Dividers for matboard cabinet

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cwphoto

cwphoto

CGF, Certified Grumble Framer
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Alaska
Hi folks:

This may seem a bit of an odd question, but having a hard time figuring out an economical solution. I just completed construction of a new fitting table, which also happens to house my mat boards. It's roughly 45" x 72". Currently it only has one center divider, and I would like to put dividers every 6 inches, so that mat board doesn't fall over. I did not want to use any wood, as it gets rather expensive, and adds even more weight to something that's already fairly heavy. I then thought about using threaded rod, say 1/4" and covering that in some vinyl tubing, but it would be over $150 to do that way. The only wire I found that is kind of heavy is for suspended ceilings, and it's got a fair amount of flex to it. Just can't seem to find any materials that are rigid enough that are inexpensive. Anyone got any ideas? I've even thought about using screw eyes and stretching wire between them. Who's got a creative solution for cheap?

Troy
 
I am trying to figure out the same sort of thing, for a rack that lets me store frames vertically, and was thinking about PVC piping, but need to figure out a way of installng it easily (and of course, if I do this, the next day I'll see a more clever solution).
 
Can't see how you could use pipe/rod etc without it denting the boards. You would need a sacrificial board on the outside of each division. I'd use something like 6-9mm MDF every foot.

You are right about the sheer amount of wood you have to use. I've built racks for moulding and such and when you start reckoning up the materials it's quite surprising. But it it allows quick and easy access and keeps the stock from damage it is worth the expense and effort.
 
i use foam board to separate mine... I also just have them leaning against the wall in the back in order so i can find what i need... just stuff it in and remove as you add more mats.
 
Purchase Nurre Caxton directly 800-323-1055
We inherited our system when we bought the shop. It was built of two-by fours, and we added empty mat board boxes as dividers to hold -duh-matboard. Each slot in our system holds maybe 4 or 6 boxes between uprights. They are jammed in pretty tight, and are not prone to collapse.

Hope this helps....
 
Like Ellen said use the boxes. Or for better use of the space use the boxes for fome core, they're bigger.

I used masonite but always was concerned about them being wood, acid migration and all that... I know, not an issue....

Joe I would rethink the pvc pipe. That would eat up a lot of storage space. Too much loss for little gain.

Maybe get some sintra or coroplast for the dividers?
 
Use the boxes that foamcore comes in just cut the end out and tape the other corners so they stay stiff, just stack them together and fit 'em in tight. Maybe your supplier can get you a bunch of the boxes as they empty thier supplies of the foam board.
 
My entire unit is built out of 1/2 MDF. Trying to cheap out now will cost you much more in frustration down the road.
 
SmallCorp Welded Aluminum Frames, Acrylic Cases
At 72" wide, that can hold quite a bit of mats, and be pretty heavy. The mats are going to be far heavier than any support that you build. If I remember correctly a 32x40 mat board weights a little over a pound and packed tight at about 10 boards per inch, that's over 100 pounds per foot. Using foam core boxes my work for a while, but you are going to need some internal bracing if you are going to use the entire 6'. Those boxes will collapse on each other after a while with no additional support.

Here is mine. It is 8' long and with three levels but the principle is the same. I divided the space using 2x4's spaced about every 8-10 inches. I use one in the front and one in the back. Each section also has a loose sheet of Masonite (smooth side towards the mats) to provide some additional support. You could also put foam core or mat board boxes between each support.

Note that the dividers are sturdy enough that I have glass storage on the bottom level.



shop9.jpg



The top level is just empty box storage.
 
Personally, your biggest problem is that you should have thought about this BEFORE you built your bench!!

If you had, you would have been able to build the dividers as a part of the whole.

You can possibly build sections that will slide in assuming you have enough height for that.

You could also crawl into the bench and attach slotted boards to the top and bottom that you can then slide panels into.
 
I have 1inch MDF between mine....... and those I installed into the BOX after it was built...... screwed thru the top and bottom...

HEAVY AS HECK THO!
 
framah said:
Personally, your biggest problem is that you should have thought about this BEFORE you built your bench!!

If you had, you would have been able to build the dividers as a part of the whole.

You can possibly build sections that will slide in assuming you have enough height for that.

You could also crawl into the bench and attach slotted boards to the top and bottom that you can then slide panels into.
Click to expand...


We can order a new chop, more glass and another sheet of matboard...... those are all cheap.

TIME is what you can't order more of.

At minimum - - your fixtures are the one place you should spend more than a few minutes
doodling on toilet paper to design - - they will usually outlast your career.

I recently stopped into a shop I worked in back in the early 1970s..... the tables at that
time were already older than me. I noticed a new desk...... but every other fixture was
the same.... and by the time the son retires.. they will be over 100 years old. Great return
on a $2.17, four days of planning with a week of making - - investment.

I think Framah has the best solution - - mine would be to tear it apart and do it right.

But then, I've been known to reopen shadowboxes to chase flubs....
 
framah said:
...You can possibly build sections that will slide in assuming you have enough height for that.

You could also crawl into the bench and attach slotted boards to the top and bottom that you can then slide panels into.
Click to expand...

That would be my suggestion, using MDF for the boards, with 1/4" masonite panels. Working from one end, insert your first panel, then screw in your first set of top and bottom divider boards, then your nest panel, etc. until you reach the other end, finishing with another panel.

MatRack.jpg
(board thicknesses not to scale)

:cool: Rick
 
Purchase Nurre Caxton directly 800-323-1055
Just make sure that you can fit inside the openings and can turn enough to then get out :) retrofitting a mat box can get VERY claustrophobic! I altered mine to 10 inches between sections when I found out that I could not comfortably get in and out of the 40 inch long 6 inch cave....
 
Rick Granick said:
That would be my suggestion, using MDF for the boards, with 1/4" masonite panels. Working from one end, insert your first panel, then screw in your first set of top and bottom divider boards, then your nest panel, etc. until you reach the other end, finishing with another panel.

MatRack.jpg
(board thicknesses not to scale)

:cool: Rick
Click to expand...


Except just using the masonite panels as spacers for setting the boards to the proper spacing. Once they are all in, then you can slide the masonite panels into place and throw a small strip across the front edges, top and bottom, so they don't slide out as you try to pull a sheet of matboard.
 
I have 32 3/8 inches inside the cabinet. The total height of the cabinet is 36", and you've got 3, three-quarter inch boards that come out of that for the top and bottom of the cabinet. As it is there's about an inch of space under the cabinet, which I really felt I needed to compensate for any unevenness in the floor, and just to provide some general ventilation to avoid mold growth and so forth. I don't think cardboard shipping boxes will fit in there, and PVC is going to take up too much space. I did see online yesterday at HD, some PVC poultry screen, (1" holes) just not sure how to attach it so it wouldn't rip--it's cheap. Masonite is $17-$20 per sheet, and I can only get two dividers per 4 x 8. I'm in Alaska, and it's also -7 below this morning, so cutting up masonite panels is really not an option. I thought about this option before I started the project, and rejected it as just being too expensive. Those little clips that somebody posted a link to are interesting, I would just have to experiment with different materials to see what is rigid enough. Framing materials may actually be cheaper than a lot of things. Maybe Encore mighty core? I've actually never used the stuff but have a sample in route to me-- I'm told it's fairly rigid, and seemed kind of inexpensive.

My original plan was to use some 12 gauge rigid suspended ceiling wire, which I had left over from another project. It actually works okay for for full sheets, but what I didn't count on is partial sheets and the amount of weight they can put on wires. Quarter-inch threaded rod will probably work, but they are about four dollars each, and that too, is pretty expensive. Again, the challenge was to find a solution that was inexpensive, but functional. If money was no option, I could use all kinds of things.

Lots of great ideal though! Many thanks to all who responded!

Troy
 
Purchase Nurre Caxton directly 800-323-1055
Troy, I have used these driveway snow markers (HomeDepot) for dividers in my vertical moulding rack. They are pretty ridgid and yet they do flex without breaking. If you simply drill holes in the top and bottom you can drop these in place and move at will. They are less by about 1/2 than the threaded rods and no need to put anything else on them to protect mats.

6e6bf037-279b-49d7-8ce2-2c564ed507e5_300.jpg

They are 1/4" x 48" and HD shows them for $2.29 - I bought a bunch on clearance one spring for about a buck. Don't imagine they have a clearance on winter items in Alaska :smiley: http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/cat...=None&Ntpr=1&Ntpc=1&selectedCatgry=SEARCH+ALL
 
Here is my storage with CMC on top.
Using 9mm MDF as dividers. the top and bottom are Slatwall sheets. Very handy because the slots are already cut for you.
workshop1.jpg
 
The trouble at least over here is finding vertical boards that are the right thickness to fit into the slatwall. The only MDF sheets I can find are 1/2" & 3/4". I built mine very similarly to the what Rick posted.
 
j Paul said:
Troy, I have used these driveway snow markers (HomeDepot) for dividers in my vertical moulding rack. They are pretty ridgid and yet they do flex without breaking. If you simply drill holes in the top and bottom you can drop these in place and move at will. They are less by about 1/2 than the threaded rods and no need to put anything else on them to protect mats.

6e6bf037-279b-49d7-8ce2-2c564ed507e5_300.jpg

They are 1/4" x 48" and HD shows them for $2.29 - I bought a bunch on clearance one spring for about a buck. Don't imagine they have a clearance on winter items in Alaska :smiley: http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/cat...=None&Ntpr=1&Ntpc=1&selectedCatgry=SEARCH+ALL
Click to expand...

I took Paul's advice and went over two Lowes this evening in search of "driveway poles/snow markers" I found some 3/8 diameter fiberglass poles for under two dollars each next to the snow blowers. This was just the kind of elegant solution I was hoping for by asking my question. I definitely admire people who come up with low cost solutions to common problems. The fiberglass is very easy to cut with a fine toothed blade, and drilling the holes is pretty straightforward with a brad point bit. So far I've installed four of them as a test, and they seem to work quite well. So, hats off to Paul for coming up with this great idea!. It has solved my problems nicely. I'll post a pic when I finish up.

I'm really surprised at all the responses. So many great ideas, and nice to know there's so many people out there willing to share resources and ideas. Love this forum! Thanks to all again!

Troy
 
Purchase Nurre Caxton directly 800-323-1055
Build a box from 1/2" ply that will fit under your design table. Depending on clearance, you could even put small casters underneath to slide it in and out. Before you fit the top, bottom and back of the box; on a table saw, or with a circular saw and fence with clamps, saw 1/8" wide slots 3/16" deep on the inside of the top, back and bottom however far apart you need them. Once they're glued and screwed up into an open fronted box, cut sheets of 1/8" rotated mahogany that will slide into the slots. Run a small bead of glue along the three slides that will fit into the slots, (top, bottom and back), slot them in and let them dry. Rotated mahogany ply is very cheap. Once the glue's dried, they'll be very rigid and will hold anything leaning on them. It'll last years and there's no need for internal rib supports. Very clean and smooth inside. I find this works extremely well for me.
 
While the driveway markers look like an cheap solution right now, I bet they are going to scratch up enough matboards over the years that you be better off doing it right the first time.....

We have a product called the Framers Friend that was briefly used in our franchisee for mat board storage--basically a metal cabinet with rounded metal dividers....not exactly the same concept but similar. My experience is that the matboards rub up against the dividers and get little abrasions...fabrics are especially prone to this....especially if the bins get tight. We sometimes keep a little "sacrifical lamb" right in front of the divider.

Of course once you load it up with a million matboards, changing out the system is a logistical nightmare especially in a small space...so we live with it.

I used something like the Lee Valley clip in another place and found them to work extremely well with a 1/4" piece of masonite. Do it right the first time! You will be much happier in the long run.
 
tamip said:
While the driveway markers look like an cheap solution right now, I bet they are going to scratch up enough matboards over the years that you be better off doing it right the first time.....

We have a product called the Framers Friend that was briefly used in our franchisee for mat board storage--basically a metal cabinet with rounded metal dividers....not exactly the same concept but similar. My experience is that the matboards rub up against the dividers and get little abrasions...fabrics are especially prone to this....especially if the bins get tight. We sometimes keep a little "sacrifical lamb" right in front of the divider.

Of course once you load it up with a million matboards, changing out the system is a logistical nightmare especially in a small space...so we live with it.

I used something like the Lee Valley clip in another place and found them to work extremely well with a 1/4" piece of masonite. Do it right the first time! You will be much happier in the long run.
Click to expand...

I think that "right" is a subjective term in this case. I think "different" would be a more appropriate term. The driveway markers are very smooth, I daresay even polished looking. Despite that, I could see a potential problem with pressure not being distributed like a divider would provide, and damage being caused this way. At 5.5" apart, I don't think the mat board could put enough lateral pressure to cause problems. If you pack mat boards tightly, then any debris (like small pieces of cardboard that come off the boards over time) can cause abrasions between sheets and scratch surfaces. I try not to pack mat boards too tightly for this reason. One needs to also get their fingers around the boards to pull em out too. I always use cotton gloves for handling.

I can also see putting mat boards into the cabinet, so that the back of the mat board faces the dividers on the ends, or as you say use a sacrificial board close to the divider. Foam core is quite cheap for that purpose, and provides a degree of rigidity by itself. I'm really liking the Encore mighty core, and the rigidity of the product could replace masonite, I believe it is archival too, but not sure on that point.

I may also order a package of the lee valley clips, and then use something like mighty core for panels. I think the only drawback at this point is they are designed for quarter-inch holes, and I've already drilled a bunch of 3/8 holes, but suspect something like silicone would fill in the small space. Guess I could always drill some new holes too :)

Almost all the plywood that I purchased at the big box stores have voids in the center. While the surface looks great, you start running a router through it, hit a void with a bit traveling at 20,000 RPMs, and boom... the thing literally blows apart sending pieces of wood all over the place. It happened several times in this cabinet where I was routing a groove for some quarter-inch plywood for the back. A table saw blade may be more gentle. I was a wood worker for over 20 years, so woodworking is not exactly something new to me. Of course, being a wood worker doesn't make you a perfect mat board cabinet designer either:).

Lots of great tips here! I certainly appreciate your input.

Troy
 
tamip said:
While the driveway markers look like an cheap solution right now, I bet they are going to scratch up enough matboards over the years that you be better off doing it right the first time.....
Click to expand...


Just came across this while looking online ......seems to be about the same idea as the driveway markers but costing about $800. for a 48" unit.
 
j Paul said:
Troy, I have used these driveway snow markers (HomeDepot) for dividers in my vertical moulding rack. They are pretty ridgid and yet they do flex without breaking. If you simply drill holes in the top and bottom you can drop these in place and move at will. They are less by about 1/2 than the threaded rods and no need to put anything else on them to protect mats.

6e6bf037-279b-49d7-8ce2-2c564ed507e5_300.jpg

They are 1/4" x 48" and HD shows them for $2.29 - I bought a bunch on clearance one spring for about a buck. Don't imagine they have a clearance on winter items in Alaska 😃 http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/cat...=None&Ntpr=1&Ntpc=1&selectedCatgry=SEARCH+ALL
Click to expand...
Nor in Tempe, AZ.
 
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