customer wants total refund

Create a Post
YooperFramer

YooperFramer

MGF, Master Grumble Framer
Joined
Jul 28, 2004
Posts
864
Loc
marquette michigan
We framed (2) 25x34 (including the mat) photos, that she brought in, for a lady back in November. (first time customer)
When she picked them up, loved them.
Got them home and noticed the photo has a bumpy like texture behind it.
and it shows up really well on her wall the way the light hits them.
It was because of the speedmount method I used.
I say "we'll take the photo off and see if the bumps will remove and if they don't we'll replace the photos."

The bumps didnt flatten so I told her we would be happy happy happy to replace the photos for her. She says "no". She just wants all of her money back and if we want the prints we can buy them from her too ." HA, RIGHT!!!!!

Then she mentions she doesnt like the glass either. So i said we'd be glad to change that too, (at this point I would have given her Museum)! NO charge!

She says, she's sick of running around trying to get these pictures right and wants to be done with us, even though, she does like the frames and matting. I told her I would be happy to do the leg work for her and then even deliver them 45 minutes to her home.

nope. just wants her money. $350

what would you do?
 
This sounds like one of those deals where you might just want to kill her with kindness, give her a full refund, apologize profusely for her trouble and put it behind you.

To continue to try to please a customer who doesn't want to be pleased will do nothing but create ill will and cost you dearly beyond the cost of the framing.

Let it go ...breathe a deep breath and go on.

I wouldn't necessarily want to cater to her for future business either if she is that difficult to work with.
 
refund and chalk it up to one of those experiences...maybe she'll spread no ill will about you if you do that ???
 
I probably woudln't refund the money because she is only unhappy with a very small (and correctable) portion of the framing. Even if I did give any money back, which is unlikely, I would get the frames back. There wouldn't be any buying of any photos.

Problems have a way of really ruining your day. Don't second guess yourself or your skills. It sounds like you are trying to do right.

Good luck.
 
Your offer seems more than resonable, explain to her the frames are custom made for her and are non returnable, offer to fix anything if it's an issue of craftsmanship or give her credit for your shop. As a last resort offer her 50% back but you still have to cover your materials and time. It's a learning experience for the both of you.
 
Jay H said:
Even if I did give any money back, which is unlikely, I would get the frames back.
Click to expand...

Bingo. If she wants the full refund, she doesn't get to keep the frames and mats. No freebies. Have her bring the frames back in, disassemble everything, and hand her back her photos with the refund slip to sign.
 
i'm going to end up refunding her money and of course keeping the frames lol (she can pick up her stoopid photos), but...

One thing the customer said that struck me as funny was that even if we did get her new prints she said "well, the photo's will get all wavy anyways." [This after I told her a week ago that we could mount the new photos with hinges or corner mounts, but there may be some waviness in the photo over time, humidity changes, etc]

That, right there, made me think she's not even going to replace the pictures on her own dime later on.

oh yeah, in my sweetest, honestest voice thru all this, i did tell her she could have and instore credit, plus buying her replacement prints. I told her everything i could think of to get her to give a chance to redeem ourselves. but nope.

oh well, wadda-ya-gonna-do.
Maybe i can sick Mr. White on her. lol just kidding. really.
 
i wouldn't give her a refund but i would replace or restore the photos if thats possible.

i have a customer (over 4 years) shes a lawyer and tries to argue down her bill every time she comes in. i fell for it the first time as she picked out what she didn't like about the frames i made for her (they were perfect). i stood my ground the next time and i'm glad i did. she left saying she wouldn't come back again. since then i probably framed 12 more pieces for her. i almost wish she never did come back. i take a deep breath every time i see her walk in the store.

be fair but hold your ground is my advice. sounds like you are definitely fair.
 
I have to say, sounds like an excuse for buyers remorse.
 
On our wall, over by the window, is a nicely framed Statement of Terms and Policies. It says very clearly what is to happen in such a case. I would lead her over there and point to the line where it says, ...refunds will not be given for custom framing. At the discretion af the Manager, a store credit will be issued for the amount due.

So, if she wants to have her unframed prints back, along with a store credit for the whole amount, everyone can be happy. That way, if she decides to allow you to buy new prints, she can use the store credit to have them framed any way she wishes.

Forensic Transaction Analysis:
She's having buyer's remorse, perhaps with encouragement from her husband, and is looking for any excuse to weasel her money back. My guess is that no concession would pacify her. She wants the money and only the money. Period.
 
YooperFramer said:
oh yeah, in my sweetest, honestest voice thru all this, i did tell her she could have and instore credit, plus buying her replacement prints. I told her everything i could think of to get her to give a chance to redeem ourselves. but nope.
Click to expand...

Yea don't beat yourself up. When something like this pops up I'm a huge fan of saying "How do you want me to fix this?" I, so far, have been thrilled to honor their request but to date none has said "Give me all my money back." I've not given any instore credit either and that would probably be the least interesting to me. I'm not sure I would want round 2 of this next time.

I still see your responsibility ending at the print. If the frame were scratched or the wrong finish or the mat the wrong color or wrong size, then I might understand buying them back. In this case the frame is just exactly as she ordered. Isn't this like buying a car...getting a flat tire down the road and asking the car lot to give you all your money back?
 
Life is way too short to be squabbling with customers. The pictures should never have gone out the door if there were problems. You have learned a relatively inexpensive lesson, it could have been thousands. Every thing you produce should be looked at with a jaundiced eye, long before the customer is called, you really do not want situations like this one. Please give her her money back, with your sincere apologies.

John
 
Here at Howard's I would replace her prints and give her her money back. Then when she complains to her friends (which is all you can worry about at this point, because she will never be your Best Friend) and they ask what did the framer do about it? she has to reply "They replaced the prints and gave me my money back". So what more could she expect? And her friends will be impressed that you went the extra mile to please a woman that they already know is difficult to deal with...
 
Ellen and John describe what my wife does every day. She runs a very busy restaurant and pays for literally dozens of meals a day. She doesn't even blink an eye and knows that a good percentage of those that complain really just want a free meal. It's all the same to her...legit or bs, she buys the meal. I couldn't do it and see that as a valuable trait - just one I don't have.
 
What was the problem with the prints again? A little orange peel effect? Is that considered "damage," or just a byproduct of mounting?
 
paulsf~
the photos i mounted on Speedmount at the recommended temp and time.
The look of the damage was from the speedmount adhesive/spray stuff they use.
it picked up a bumpy texture of that.
It does not look like there was heat damage.

The photos were a regular glossy photo paper that professionals use.
 
Just for future reference - The orange peel effect becomes invisible behind glass if you heatseal or laminate over the print or photo with a matt heatseal film.

It's only the gloss surface on the photo, which enables you to see the orange peel effect.

When using a matt film, I don't use a silicone release paper over it at all! Just the foam blanket, so that the result comes out dead matt.
 
I'm not sure what I'd do, but I think I'd say "well these are custom made just for you and you were ok months ago with them... but what I CAN, just for you, is give you a 100% credit.
 
I would sincerly appologize, replace the photos and return her money. I would retain the mats and frames even if I couldn't use them again. I will be revamping my Statement of Terms and Policies to reflect that refunds will not be given for customized framing (thanks Jim). I have only had to do this one time so far, but the customer did return many times since.
 
I hate to be a rebel...

I would not have given a refund. I would do everything in my power to make the photo right, even purchasing new ones as a replacement. I might even have the supplier of the photos mount them on sentra. They would be perfectly flat at that point.

Bottom line is, she bought something to go on the wall. She commissioned a custom job to frame the items in the way see chose them to be done. When she got them home, she didn't like it. She wants the framer to eat the choices she made.

I have never had this happen to me. I have had unhappy customers don't get me wrong. But even they understood that the product was custom made and not a boxed widget from Wally World to be put back on the shelf.
 
I would fret, wail, wring my hands and gnash my teeth and think of every reason to not refund the money for at least a week. Then I would refund it and feel better instantly.
And if she wanted me to replace the photos, I would.
I have eaten many frames over the years, some for many times the amount you are talking about and lived to tell about it. It breaks my heart every time, but it is in my job description.

Edie the noregrets goddess
:shrug:
 
You did everything you could to please this customer. We would've done the samething here at Joanns... and then if all else fails, give her, her money back.. EVEN though it states clearly in our return policy printed on her work ticket that she reads and signs and also stated at all the registers... something like, No returns for Custom Framing. We will behappy to rework your framing.

But they will complain to corporate and then corporate will send them a bunch of coupons and other #### trying to get the customer to come back to us.

There is just no pleasing some people. Give their money back and send them on their way. IF she comes back again, I would be tempted to show her the door.
 
Last Fall, a young man, art-major at the local community college, came in, declined by BB's...asking for a "rush" job, "by tomorrow...on several oversized mats, for a batch of his drawings, for a show he had, but put it off until the last minute. Oversized, but needed the bevels to be painted black. So...I did it.

Couple months later, did it again...rush. Due to his "poor, starving, young artist status", I did, at no extra charge.

Couple months later, he needed sevreal large pieces framed, no due date, just to have them ready when the next show happened. Nearly $800 worth. His grandmother paid for them, up front, with her credit card."Are you sure you have no due date?" Yes, many times asked.

Well, just before Christmas, he still said he had no show, no rush, but Gramma came in, FURIOUS, that "her" $800 investment had not been accomplished yet...even though James, her Grandson, had said "no hurry". Turns out, Gramma hadn't expected his big drawings would fetch such a framing cost, didn't approve of them (they were black and dark and ominous), and she pulled out.

Because I didn't have a sign in the shop about credit-only-on-cancellation ,(after consulting the G) I couldn't deny her refund, nor give credit. I had to refund $800, aright before Christmas. nd that sorely hurt me, even though I had already purchased the materials, but hadn't yet started framing his....art.

Now, I have a little sign that says, credit only, after materials are ordered. It's a little sign, but at least I can refer to it.
 
A sign posted as to your terms makes life so much easier. I'm changing ours per Jim's suggested asap

There are a couple of things you can be sure of at this point.
1. This lady will probably not be back in your store, regardless of what you decide.
2. She will give you "bad press" to her friends regardless of what you decide.

That said, I think I would still refund her money (although I would be growling and gnashing my teeth through the whole transaction) because I want my customers satisfied with my work. And while it won't keep her from expressing her dissatisfaction to her friends, it would give me personal satisfaction that I went above and beyond the expected to satisfy a customer. Maybe, by some miracle, she will be back to your store for another framing job, I'd just make sure I wasn't the one who got framed next time.

I guess this advice is really easy to give when we're not dealing with my own money. Good luck on your decision.
 
If such a customer returned to me after an incident like this, I have to confess that I'd be dreaming up ways to discourage them from placing business with me a second time...
 
I can't think of anyone that WANTS to drive away business BUT

A very long time ago I was told by a very wise and pious Minister who happened to be the owner of a distributorship that when things like this happened to him he had a suggested remedy.

He said he would tell them that after trying as hard as he could to please them ( as you have) it had become obvious that he was going to be unable to satisfy them. So he had the name of another very qualified Framer that he would like to suggest. And at that point he would refund their money and give them the name of his worst enemy that happened to be a competitor.

The assumption is they might deserve each other and he was also the same person who gave the the Infamous QUOTE that I have often repeated. " The number of times anyone will use you as a floor mat is directly proportional to the number of times you lie down in front of them."

While it may not seem that the two are directly related at this time I think you may have discovered why they are. But also why as you have been told it might be best to let them go and even better to send them to a competitor you know won't do any better. LOL

Life is too short to spend it apologozeing for things you didn't do just to make money you can make from others who appreciate what you can do.

BUDDY
 
after trying as hard as he could to please them ( as you have) it had become obvious that he was going to be unable to satisfy them. So he had the name of another very qualified Framer that he would like to suggest. And at that point he would refund their money and give them the name of his worst enemy that happened to be a competitor.
Click to expand...

I didn't know you were supposed to send them to your enemies!

I always sent those people over to John Ranes.
 
Val said:
Because I didn't have a sign in the shop about credit-only-on-cancellation ,(after consulting the G) I couldn't deny her refund, nor give credit. I had to refund $800...
Click to expand...

Tell me it isn't so? I wouldn't have refunded anybody anything and I don't have sign anywhere.
 
BUDDY said:
he had the name of another very qualified Framer that he would like to suggest. And at that point he would refund their money and give them the name of his worst enemy that happened to be a competitor.


BUDDY
Click to expand...

Love the suggestion Buddy!

2 25 by 34's for $350? Each or for both? I did the math and I could only realy pull that off for both by using an $8/ft moulding. Too skimpy in my eyes!

Looks to me like you gave this person a good discount to start with, thus made little money off the deal, and now you are losing even more! Whether you give her a full credit, or 1/2 credit 1/2 store credit I would say you are better off without her future business! And look at your pricing structure! As I am now going to take another look at mine!
 
Bob Doyle said:
Love the suggestion Buddy!

2 25 by 34's for $350? Each or for both? I did the math and I could only realy pull that off for both by using an $8/ft moulding. Too skimpy in my eyes!

Looks to me like you gave this person a good discount to start with, thus made little money off the deal, and now you are losing even more! Whether you give her a full credit, or 1/2 credit 1/2 store credit I would say you are better off without her future business! And look at your pricing structure! As I am now going to take another look at mine!
Click to expand...

That was also my opinion. I wouldn't even look @ those photos for less than $350/each. :P

I agree w whoever said reprint the photos, and take back the framing for the refund. I'd probably also kindly ask her not to visit my location in the future.

As for technical, why not perfect mount them?

><
 
thank you , you guys.

your replys to this has helped tremendously and some of your replys made me laugh too!
"grumble mafia" lol

anyways, I will be refunding her money.
I will keep the frames and she will get her photos back.
I have to call her and let her know this, and also tell her she can pick up her refund and photos at the same time.

After feeling in a slump yesterday wondering why i'm in this biz, a wonderful couple of sisters came in to have 2 artworks framed - They were my customer angels - Didnt bat an eye about price, and went to another shop owner down the street (who we are close with) and gushed about how sweet were are here.
life does go on!
so thanks guys !
 
Probably a good decision. The comforting thing to remember is that you can go on with your business knowing you've done everything you can to please and accommadate your customer.

Your customer, on the other hand will have to live with the fact that she is an a*###le for the rest of her life (whether she realizes it or not).
 
Create a Post
Back
Top