then spray with Caruthers lube and wipe down.
I like the idea of filing that edge. Must do.
 

CHolt

True Grumbler
Joined
Nov 20, 2012
Messages
52
You might take and swipe the downside edge of the lite with a glass seamer or a sharpening stone.
 

prospero

SPFG, Supreme Picture Framing God
Joined
Jul 16, 2007
Messages
19,246
That's what I imagine happening. As in, it wouldn't matter how protected the main part of the channel was; the glass would bind or fall down in the edge between liner and back rail. I'm interested in hearing how it goes. It's frustrating with a 40 x 60, but with a 48 x 68, even moreso.
With my customary rapidity I have now got around to testing this out. 😁

It works quite well. Glass slides along without digging in and it does provide a cushioning effect.

I used Flotex carpet which I've fitted tightly in the channels with a aid of a bit of d/s tape.

It may work with other types of 'kitchen' type carpet, but Flotex is not like others. It's akin to suede.
 

alacrity8

MGF, Master Grumble Framer
Joined
Sep 22, 2009
Messages
766
You might take and swipe the downside edge of the lite with a glass seamer or a sharpening stone.
Does anyone know of a good source for a glass seamer?
We have a customer who wants to seam the edge of 1,000 smallish pieces of glass.
I am hoping to find one for him to use himself. I do not have time for that.
The best price I could find was about $100 on Amazon.

Thanks,
Brian
 

framah

PFG, Picture Framing God
Joined
Mar 15, 2001
Messages
8,804
Used to be able to get them from United Manufacturers.

Definitely not $100 when i got mine lonnnnng ago.

WOW!! that's expensive and then the rods are around $20 per one!

Granted, it will last you forever and the rods do also last a long time.

Consider it an investment and a good way to not bleed all over the place. :thumbsup:
 
Beauty, Brawn, and Brains: Wizard Z1 CMC

David Hewitt

CGF II, Certified Grumble Framer Level 2
Joined
Feb 26, 2009
Messages
400
A knife sharpening stone works well, (2x6x1 is a good size) inexpensive, but will wear in time, a diamond coated sharpening devise will last a very long time, also inexpensive.
 

alacrity8

MGF, Master Grumble Framer
Joined
Sep 22, 2009
Messages
766
Does anyone know of a good source for a glass seamer?
Note: we already have one at the store, but I do not want to loan it out.
Our customer wants a way to grind bunch of edges, and will be done with the project within 6 months - year.

I'll let him know about using knife sharpening stones.
 

wvframer

Humble Picture Framer
Forum Support Team
Forum Donor
Joined
Oct 9, 2007
Messages
1,799
Mine looks like what Amazon is selling. I got if from United for a lot less than $20. I think it was $12. Since it is two stones and a plastic handle, $100 seems a lot.

But I would not want to do this job with a hand seamer. That is 4000 sides, and it isn't like you get it smooth on the first pass.

I would ask someone in the glass business. They could probably do this job quickly, easily, and cheaply since they have production tools.
 

monkey

CGF II, Certified Grumble Framer Level 2
Joined
Jun 20, 2011
Messages
324
Fletcher 3100..... I've been wondering if there is something better out there. I've filed down the right rail (glade to hear it's just not me). I peeled the sticker off, because I heard it could scratch the museum glass. Tried waxing the rails, found it time consuming. Now I just spray it with a dry lubricant easy & quick. I prefer WD-40 DRY LUBE their specialist line. Love this stuff, it dry & doesn't attract dust. I spray it on just about every thing that need to glide like the tube rails, miter saw sliding rails and saw blades, hinges, etc.

When I'm cutting a difficult sheet of musum glass I'll
put a sheet of 4 ply mat board behind it and slide it in the Fletcher as one piece. So the glass is not sliding against the mat board but with it over to the right side, than score the glass over the mat board with my thum on the lever to adjust the scoring pressure. When sliding the glass I like to lift it slightly higher than the mat board so only the mat is sliding on the bottom rail.

From years of service my bottom rails are not flat causing my cuts to be slightly out of square, which is annoying. I've been thinking about replacing them. Now I'm thing about just replacing it. Is there something better?
 

monkey

CGF II, Certified Grumble Framer Level 2
Joined
Jun 20, 2011
Messages
324
For a glass seamer, I just use a cheap sharpening stone from harbor freight for like $10. Use the fine stone & sand the edges at a 45 degree angle with light pressure. If you want a smoother edge follow it up finer stone or sand paper. Or you could just use sand paper. That's what I used before I picked up the sharpening stone. Basically your just sanding the edges smooth.
 
Vermont Hardwoods solid wood picture frame molding

IFGL

SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer
Joined
Jun 1, 2012
Messages
3,728
I have modified a few of our machines because of poor design, actually thinking about it the only one I have not modified is our Cassese 939 saw, actually no scrub that I have modified that too :(
 
Vermont Hardwoods solid wood picture frame molding
Top