fletcher 3000 cutting glass

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Flintstone

Flintstone

CGF II, Certified Grumble Framer Level 2
Joined
Aug 9, 2003
Posts
255
Loc
setauket, ny
Hi Everyone:
I need some help with glass cutting. I am not getting good cuts with my Fletcher 3000. It used to cut great so I figure it must be an adjustment. I am trying to figure it out from past posts and the instruction book.

First I changed the wheel, so it's not that. I can see the score is not consistant. It never has been, I always added a little pressure on the trigger. But I have since learned (via the G) you're not suppose to do that. Since I sometimes need to pass through matboard twice, I'm thinking the Rocker Arm Adjusting Screw. However I am chicken to mess with factory presets so I just want to see what you guys think. The unit is not that old (maybe three or four years) and 99% of the time I cut AR-Op3 acrylic, so I haven't used the cutting wheel that often.

Also, whenever I cut, I always get a chip on the top and/or bottom of the score. I think it's because I try and start and finish on the very ends to make sure I get a top to bottom score. Does everybody get that, or is it just me?

And questions about oiling the wheel... How often do you do it? What kind of oil...I have "3 in 1 Oil" which is a multi purpose oil or do you use something like WD-40? And where do you place the oil...right on the wheel, or in the crevasse where the wheel attaches to the turret?

ok...I think that should cover it.
 
Try the pressure adjusting knob, in step 4 of the cutting glass section of the manual. It sounds like yours might be backed out too far.

Ours has a range of 10 turns from just engaging the spring pressure to fully CW. TruVue glass cuts well with the adjustment between 3 and 7 turns using a carbide cutting wheel, depending upon the age of the wheel. Newer = closer to 3; older = closer to 7. The carbide wheel seem to last almost forever.

We've never used oil of any kind on the cutter.
 
Rick's right, it sounds like you don't have that brass adjusting knob turned in far enough. It should have enough spring pressure to hold the wheel against the glass through the entire pass from top to bottom.

Regarding chips, I start off the top edge of the glass and roll the cutter wheel onto the glass surface in one fluid movement from top to bottom. You should not get a flake of glass at either the top or the bottom end of the stroke. It should make an even sizzling sound from start to finish of the cut and there should not be a shower of shards of glass as you draw the cutter down the surface of the glass. If you are getting this condition, back off on the brass knob adjustment a turn or 2 and try again.

I never have used oil on my cutter head either. It has always made perfect cuts for me for the last 18 years and I don't mess with anything that is working THAT well!!

I'll bet that your brass knob has worked its way out and simply needs some tweaking if the machine cut OK up to a point and suddenly started to mess up the cuts.

Good luck with it.

Framerguy
 
Quote: Also, whenever I cut, I always get a chip on the top and/or bottom of the score. I think it's because I try and start and finish on the very ends to make sure I get a top to bottom score. Does everybody get that, or is it just me?
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You don't need to start or end your score at the very edge of the glass. Stop just before you get to the edge, the cut will "run" the rest of the way and you won't get that chip, and lessen the chance that it will run the wrong direction in the frame later because of the stress from the chip.

I've never oiled either. You do with cutting stained glass though, is that where you got the idea?
 
I didn't mean cutting stained glass on the Fletcher, but with a hend-held cutter. Sorry, that might've been confusing.
 
Ok guys, I turned the adjusting knob. I only had one turn before I got the even "sizzle" sound that Framerguy describes. By the way, my adjusting knob is a plain old screw...steel I think but definitely not brass.

Regarding oil...says to oil in the instruction manual. I also read it on one of the past posts on the "G".

I am cutting True Vue Conservation Refletion Control. There is no writing on the glass to identify the coated side. I determined the coated side by scratching it. I place the coated side towards the wall while cutting. Still getting crappy cuts. Anybody got any other suggestions?

And thanks for your help so far.
 
If you oil that, you will have a nightmare of ruined mats....oily spots from the edge of the glass. Trust me. The oil is simply meant to lengthen the life of the cutting head, but I've found it not to make that big of a difference (with my hand-held cutter...stained glass), and it doesn't effect the cutting quality. And NOT worth the frustration of oily mats/hands/work table etc.
What do you mean by a "crappy cut"? Describe please. Is there a second trigger for a breaking tool, with the 2 rubber wheels on each side of the cut? I wonder if something is out of whack there, although that shouldn't turn a decent score (you said you're getting an even "sizzle" sound) into a crappy break. Are you still pushing on the cutting head? A "hard" score will sometimes cause crappy cuts.
 
Ok, no oil on the wheel. I'm glad i brought it up.

Definition of a crappy cut...i cut a 20" x 24" this morning. The last 4 inches curved off slightly to the left of the cut thus making the glass scrap.

There is a second trigger for breaking out. I'll look at that next. Thanks for the thought. I wouldn't have thought to go there on my own.

I am not pushing on the head anymore. I don't have to. The scores are pretty nice.
 
Originally posted by Flintstone:
I'm thinking the Rocker Arm Adjusting Screw. However I am chicken to mess with factory presets so I just want to see what you guys think....
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Flintstone,

The Rocker Arm Adjustment screw (glad you know where it is! :D ) is used primarly to adjust how deep the mat cutting blade rests within the channel. It would also have a little impact on your cutting of acrylic. The key with adjusting this screw is to make sure it is snug (Service removable lock-tite) otherwise it would "wander" and that would really throw things off. It does come "factory set", but don't be afraid to adjust it if necessary.

Also, whenever I cut, I always get a chip on the top and/or bottom of the score. I think it's because I try and start and finish on the very ends to make sure I get a top to bottom score. Does everybody get that, or is it just me?
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The Fletcher-Terry manual suggests starting above the glass and running into the glass allowing the ramp to protect and lay the glass cutting wheel onto the top of the glass. If you use this technique, then you need to make sure the ramp has not worn out.

3000-cutting-head-turret.gif


Replacement ramps are available from FTCO directly online - Part 72 in the illustration above.

I personally lay the cutting wheel close to the top of the glass and immediately move into an even moderate speed, fast enough to allow the wheel to turn.

Regardless of how you start, you can run off the end of the glass without damaging the glass or the wheel. Since the score runs to the end, this is the location where I recommend you apply pressure to break the glass - On the bottom and let the break bleed to the top!

...Definition of a crappy cut...i cut a 20" x 24" this morning. The last 4 inches curved off slightly to the left of the cut thus making the glass scrap...
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This indicates uneven scoring and/or uneven pressure. The Brass screw adjusts the tension to the glass wheel, and typically you should see about 1/2 inch of threads exposed. Less than that and it's too much - The score will "talk" to you! :eek: A Good Score is Barely Visible and Barely Audible.

...There is a second trigger for breaking out. I'll look at that next. Thanks for the thought. I wouldn't have thought to go there on my own...
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No..No..No....Read the mamual folks. This second level is to activate the breakout rollers for fracture sensitive plastics.....Acrylic, etc. Although some framers use this for breaking out glass, FTCO does not recommend this practice, as you run the risk of putting small glass shards into the rollers. :(

...I am not pushing on the head anymore. I don't have to. The scores are pretty nice.
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Good. A good score should be created with even tension and I'd recommend the Carbide Wheels rather than the SU-01 Steel wheels that come with the unit.

Regards,

John
Consultant to The Fletcher-Terry Company
 
Same problem...but my uneven breaks come at the top of the lite, not at the bottom, and typically when I'm making a rather long score (more than 25 inches). I've been using the breakout rollers for glass.

By the way, and this is intended for Fletcher-Terry since you folks are listening in: do you employ elves with miniature tools at your factory? Because installing that machine is a real pain in the tuchus if you are an adult human with regular-size fingers and regular-size tools. Some of the bolts and screws simply cannot be reached, the positioning is too awkward or the working space is too small for adults.

Also, have a non-engineer read your installation and instruction manual, and see if they understand everything perfectly. If not, then rewrite the manual in terms people can understand. And do a better job of labeling all the parts, please.
 
Originally posted by PaulSF:
...By the way, and this is intended for Fletcher-Terry since you folks are listening in:...
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Technically, the folks at Fletcher-Terry do not "listen in". I am a fellow retailer as yourself, who happens to work as a consultant to these folks in Connecticut.

I would honestly suggest that if you have some real concerns, that you phone their customer service number 1-800-THE-FTCO or visit their website: Customer Service Email and Phone Numbers

...do you employ elves with miniature tools at your factory? Because installing that machine is a real pain in the tuchus if you are an adult human with regular-size fingers and regular-size tools. Some of the bolts and screws simply cannot be reached, the positioning is too awkward or the working space is too small for adults..
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You may be referring to the top mounting bracket bolts which unless you bring along a socket set with an extension, it is indeed an awkward reach. I've installed a couple dozen of these machines over the years. With the right tools however, it really is not all that bad.

The manual is also supplemented with a video that also goes through the installation and use of the F-3000. If you need help, I'd really suggest picking up the phone. Fletcher-Terry actually pays several people who's sole job is to answer those phone calls and address your concerns. ;)

Regards,

John
 
"This second level is to activate the breakout rollers for fracture sensitive plastics.....Acrylic, etc. Although some framers use this for breaking out glass, FTCO does not recommend this practice, as you run the risk of putting small glass shards into the rollers."


John, how are we supposed to break the glass then? I have an old one that has a diagonal cross-bar on the right side of the cutting bar, behind the glass, making it difficult to push-break it. Been using the break-out rollers for years for glass AND plastic, never had a problem with chards imbedded in the plastic/rubber rollers. Suggestions? I'm open to new ideas.
 
Val,

The support arm holding the right side material rest should not hinder the breaking of glass regardless of which method you use.

After making the score, simply place your left hand against the glass, low and to the left side of the vertical tubes. Take your right hand (thumb) and apply pressure to the lower area of glass that protrudes to the right of the vertical tubes. It doesn't take much.

The Fletcher-Terry F-3000 is designed with an anvil under the score. When the glass is removed run your hand on the two shiny aluminum strips and you'll note that they are NOT flat. It's this raised anvil that makes the break happen easily - even with small strips as small as 1/8 inch. :D

Please stop by for a demonstration at the Atlanta Decor Expo show in September - I'll be there. (Or the PFM show in Las Vegas in January.)

If anyone would like to learn more, Fletcher-Terry has a whole slew of education articles related to glass cutting and other subjects that can be found at The Learning Center

Regards,

John
 
Val and others,

Using those breakout rollers sounds very dangerous to me for breaking glass!! They were meant to flex acrylic to initiate a break at the scratch mark left by the acrylic cutter blade and they apply pressure on BOTH sides of the cut material to help flex the plastic. No accidents so far is just what it means, the next cut could be on your face or hands when that glass blows up on the machine from pushing on both sides of that anvil with the breakout wheels. VERY shaky method of cutting glass, IMHO.

Glass doesn't have much flex to it. I have cut glass on my old 3000 for over 18 years and wouldn't trade it for anything else as long as the glass cutter still functioned. I have always used a similar technique to the one that John described and I get clean even breaks with not one single EMT event in 18 years! Val, glass is very strong up to a point and in certain directions and, if you hold the left side of the glass firmly still and press evenly in the center of the cutoff with your right hand, you will be amazed at how easily the glass will break.

(This is assuming that your machine is properly calibrated and adjusted to begin with.)

Posted by Flintstone:

I am cutting True Vue Conservation Refletion Control. There is no writing on the glass to identify the coated side.

Flintstone, if you cut the low gloss side of the glass, you will always be cutting the correct side with TV RC of any flavor.
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Framerguy
 
Thanks, FG, that may be the problem. Nothing was calibrated or adjusted properly when I got here and each piece of equipment was badly neglected and a mess!

I wish there was a service that would come into a frame shop and check on stuff like that, and if something needed adjusted (mat cutter, chopper, glass cutter, v-nailer) would just do it. For me, it's a guessing game, because all of these are old ane yet new to me. My previous equipment I knew from when they were new and could adjust them in my sleep, a bazillion years ago, but these different models seem almost foreign to me sometimes, especially when they aren't doing what they're supposed to.

My v-nailer's making a big "thump" and frequently stops shooting, the Morso is leaving gaps and tearing up the backside (still, after repeated blade adjustments), oval mat cutter isn't cutting (ditto), one mat cutter is worn out and the other got wet in the flood in March and is toast. Frustrating.
The Fletcher seems to be just fine though (knock-knock). Will try the "push-break" method today rather than using the breakout trigger. Still, I'm nervous about putting my right hand on the middle of a breaking piece of glass, in case it runs. But I sure as heck don't need anymore medical problems right now!! Sigh.

Thanks Framerguy, for the explanation, rather than just saying "Don't do that!"
 
Thanks Framerguy, for the explanation, rather than just saying "Don't do that!"

Val,

You are very welcome, believe it or not, this is what we did on the Grumble daily when I first started here. People were here to help, criticizing and nit picking were at a minimum, and we all had a much more pleasant time all around with our visits.

NOW, about that visit to adjust all those pieces of equipment!!
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"Go Greyhound" is fine with me and I don't eat much at one time. :eek: My per diem costs are minimal and I will bring my backpacking tent if there is a spot in your back yard that is shady. :cool: Oh, and I'll need access to a garden hose to tie up in a tree if I have to lay over for more than a day. (Gotta keep squeeky clean, doncha know).
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All in all I am probably better to call in than the Maytag Man and Bob Vila rolled into one!!
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Framerguy

Acme Mobile Frame Equipment Adjustment and Calibration Company
 
Originally posted by Val:
...Will try the "push-break" method today rather than using the breakout trigger. Still, I'm nervous about putting my right hand on the middle of a breaking piece of glass, in case it runs.....
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Val,

This is why I recommend starting the break at the bottom of the score. If you wrap your right hand over the material rest you can push the bottom part of the glass with your thumb. You have a bit more control compared when your hand is "up in the air" in the middle of the glass.

In addition we know the score is usually best towards the later portion, increasing the odds of a nice clean break.

John
 
I had some initial problems with a new 3000, but now everything is working great. I may still have a problem with the setting on the proper amount of pressure, but I am using a slip sheet in the back of glass and mat boards, along with foam core. I'm not sure that is the correct way to cut glass, but it appears to work just fine. Gives me a clean score line from top to bottom, and I too was (past tense)having problem with chipping at the top.
 
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