Custom Carved frames

[Uncle Eli]

Okay, so I am having to humble myself a little and admit I can't do this job that came in a few days ago. A customer bought Several frames & oil paintings in China. Each of the frames are hand carved & fairly detailed. When they flew home the frames were "disassembled" However in this disassembly process, it appears that they just ran a saws-all through the mitre, because the nails that were used to fasten the frame originally were sheared in half. As a result of this less than prefered method, the mitres are no longer true 45's. Also the mouldings are about 8 inches wide, and severly warped in every direction.

My initial thought was I could re-true the mitre using a table saw (because @ 8in wide, it's not fitting through my production saw, nor my chop saw) The problem with this is the warpage, and the hidden nails.

The point I'm at now is I need to provide my customer with a viable solution to this problem, Ther are gaps in some of the mitres that reach up to 1/4 wide. So simple putty work will be extremely noticiable. The finish on the frames is a very light white-wash over naturally light wood. I've attached a few pics, to help.

Is there a custom frame maker out there that you know of that could A: re-create, or B: create another custom solution for this highly unique project. Thanks for your help & Advice.

 

[JRB]

I guess you could make a base frame the same width as the existing frame out of a hardwood. This would be attached to the back of the existing frame. You would have to glue it and clamp it together, probably with some of those old cast iron "C" clamps. That should get the warp out. Problem is you would have a much thicker frame.

You could fill in the corner gaps with water putty, you can get that at most any hardware store. It's a dry powder you add water to until you get the density you want. It will not shrink or crack when it is dry. You can sand it, seal it, and finish it to match the frame. It's a great thing to have around your shop for repairing compo frames and such.

John

 

[wpfay]

I have had similar kinds of frames come in for repair/rejoining. My first guess is that the joints looked a lot like that before they were disassembled. Frames that wide are very susceptible to contraction and expansion across the grain and that will change the miter angles. The wood was probably not properly cured which would account for the warp and wind.

John's idea of a sub frame is a good one but I would be inclined to use cabinet grade plywood and cut out the entire frame from a single sheet to avoid having miter joints on top of miter joints. The Baltic Birch comes to mind as a very strong plywood, and was at one time available in 60" square sheets.
There's no way you're going to make these perfect, but you can make then functional. I don't think that the nature of these pieces was to be perfect so some gaps and some fillers shouldn't be a problem.

 

[Luddite]

No advice really just an obsevation on origin.... The customer may have gotten then in China,but they are most definitely Thai,or Balinese in origin! I`ve seen metric buttloads of them in the Bangkok "Antiques" markets,and they usually had corners just like this.I don`t think its ALL bad craftsmanship..Rather the climate(sauna comes to mind),and the available woods are somewhat responsible.Just my thought. L.R.

 

[acrompton]

No advice really just an obsevation on origin.... The customer may have gotten then in China,but they are most definitely Thai,or Balinese in origin! I`ve seen metric buttloads of them in the Bangkok "Antiques" markets,and they usually had corners just like this.I don`t think its ALL bad craftsmanship..Rather the climate(sauna comes to mind),and the available woods are somewhat responsible.Just my thought. L.R.

How much is a metric buttload, exactly? Is it bigger or smaller than a $h!tl0@d? I am just trying to get some perspective...

 

[Baer Charlton]

How much is a metric buttload, exactly? Is it bigger or smaller than a $h!tl0@d? I am just trying to get some perspective...

Thats actually a very **itty perspective.... or very anal.

Laura's right... they look like that when they're new.. Those are carved straight from the downed logs. green as 110% moister content can get.... by the time they are carved and at market they weigh about half of what they did the week before.

Very carefully grind the miter on a miter sander.... but in another 6 months, they're going to look like that all over again.

 

[Luddite]

How much is a metric buttload, exactly? Is it bigger or smaller than a $h!tl0@d? I am just trying to get some perspective...

Oh a metric buttload is 10x the size of a S**t load (metric system,base 10 ya know...)

 

[David Waldmann]

it appears that they just ran a saws-all through the mitre, because the nails that were used to fasten the frame originally were sheared in half. As a result of this less than prefered method, the mitres are no longer true 45's.

Using a Sawz-All® would not change the miter angle. In fact, it has the potential to help close it up since it would take material out where the joint was tight, and none where the joint was equal to or greater than the width of the blade. They even could have cut it on a curve and they theoretically should go back together.

As others have already suggested, miters open on the inside may indicate incompletely dried lumber. That said, assuming the lumber has dried completely at this point, if you fix it now it shouldn't happen again. Except for normal seasonal shrinkage and swelling, which on a 8" wide piece of lumber could be substantial depending on environmental conditions.

 

[RParrish]

I've done some work on Mexican frames of the same nature, my bet is, as stated early the miters where never together to begin with, good luck. RP

 

[Prospero]

Only ever seen one similar frame. Same story. Customer broke the frame down to get it in the luggage. It was Malaysian IIRC and hand carved in some strange wood that resembled pink balsa. No way was it ever going to join (or had ever been for that matter) neatly. I did manage to join it in a fashion. At least it was stable despite the gaps in the joins. I think you have to put a bit of spin on the situation by telling the customer that it is supposed to look bit 'homespun'.