Flag Case for Folded Flag--Preservation

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Kirstie

Kirstie

PFG, Picture Framing God
Joined
Jan 16, 2007
Posts
8,395
Loc
Berkeley, CA
We have a customer who wants us to frame a folded flag--the triangle formation. The actual flag is not evenly folded, rather it is 24" across and 12" tall at the point. We have a quote from Gemini (Showcase Acrylics) to build a custom made case.

My question is this: I have never actually framed one of these. How do you use one of these cases and still apply preservation framing techniques? Any other ideas for framing a folded flag?
 
Check out a company called Spartacraft, in North Carolina. They make really nice flag cases. I suppose if you want to protect the flag, you can line the inside of the case with metal, glass, or rabbet-sealing tape. If you really want to protect the flag and what it stands for, keep it away from Bush.
 
Man, I knew there was a reason I like you paul. You had better be coming to the Grumble Chinese dinner...

I'm going to shoot myself in the morning for saying this Sherry.... but instead of the 125 buck Sparta... you can get esentially the same frame at Michael's for $35. We stopped selling them.
 
Baer Charlton said:
Man, I knew there was a reason I like you paul. You had better be coming to the Grumble Chinese dinner...

I'm going to shoot myself in the morning for saying this Sherry.... but instead of the 125 buck Sparta... you can get esentially the same frame at Michael's for $35. We stopped selling them.
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Are you serious?!

Oh well, mine is custom sized. I guess they folded it too big :-)
 
I'm a bit confused, are you having an acrylic case built or are you having a custom sized wood flag case built??

Someone has obviously folded that flag wrong. It should never have come out that large and I would suggest that your customer refold the flag in the proper manner. I hope it wasn't a bereavement flag as that should be a priority to fold the flag that was draped over the casket in a proper manner.

I used to sell Sparta Craft also but, when I managed a HL frameshop, they sold the same type of flag case for forty bucks. I don't know that the customer knows the difference nor really cares in the end. You could buy a walnut case at HL, keystone it to your customer, and still be much cheaper than Sparta or some of the other companies building these cases.

Sad fact but true in any event.
 
A few good men...

Just yesterday, I had a flag that came in folded in a square, to put into a triangle flag case (M's, btw). They didn't teach us how to properly fold a flag in Camp Fire Girls, so I called the local Army Guard office and they sent a couple of their "specialists" to fold it in the proper triangle....no red showing....and it fit perfectly in the case. They kinda made a ceremony out of it, and it was quite touching. I took pictures of them folding it, and gave it to the wife of the Vietnam veteran that the flag belonged to.

This is a service any military office will provide.
 
The folded flag WILL be a bit larger than the case. This is so it fits in there snuggly and doesn't move around.

Also there is a huge difference between a "Bulldog" (3x5) which is the most commonly "flown" flag; and a "Drape" which is 8x12 (I think)..... The "Drape" is also called a "coffin" and is sized to completely cover a standard coffin. That is the folded sized that the cases are made for.

There is a 10x15 which folds up about 2" to big all around.
 
True, the cases at M's are much cheaper than Spartacraft. So you could dash over to M's, buy one of their cases, strip off the labels, and sell it for a 3x markup, and your customer will still be happy.
 
Baer Charlton said:
Man, I knew there was a reason I like you paul. You had better be coming to the Grumble Chinese dinner...

I'm going to shoot myself in the morning for saying this Sherry.... but instead of the 125 buck Sparta... you can get esentially the same frame at Michael's for $35. We stopped selling them.
Click to expand...

Oh, and this year I'll be there at the dinner. I'm sorry I missed it last time.
 
Spartacraft has a few different models of flag cases.

The Made in America ones are hardwood and run about $85 to $150 suggested retail, but quality built.

The Made in China ones run about $52 (Suggested Retail)

The Craft store ones I've seen (Michaels and JoAnns) run about $20 to $40 reatil, are made in China and aren't as nice as the made in China ones that Spartacraft has.

When you're dealing with a veteran's flag, just mentionaing Made in America vs. not is often enough for them to opt for the $85 dollar one which is a bit nicer anyway.

I don't stock them, but I order them when required.
 
Framerguy said:
I'm a bit confused, are you having an acrylic case built or are you having a custom sized wood flag case built??

Someone has obviously folded that flag wrong. It should never have come out that large and I would suggest that your customer refold the flag in the proper manner. I hope it wasn't a bereavement flag as that should be a priority to fold the flag that was draped over the casket in a proper manner.

I used to sell Sparta Craft also but, when I managed a HL frameshop, they sold the same type of flag case for forty bucks. I don't know that the customer knows the difference nor really cares in the end. You could buy a walnut case at HL, keystone it to your customer, and still be much cheaper than Sparta or some of the other companies building these cases.

Sad fact but true in any event.
Click to expand...

I assume it is a bereavement flag. It came from the secretary at one of our corporate clients who was assigned to have if framed by her boss. How does one say the flag is not folded correctly. I told Jeff that maybe we should find instructions and fold it ourselves. Oh my. the retail on the ones from Gemini are in the $250-$350 range.
 
Oh, I'm going to get in so much trouble for this...

This is my very poor memory from girl scouts.

Fold flag in half, then half again. Start with the stars and fold in triangles. When get to edge there should be a little left that can be folded into the "flap".

Go slow, it takes two people, do not let the flag touch the floor.

Memories I remember included wearing gloves and the two of us standing while folding the flag.

girl scouts was how many years ago for me... 19 years.
 
FramerDave said:
Here we go: http://www.legion.org/?section=our_flag&subsection=flag_folding&content=flag_procedures

Of course a call to the local Boy Scouts, American Legion, military recruiting office or National Guard could probably get you somebody willing to drop by and do it for you.

Just remember to always respect our flag and handle it with great care.
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I'll ask my son, the Eagle Scout. I think the National Guard is abroad.:mad:

I would still like to know how to protect the flag once it is placed in the case with wood sides all around and acrylic in the front. BTW, they want to hang the case on a wall.
 
Kirstie said:
I'll ask my son, the Eagle Scout. I think the National Guard is abroad.:mad:
Click to expand...

I suppose folding our flag would be one of the most basic things an Eagle Scout would know. And yeah, I guess the National Guard is a bit tied up right now. Think of them during the holidays.

Kirstie said:
I would still like to know how to protect the flag once it is placed in the case with wood sides all around and acrylic in the front. BTW, they want to hang the case on a wall.
Click to expand...

In the case of either the Showcase or SpartaCraft cases, lining the inside or any place where wood touches the flag would give good protection.

Ideally the flag would not be touching the glazing, as is true with any art. But if it must, acrylic is the better choice since there is far less chance of condensation than there would be with glass.

Given the nature of the cases I don't think they can ever be considered absolute preservation since they won't be sealed with a dust cover, but they're pretty close. Not a bad idea to suggest to your customers that they remove the flag once a year or so to inspect it just to make sure it's in good shape.
 
Could you line the sides with some of those leftover strips of acrylic that would otherwise go in the trash? Just glue them to the wood? Seems more economical than using rabbet-sealing tape.

And David, Kirstie's shop is in Berkeley. There probably isn't a recruiting office anywhere near! I doubt that there's even an ROTC group on campus.
 
Sorry Kirstie, I went off on folding the flag, and that wasn't your questions.

I have actually shadowboxed a flag and sew mounted it to matboard. I'm sure there would be a way to sink mount it on nice red fabric and then shadowbox in a rectangle frame.

As for preservation in a flag frame, The plexi idea is a good one. I've just put the folded flag in the frame, in the past.

-Sarah
 
PaulSF said:
Could you line the sides with some of those leftover strips of acrylic that would otherwise go in the trash? Just glue them to the wood? Seems more economical than using rabbet-sealing tape.

And David, Kirstie's shop is in Berkeley. There probably isn't a recruiting office anywhere near! I doubt that there's even an ROTC group on campus.
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Of course there is! UC Berkeley is a BIG place with all sorts of people.
Here's their site. I have even framed for them.
 
FLAG CASE OPTIONS FROM SPARTACRAFT

Good day all.....I've been reading some of the posts concerning flag cases....true, the ones we make here start at $42.00 wholesale...we do however a couple from overseas that are $26.00 wholesale.....the #90 Memorial in Cherry and Oak....
Anyone needing more info, please call either myself, or Hope Johnson at 800-282-8044. Prior to coming on board here, I was in the art and home decor industry for 27 years, both in retail custom framing and wholesale supply business.

I know what shop owners go through in taking care of needs such as this. Depending on your customer base, a lot of my frame shop customers have actually bought a Michaels case for $20.00 and placed it on display beside our lowest price case..#15 Trooper. I've been told that this has helped sell the customer on buying American to hold the American flag.

Happy Framing!!

Jason Whisnant
Sales Manager
SpartaCraft Inc.
www.spartacraft.com
 
http://www.usflag.org/foldflag.html

I used this site when I had a flag brought in that was folded in a rectangle. I put it in a triangle box.

I lined the wood box with acrylic strips and the back with a dark blue suede mat. There is also a metal plaque glued to the front of the frame.... maybe I will take a picture of it tomorrow and post it, since it is STILL sitting in the shop a month and a half later.
 
we sock and sell Spartacraft flag cases, and we have a M across the street...made in America sells in this situation...it also helps that I am Vietnam vet and do a lot of military shadowboxes, etc for the retirees here (word gets around)
 
Just a note, I'm sure this doesn't apply anymore to Kirstie's customer. But ASK before you unfold the flag. If I were the customer, I would be irate if it was ever unfolded after the ceremony at the graveside. That's how it was folded that day and moment, and that's how it should remain. (My opinion). If it's a true military burial (I have never seen a burial with a flag draped coffin that isn't a military funeral) then the honor guard folding it will have done it correctly. They don't send just any military schmo to do it. They're honor guard guys/gals that practice that so that it's done correctly.

dave.
 
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