Framing a Plate

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DLB

DLB

MGF, Master Grumble Framer
Joined
Sep 5, 2006
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688
Loc
Salt Lake City, Utah
Hi Everyone,

Does anyone have any advice about how to mount a dinner plate? I haven't done a plate before, so any advice and tips are much appreciated. It is approximately 12" across and is about 1 - 1.5" deep.

Thanks for your help.

dave.
 
just so happens i'm straight from the inline catalog(trying to figure out how to price 'odd' shaped glass in LSS) where they have a hex-plate box #351 in 9,10,11,12,13,14' diam($33-$58) assembled/complete
 
Cut a nest hole in your mount board, to fit the plate's base, and hold the plate in it by three or four formed-rod mounts covered with shrink tubing.

I suggest resisting these two temptations:
1. Mighty Mounts. They break.
2. Holding the plate in its nest by resting the glass on its lip. Expansion/contraction cycles cause movement that might damage the lip over time, especially if it is gilded or painted.
 
I framed a couple of hundred collector plates back in the 90's when they were the rage and I got my information from the American Institute of Conversation. I won't pass on what they said to mount a fired ceramic plate with as I am sure that the materials have changed since then but I would do something similar to what Jim had mentioned. I would cut a hole in the backing, usually a piece of matboard or matboard mounted onto foamcore or Sintra so that you could read the information on the back stamp of the plate. I did some deep shadowboxes and some that were not so deep but, in all cases again like Jim said, I never allowed the plate to touch the glass. The 23 k. gold rims would rub off and discolor with every vibration of the wall that the plate was hung.

OK, back then, it was permissible to use silicone to adhere the plate to the backing board. Since the surface of the plate was fired ceramic, it was felt that the silicone would do no damage to the surface of the plate and, since it never really hardened, you could easily remove the silicone adhesive if needed. Other types of adhesive would sometimes dry rock hard and be almost impossible to remove without scratching or otherwise damaging the surface of the plate. I wasn't going to divulge this information for fear of tongue lashings but hey ho, you are probably old enough to make up your own mind which way to go if you have choices to make. I have also used Jim's methods of bent rods glued into channels of coroplast and coated with shrink tubing and it works equally as well.

Hope this helps.
 
AAAAAAUUUUGGGHHH. This makes my teeth hurt.

Framerguy said:
...it was permissible to use silicone to adhere the plate to the backing board. Since the surface of the plate was fired ceramic, it was felt that the silicone would do no damage to the surface of the plate and, since it never really hardened, you could easily remove the silicone adhesive if needed...
Click to expand...

:faintthud:
Every time it is used, one of two things will happen with silicone adhesive:
1. It will stick too well and never can be removed, or
2. It won't stick well enough and the bond will fail.

Of course, Tom knows this and no longer uses that dreadful goo. Right, Tom?:D
 
I knew going in that I'd catch merry he11 for posting that but y'all are just sitting out there waiting for another fat rooster to BBQ so here I am!

Jim, you should know better than to take half of what I write and run with it. That was over 10 years ago and, yes, it DID come from the AIC as that was their feelings at the time. There wasn't enough study done with hard baked ceramic surfaces back then to give a definitive answer and this was the crux of what I was told would work with minimal damage to the plates.

I can forgive Paul for his remark as he probably didn't know that the AIC was fallible but I wonder how many tests have been run and verified using silicone adhesive to merit such a response from you, Jim??? I would appreciate any and all documents that you have or can refer me to that will back up your claims. I wasn't trying to act like I knew how to do these plates nor was I trying to convince anyone that my way was the only way. I think I stated that this was what was recommended to me in the early 90's. And I also mentioned that anyone who is adult enough can make their own decisions based on what they are presented.

First and foremost, I am NOT condoning the use of silicone for anything!! I hope that is quite clear to anyone reading this post. But I also don't make wild claims without proper verification and there was a man by the name of Butler, if memory serves me, that had told me about this procedure and he also told me that this was all he had on effects on ceramic surfaces. At that point in time they just simply thought that there would be little effects on a surface that was formed under a few thousand degrees of temperature.

Regarding the 400+ plates that I mounted in the102 or 15 years that I was doing that kind of work, I have yet to have a complaint about plates falling from their mounts, ceramic peeling from the plates or any other deterioriation of the ceramic surface caused by the use of silicone, or any other problem with the original mounts. I am just trying to set the record straight. What I did 12 to 15 years ago was what I knew at the time. And the failure rate was 0. Maybe it wasn't the right way to do plates according to what we all know or think we know today but it was what I had to work with at the time. And the AIC was an organization that I trusted and still trust and I don't think that they gave me any information that was detrimental to my work nor did they make up stuff to get me off their phone lines.

Technology, for whatever it's worth, wasn't as good last century as it is today, so they say.
 
Framerguy said:
I can forgive Paul for his remark as he probably didn't know that the AIC was fallible ...
Click to expand...

Tom, I think Paul was just pointing out that you typed "Conversation" instead of "Conservation" ;)
 
Baby tiles

No really you guys. Dave’s question is timely for me too, as a mother of four brought in hand/foot imprint tiles for framing. We’re going to float them on silk. I admit to using silicone in certain situations and for a nice industrial grip I have a tube of liquid nail. But seriously, these are ceramic pieces that are this lady’s “prized possessions”. How should I mount them to the silk float? Carefully, yes, but with what? Have I designed myself into a corner on this?

Thanks,

Tom...
 
Jim Miller said:
Cut a nest hole in your mount board, to fit the plate's base, and hold the plate in it by three or four formed-rod mounts covered with shrink tubing.
Click to expand...


Jim, could you elaborate a little bit more on the formed rod mounts and shrink tubing? I am not familiar at all with that stuff, and any further explanation, I'm sure will make sure I don't screw this up.

Just as a not, they do have gold leaf around the lip, and no, I guarantee you, it's not coming even close to the glass. The plates are White House Dinner Plates. Yes, the Oval Office kind of White House kind. No pressure right? Now you can see why I am going through such painstaking detail in how to do this. I think I am going to make a trip to IKEA to buy a few test pieces first though.

dave.
 
Just for giggles and such...

I was referencing Vivian Kistler's book "Framing Collectibles in shadow box frames" and on page 26 the following two methods are recommended:

"Mighty Mounts - Mighty mounts plate holders are small plastic hooks made especially for attaching plates to a backing board. They are inserted throgh the backing board and secured from behind with a speed nut. Use three on a typical plate for a balanced hold."

I looked at the picture, and you can see the mounts, not very pleasing to the eye, and kind of a distraction in my opinion. Plus, they break.

"Sink Mat and Silicone - Cut a bevel mat opening from a fabric-covered board then cut a foam board to match. The opening should accommodate the raised ring or smooth curve at the back of the plate. Permanently bond the two ogether. Place three dabs of silicone on opening of mat. Set the plate in the sink mat and gently press against the silicone. Allow to thoroughly dry and cure before sealing inside frame."

Hmmmm.

Dave.
 
I too am about to mount a plate - fortunately I have no worries about breakage as it is sterling silver - I was planning on cutting a sink mat, wrapping with (pale green) silvercloth, and then applying Mighty Mounts.

As a matter of fact, having never ordered MMs before and seeing they came 12 to a package, I ordered 12 and got a dozen packages.

Waddaya mean they break? From what? Weight? UV light?

Arrrggghhh!

Anyone need any Mighty Mounts??? :)
 
It makes my teeth hurt too

Ok, everyone, settle down.

In his defense Framerguy DID say that he does not recommend silicone, and that the information which mentioned it was 10 or more years old. And as Dave pointed out, information, even from the experts, can go out of date.

Thus the need for education, folks! Read the trades and the Grumble, go to the shows, take classes!

Having said all that, silicone if fraught with sins and weaknesses and I would only ever even consider it as a desperate last resort.
 
Framar said:
Waddaya mean they break? From what? Weight? UV light?

Arrrggghhh!

Anyone need any Mighty Mounts??? :)
Click to expand...

Mar,
I think it's a thing with the way MM's are injection moulded.

This type of production seems to be susceptible to UV damage, which (gleaned from past threads) seems to make them brittle.

POSSIBLY, UV glass would go a long way to prevent this, but who knows what visible and IR light will do to it too.

I find that cast acrylic forming isn't a problem with this type of UV break down.

I think you should be able to return the over ordered plate holders.
Give MM's a call and explain how you accidentally ordered so many. : )
 
Framar said:
Waddaya mean they break? From what? Weight? UV light?
Click to expand...

Mar, I've probably re-framed more plates than I've framed over the years, because of failed mighty mounts. Like monofiliment line, the plastic gets brittle with age, and most likely, exposure to light. I don't remember a single one that had used UV glass. And often, not enough mounts were used to handle the weight of the plate, or spaced too far apart so that the plate slid out, even when the mounts didn't break. The grommets on the back can slip so the holding power is compromised as well. It doesn't take much of a jar to knock them loose.

Also, when I frame a plate, I scan the information on the back of it and place a copy of it in a certificate holder on the back dust cover, so I don't (unless the customer insists) have to expose the back of the plate in the framing package.

Okay, I'll admit it, I haven't had to frame a plate since I discovered the Grumble and found out that silicone is the S-word. So I'm paying attention here about the "proper" method of mounting a plate for future info, and I'm confused.....

Jim, I'm trying to visualize the formed rods with the shrink-tubing on the ends, holding the plate at it's rim? Like the spring-loaded plastic-tipped wire plate holders I have holding up my Fiesta Ware saucers in my kitchen, except not spring-loaded, and imbedded in coroplast, like you taught us? Is the shrink-tubing "safe" from slight rubbing (vibration) on those rims, especially the gold-rimmed ones? I can't help but wonder if silicone wouldn't be safer in this case, combined with the sink mount method? (she says, as she ducks). I don't recall ever reframing a plate where the silicone let go (she ducks again), only the mighty mounts and in one case, rolled-up duct tape (that one was framed by a "professional" framer.) I'm confused on this one.
 
Val,
I did have a plate held with silicone let go. Luckily it was my own (a shop sample) and the plate did not break. It was leaning against the wall on the floor and a feline visitor ran behind it and knocked it flat on its face on the carpeted floor. It was not much of a jar, but the silicone gave.

I remounted it with the matte-shrink tubing covered bent brass rods and have it hanging as a shop sample. It really helps to have a piece mounted with the rods as a sample. NO ONE, not a one, has objected to having their piece mounted that way once they see the sample.

I get the rods and shrink tubing at a good hardware store, the tubing is in the electrical dept. They're cheap. Go get some and playplayplay!

The sink mount works nicely, I have even built a round, padded 'collar' to function the same way for an especially delicate plate on which it was important to show the whole depth of it (it was more of a bowl.)

I will try to post some photos of finished projects.

edie the bent goddess
 
Here are some pictures of the bent brass rod (covered in matte black shrink tubing) mounts.
A ceramic/porcelain plate:
IMG_1798.jpg


A close-up of one of the rod mounts:
IMG_1803.jpg


A cheap Pier One wood tray (this is also one of my museum glass displays- half is glazed in museum glass, the other half with regular glass- this piece has sold acres of museum glass):
IMG_1805.jpg


A close up of the mount:
IMG_1807.jpg


We framed these several years ago and If I do say so myself, the rods are rather clunky on these. I have gotten better at forming them so that they fit neater and show less. I did purposely make the mounts on the tray somewhat oversize so that customers would know the worst they would look! Most people notice them only when I point them out. It is amazing how unobtrusive they are even done clumsily.

Hope that helps.
Edie the mattebrown goddess
 
I agree with Tom.

Framerguy said:
...Jim, you should know better than to take half of what I write and run with it. That was over 10 years ago and, yes, it DID come from the AIC as that was their feelings at the time....
Click to expand...

Sorry to raise your ire, Tom. I only meant to reinforce what you said about it being an outdated method -- with gusto. A lot of what we (me, too) did in the early 90s makes my teeth hurt today. That's progress, my friend.

I wasn't aware that AIC recommended silicone a decade ago, but it doesn't come as a surprise. AIC doesn't have official standards. Recommendations come from the members who respond to questions, so the answers are only as good as the responding member's knowledge. AIC members probably would not make such a recommendation today, and I think you pointed that out already.
 
How much preservation do you want?

DLB said:
..."Sink Mat and Silicone - Cut a bevel mat opening...should accommodate the raised ring or smooth curve at the back of the plate. Permanently bond the two ogether. Place three dabs of silicone on opening of mat. Set the plate in the sink mat and gently press against the silicone. Allow to thoroughly dry and cure before sealing inside frame." Hmmmm. Dave.
Click to expand...

Silicone is a strong and versatile adhesive, one of few that would probably stick to a smooth-glazed ceramic surface. So, when preservation is not an issue -- if the plate is purely decorative and will never have any long term value -- then the "Sink Mat and Silicone" method would probably work. Probably.

The hazards of silicone also apply to most other kinds of adhesives, to some degree. Offgassing is probably less of an issue with other adhesives, but no matter what kind of glue is used, bond strength is usually uncertain.

That is, maybe the glue will stick to both surfaces, or maybe it won't. Maybe both surfaces will remain structurally sound, or maybe one won't. If the adhesive sticks to both surfaces and they remain intact, then no problem -- unless you want to get it off.

If the adhesive fails to stick to one of the surfaces, or if one of the surfaces flakes, peels, disintegrates, delaminates, warps, or otherwise fails at the glued spot, you'll know soon enough.

If the plate has any monetary or sentimentral value, then I would not use any kind of glue on it, for the two reasons stated on page one of this thread.
 
realhotglass said:
...I find that cast acrylic forming isn't a problem with this type of UV break down...
Click to expand...

I used Mighty Mounts for years before I had any trouble with them. I think something about them changed a few years ago.

To my limited knowledge, acrylic is not a very light sensitive material, such as nylon is, for example.

My speculation is that the molded acrylic mounts may be subjected to too much heat in production, or maybe the formulation of the plastic is of inconsistent quality. Who knows?

I asked the maker for informaiton about strength ratings for the various types of Mighty Mounts, and also about the failures I've had with them, but did not get a reply. So, I moved on to better, more secure ways of mounting.
 
Edie, I'm convinced, I learned how to do the formed rods and shrink tubing in Jim's class at WCAF, and have been practicing since then. I was just wondering about how they would be against a gold-trimmed edge of an important plate, such as Dave's White House plates.

Great plate display, by the way! And love that fillet! (Glad you're back!)
 
Not to beat up on them too much, but another problem I've had with Mighty Mounts is that they just aren't very versatile. For instance, they have holders for dollar coins, quarters and others. But if you have a foreign coin the size may well be different and it won't fit. A piece of Mylar/Melinex can be cut to any size and configuration to fit any coin or object.

Val said:
Edie, I'm convinced, I learned how to do the formed rods and shrink tubing in Jim's class at WCAF, and have been practicing since then. I was just wondering about how they would be against a gold-trimmed edge of an important plate, such as Dave's White House plates.

Great plate display, by the way! And love that fillet! (Glad you're back!)
Click to expand...

I haven't tried this personally, but you could get wider flat strips of brass or steel to use instead of rods. That would spread the forces over a larger area and allow you to line the contact areas with a padding such as Volara.
 
FramerDave said:
I haven't tried this personally, but you could get wider flat strips of brass or steel to use instead of rods. That would spread the forces over a larger area and allow you to line the contact areas with a padding such as Volara.
Click to expand...

That idea makes me more comfortable, Dave. Where would one find those wider strips?

And what's Volara? (sounds like it could be the name of my Evil Twin....Valorie and Volara....hmmmm)
 
Thanks for posting those pics Edie. I was having trouble visualizing what the rod and shrink wrap looked like. Doesn't look bad at all. Might give it a try.
 
Val said:
That idea makes me more comfortable, Dave. Where would one find those wider strips?

And what's Volara? (sounds like it could be the name of my Evil Twin....Valorie and Volara....hmmmm)
Click to expand...

You can get the brass or steel strips from the same place you get the rods: a good hobby store. I wouldn't bother with a big box "craft" store. You want a hobby store where they sell model-making supplies. They're far more likely to have them and in a good variety. They're usually pretty cheap too, so pick up a variety while you're there.

Volara is a closed-cell polyethylene foam used for padding storage boxes, display cases and the like. University Products sells it in sheets. You can also get it by the roll from Larson. Sort of looks like weather stripping. It's used in framing mainly for lining the inside of the lip of a frame to provide some cushioning for a canvas. I'd think that a little strip of it would fit perfectly on a brass or steel strip for a cushion.


(It usually makes me think of those old Plymoth Volare commercials with the song. I think they came with rich Corinthian leather too)
 
Thanks for posting the pics...I was completely confused...now Im gonna go find a plate to mount!
 
Oh good, I'm glad the pictures helped.
About the framing:

The first plate is mounted on a black suedette wrapped mounting board, then matted with a black suedette wrapped mat, and yes, a black stem frame. The mat has two what-I-call Ultra Deep Bevels. I have been wrapping various materials around bevelled strips of fome core for a while. I noticed that Bainbridge's BevelAccents are plain-janer versions of the same thing. I like to use very decorative papers and fabrics on my ultra deep bevels. I used a b&w leopard print on one bevel and a zany Guatemalan-type fabric on the second. Then the whole works is raised up as well. The black mat begged museum glass, I obliged. This piece has sold its fair share of museum glass, but the half and half is more effective.

Also, I have used flat pieces of brass bent to hold valuable and old Portuguese tiles in a frame. Each tile was about 5" square. The set of four tiles needed to be butt up against each other, so I used brass tabs, cut, painted, drilled and screwed into individual pieces of plywood on three sides to allow for the butt. I lined each tab with that black foam stuff for rabbets- is it volara? Maybe. I put a piece of thin batting behind each tile against the plywood. I painted the front of the plywood pieces black so they would hopefully register as a void. The four pieces of plywood were held together as one unit with scrap pieces of acrylic drilled with screw holes. Then the whole works went into a delish Roma frame (artichoke something) cut a titch bigger so the edge of the tiles showed. The tabs were barely noticeable, my customer loved it and I hung it on the spot.

Hope this picture helps:
IMG_0902.jpg


Here's the back:
IMG_0903.jpg


And, yes, as a matter of fact the plywood pieces were from my junk/recycled stash.
 
This is the bowl mounted with the collar functioning as a sink mat. The collar is padded with batting. The frame is one that Cornel at American Choice designed and wrought as a shadowbox to my customer's specifications and it is a beauty. This customer preferred the black rods- he didn't want them to be painted.

For the shadowbox lining/spacer thingys, I used pieces of lattice-type wood strips, sanded, primed and then wrapped in the linen. One of my framing pet peeves is those chintzy fome core shadowbox strips atg'd with fabric- ickypoo. I like using wood strips because they look more precise and you can remove and reinsert them without trashing them.

The mounting:
IMG_0137.jpg


With the gorgeous American Choice frame:
IMG_0139.jpg
 
More great pics, Edie! And congratulations on your fine uses of the brass rod & flat stock.

Did you know that instead of using the individual plywood boards, you could use a single sheet of 8 mm or 10 mm Coroplast as a backer for the tiles? The mounts can be securely encapsulated in the air spaces between flutes by hotmelt, epoxy, or other hard-setting glop. That would be lighter-weight and maybe a bit less time consuming to assemble, but probably no more supportive than your plywood.
 
Val said:
...I was just wondering about how they would be against a gold-trimmed edge of an important plate, such as Dave's White House plates.
Click to expand...

You're thinking in the right direction, Val. Abrasion would be a problem for a gilded lip on the plate.

Dave's suggestion of using flat stock instead of rod is a very good idea. As he said, it increases the surface area and reduces pressure on the fragile surface.

And Volara seems like a good padding choice, too. That would "give" a little to accommodate expansion/contraction, but should not abrade the lip. It is important to have padding that is smooth, soft, and not abrasive. Paper or felt, for example, may be slightly abrasive.
 
Jim, I thought about the coroplast, but the tiles were pretty blasted heavy (there was still thinset on the back of each) and I wanted the support of screwed tabs. I can't quite conceive of how the tabs would work on the interior edges of the tiles. Show me. Please.:shrug:

edie
 
Edie, the mounts could fit the tiles the same way, but instead of having to make individual mount boards, you could simply poke all of the mounts through one sheet of Coroplast.

I guess you could have used one sheet of plywood, too, but you would have had to make some fancy cuts in the wood to pass through those inner mounts, eh? With Coroplast, passing the mounts through the board is a piece of cake. (Aw, jeez. Now I'm hungry again.)
 
Welp, it guess it comes down to convenience.
I ruled out the coroplast early on because I only have it in white, clear and electric blue (and I order 50 sheets at a time) and I got it in my head that the backer needed to be black (it did show a bit.) I have tried several types of paint on coroplast, but only Sure Shot (or something like that) enamel sign paint worked marginally, but it took too long to dry and crawled a bit on the surface.

Jim, how would you have addressed the black backer issue?

Fancy cuts in wood are beyond my capabilities at the shop, I suppose I could have begged a woodworker. It is very hard to leave the shop to do things like that though, so I just had to make do with what I had on hand. It took less time to screw the pieces together than it would have taken me to seek out help elsewhere. Hence, the individual pieces.
 
Framing Goddess said:
Jim, how would you have addressed the black backer issue?
Click to expand...

If I ran out of black Coroplast, I might have bought a cut piece of it from a local sign guy. More expensive, but still cheap.

But I probably would not want the shiny plastic to show at all, so I might have put a black 4-ply matboard over my white board. Or maybe black fabric.

I haven't tried to paint Coroplast yet, but thanks for the idea.:popc:
 
Krylon makes a fast drying paint just for plastic..... their original idea was to color change that tacky resin lawn furniture. It also does a fast number on Frame space which is always to shiney.

On poly flute it is a fast primer for rolling Frank's Fabric Adhesive for wrapping a backer.
 
I saw how the flat stock was wrapped around and attached to the board. I still have a few questions though.

1. How do you attach the rod to the board?
2. Do you have to use a board as a backer? What alternantives are there? (I'm limited in rabbet space.)
3. Should I put some type of padding in between the rod and the plate?

You guys have been a tremendous help, and I appreciate every last one of you.

I wouldn't know a tenth of what I know without you.

*END BUTTKISSING* (I really mean what I say though).

Dave.
 
DLB said:
1. How do you attach the rod to the board?
Dave.
Click to expand...

Depends on the mount board. I like polyflute because you can poke the rod/flat stock through the top skin and encapsulate the mount in the air space between flutes. To inject hotmelt, epoxy, or some other hard-setting glue, just use a razor blade or X-Acto knife to slice a flap in the back skin of the board. Very sturdy.

Of course you should pad the mounts. That's the purpose of covering them with shrink tubing, but some other type of padding might be better for some jobs.
 
Unhappy Customers

I just delivered the first plate that I did for my customers. And..."they're not crazy with the way it's 'done' ."

The way it was mounted is the most likely culprit. In the past, whoever has done it for them, has used silicone to attach it.

What a conundrum this presents. Do I go against what I know is right, and mount it with silicone?

I'm not sure what to do here. Help a guy out wth some advice.

dave.
 
Oh boy. What was their problem with it?

First thought, explain to them why you mounted it the way you did. Preservation, protection, etc. Point out that they may have been glued in the past, but we have better methods today. And after all, this is the way a museum would have mounted it probably.

I have a feeling Jim will have a good diplomatic answer.
 
Dave, how did you end up mounting it? Got pictures?
 
Dave,
Last year I had a similar situation. A lady brought in a previously framed plate frame in a Shadowbox without glass and a nice plaque mounted below the plate. She wanted a new one done to look "exactly" like the previous.
I tried to talk her into the current methods using rods, etc. but she didn't want that at all.
I got her to leave the old one so that I could get a look at it from the back side. I ended up mounting the new one as the original was.
She was happy (even though I wasn't), paid the price, including a pita surcharge.
Some days are just like that. :kaffeetrinker_2:
 
FramerDave said:
..I have a feeling Jim will have a good diplomatic answer.
Click to expand...

Yes Dave. I would have responded to the customer's complaint with something like, "Oh Yeah? Well, @#%*$#@!"
Ok, probably not.
:icon11:

It would have been good to review the design plans with the customer before actually doing the work; to talk about the benefits of non-invasive, reversible mounting, and get her approval ahead of time. At this point it may be too late for the preservation discussion.

If the customer insists on "invisible" mounting, explain the evils of gluing. Make sure she understands that gluing reduces the value of the plate. Conversely, non-invasive, reversible mounting by mechanical devices not only preserves the plate's value, but provides more-forgiving support in the event of impact.

The choice is hers, ultimately. If she cares more about invisible mounting than she cares about preserving the value of the plate, then glue it like the other guy did. If she considers long term value to be important, then you have the advantage of providing her information and protective framing, which her previous framer did not.
 
As I guessed, they were not happy with the rods. In the past, the plates were siliconed to MDF in the back. Ugh. After I took great pains to find out the best way to mount it, they want it done the crappy way. The problem was, is that I never had direct contact with the customer. Never talked to them or anything. I get a lot of business through an intermediary (they're in a different industry that gets quite a few requests for framing). Both the customer and the intermediary didn't convey what they wanted. They both liked it, but "it wasn't what they're used to getting." They accepted the first one that I gave them, but they want the rest siliconed. I'm aprehensive to post pictures up here. I'm a newbie, and this was my first project like this. I guess you have to start somewhere, so I will post them in a seperate post. Please be kind when you critique. I have thick skin, but I'm kind of demoralized at this point.

dave.
 
An intermediary!

DLB said:
The problem was, is that I never had direct contact with the customer. Never talked to them or anything. I get a lot of business through an intermediary (they're in a different industry that gets quite a few requests for framing). Both the customer and the intermediary didn't convey what they wanted. They both liked it, but "it wasn't what they're used to getting."
dave.
Click to expand...

Here is the problem. Doing work for a third party is always a pain. One way to get customers, but not through your door.
 
I don't have a door - YET. So this is a vital part of my business. I typically do a lot of premade designs for military stuff. The intermediary is in the military "stuff" business as well, so it's a no brainer. There is always going to be growing pains.

dave.
 
I think your bent rod mounts look very good - you even went to the trouble of painting them to blend into the plate design. Had you covered them with shrink tubing prior to painting (for cushioning against the plate)?

I probably would have cut a circular mat opening rather than a square one, and left more space between the outside of the plate and the mat opening. Otherwise, I think you did fine.
 
Twin2 said:
I think your bent rod mounts look very good - you even went to the trouble of painting them to blend into the plate design. Had you covered them with shrink tubing prior to painting (for cushioning against the plate)?

I probably would have cut a circular mat opening rather than a square one, and left more space between the outside of the plate and the mat opening. Otherwise, I think you did fine.
Click to expand...

Yes, based on the advice (sorry, can't remember who said it, I used shrink tube on each rod. I also painted them (based on someones advice.). I used a square opening, because that was one thing the customer said they wanted. I wanted to use a circular opening, but....

After completing it, I agree, the spacing needs a little bit more "opening". The problem is, one of the changes they want is a triple mat now. Ugh. I aim to please. It's pretty cool though that I'm getting to work on a project like this. I will bend over backwards to make them happy though.

Thanks for the critique. Keep them coming...

dave.
 
I forgot to show a couple of pics I took showing how I attached the rods to the MDF backer board. I left some extra rod stickout, and bent it over, then I used epoxy to hold it in place. I was happy with how secure it held. Something different I guess. Let me know what you think.

dave.
 

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