Compressed air in fitting area

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Z David

Z David

MGF, Master Grumble Framer
Joined
Mar 8, 2010
Posts
944
Loc
Texas
I've been contemplating routing a compressed air line to my fitting area. I'm wondering if being able to blow-off things before fitting will make life better (as in my happiness and peace of mind). It seems there are too many times (make that most every time) when I find a speck of dust within the framing package, and occasionally I don't catch it until everything's closed-up! Grrrrr

So those who have worked with compressed air in your fitting area is it your opinion:
a) there is no real benefit because it just stirs up the dust in the fitting area and ultimately exacerbates the situation
b) it helps some but doesn't fully solve the dust particle problem
c) it's the way to go, I recommend it to everyone (once you learn how to use it correctly)
d) other _____________________________

I welcome any input... including any other factors that I may not even be aware of.

Thanks

Z
 
I would say C, but that is only one use of compressed air in the fitting room. We also use it to power our Senco stapler that we use for fitting. It also powers our Canvas Stretching Machine and our Valiani CMC.

We rarely use it to blow off art, but it is great for blasting the glass.
 
Definitely 'C'. Just make sure that all the fittings are sealed properly so they don't leak and cause to compressor to work more than it should.

If your lines and fittings are properly sealed, you should be able to turn the compressor off and come back several hours later and see the same pressure level in the tank. Unfortunately with the cheap fittings nowadays, that is almost impossible. I know.

I have multiple lines off my compressor and there are a couple of splitters that I can't get sealed well. With no load, my 20 gal compressor will run every half hour or so.
 
We've been using compressed air at the fitting tables for all of our 25+ years and I wouldn't want to go without it. As others have noted, it is handy for pneumatic tools, such as staplers, point drivers, drills, and screwdrivers, especially in production jobs.

One caution: Make sure the air is clean and dry, and test it daily by blasting air on a clean, white absorbent surface (ie, a paper towel). I once had a problem with the Air filter/lubricator on my air hose in that end of the room, and there was a mist of moisture and/or oil in the air coming out of the hose. Luckily, I noticed it before it caused any issues, but if I had blown that air on a customer's artwork, I might have had a serious problem.
 
Also be very aware of what you use to run your lines. PVC does not meet OSHA standards. We have dryers at both ends of our lines- after it comes from the compressor and also immediately before the drops to each of our fitting stations. We also have dampers on the ends of our lines to our fitting tools so we can further adjust the air flow to each tool as needed.

If you are running branch lines, it is best to have shut off valves for each branch so if you need to do work on them (or have a bad fitting) you can shut off only that portion of the line and not have to be down or drain the entire line.
 
C is my answer... I really would have a difficult time fitting things
without it. I've had it here in my shop since I opened 20 years ago.
It also powers the senco stapler. I think you would find it very helpful.:thumbsup:
 
Some clarification re: "dryer"
When I look that up on line, they appear to be rather large and costly items.
I assume we are talking about something different than the clear bulb devices that I currently use at the end of my lines (near my tools) that are suppose to keep moisture from getting into the tools?






Z
 
Thank you everyone for the feedback... and thank you Rob for the clarification!





Z
 
I wouldn't be without my blower but it does have its drawbacks. Dirty air is one and also keep it well away from chalk pastilles, even fixed ones, or you will have a multicoloured cloud hovering over your bench and a black thundery looking one hovering over your customer's head.

If the blast is too strong for safety block the nozzle with something suitably strong then drill out a smaller hole to reduce the flow.
 
We had lines to everywhere in the shop and gallery. Very handy in fitting are. As everyone said, be sure to have dryers, filters and use an "oiless" compressor if you can. Test the line OFTEN ( before using on each piece) to be sure you have dry clean air for each job.
 
Just make sure you install your airlines properly. For example, if you live in a hi-humidity area, have some lines coming down, with an air drain at the bottom, to collect the moisture. In dry areas, it is not as big of a problem but moisture can still be collected. And the airline you are using should be teed off of the top, to help eliminate air.

One of the problems with some of the air filters is they need to be drained and cleaned. I have seen some that have not been cleaned for years! If the filter is wet and dirty, that will come out on your art. Some systems also put in a lubricator for being used on tools downstream.(this is not as common now). This is NOT good for you and your art.

Also, if you are really concerned about your art, there are some air line filters that also remove oil. These should be prefiltered with a regular air line filter.
 
Question Russ...

I understand and get the concept of lines coming down to allow for additional moisture capture (and release), but I'm not sure I understand what you mean by having the airline, "teed off of the top, to help eliminate air."

The airline will run in the ceiling in my basement and I will bring it up through the floor to my finish area.





Z
 
Try using the little needle like fittings used for inflating basketballs, they release a softer flow of air, you don't want to blast the paper or art.
 
Is there anything to be gained by having multiple units like THIS between your compressor and machine?
Or is it like using two layers of uv-filtering glass: no multiplication of the effect?
:cool: Rick
 
It's been my understanding that the ideal is to have one at the end of each line before entry to each tool. I presently have 2 lines that T just outside my compressor (in one corner of my basement). One line goes to my CMC (upstairs) and the other to my v-nailer (the other side of the basement), and I have a unit just before each tool. I have always been of the understanding that as air gets further away from the compressor, the air cools creating condensation. I just didn't know that those little units were called "dryers."

My plan is to T off of the line that goes to my v-nailer in order to go upstairs to my fitting area. I will put another dryer unit up there near the end of that line.





Z
 
Also...
as a safeguard, I'm pretty obsessive about turning off my compressor and draining the fluid at the end of each day.





Z
 
On my Silentaire there is one right on the compressor, and then one right before the Wizard. Its tank never seems to build up as much condensation as my other compressor but when I drain it the water is oily. I don't think there is an oil leak in the unit however, because the oil level does not decrease.

For my V-nailer I use a California Air (fairly quiet) compressor, which I drain once a week. It has its own filter/regulator on the unit. That goes out to a T-connector, one side of which has a coiled hose with a blow gun, and the other side to another filter and then a coiled hose running to the V-nailer. I wonder if I should put an extra filter before the blow gun and/or move the one on the other side of the T closer to the V-nailer. I mainly use the blow gun for blowing debris out of the v-nail channel and keeping dust out of other equipment, plus blowing dust out of shadowbox frames before fitting. I never use it to blow onto 2-d artwork, but sometimes use it to remove any unseen debris from mounted jerseys and such before fitting.

:cool: Rick
 
OK, story time......those of you who know my wife, Barbara will appreciate it even more :)

When we were building our shop (in the dark ages), I knew we were going to plumb our building for air. And, at that time we were doing a significant amount of finishing that used air powerd tools, so my needs for a high CFM rate for a compressor required a BIG machine.

The best place in town was a company called, Automotive Equipment Co, and they specialized in extreme air compressors, lifts, parts washers, etc. The company was run by what one could reasonably call, "red necks" :).

I coached Barbara re: the specs for the compressor we were interested in and took her to the store with me. At the store, one of the salespersons wearing overalls came over and asked if he could help me. I told them that, "my wife wants to buy a compressor." So he turns to her and says, "what can I do your for, little lady?"

And Barbara replies without hesitation, "I want a three phase, 5 horse, two stage compressor with a 50 gallon vertical tank...."

And after recovering from his initial shock, the salesman said, in his southern drawl, " well yes ma'am".............
 
Hey Rob: did he propose to her on the spot?
 
I only blow-out my v-nailer occasionally. For that I use a cheapo blow gun (a few bucks from Harbor Freight). I just detach the air connector from the v-nailer and attach the blow gun.

Rick, my compressor is a Jun-Aire... it too discharges an oily water and likewise the oil level rarely moves. I just assumed that was the norm for a compressor that uses oil.

This brings up an oil question. Do you occasionally add a little oil to you v-nailer via the air connection point... the same kind of oil you would use with a portable nailer? If so, how often?






Z
 
Z David said:
Question Russ...

I understand and get the concept of lines coming down to allow for additional moisture capture (and release), but I'm not sure I understand what you mean by having the airline, "teed off of the top, to help eliminate air."

The airline will run in the ceiling in my basement and I will bring it up through the floor to my finish area.

Z
Click to expand...

The sketch that Rob provided shows what I meant. He is just much better at showing things.

You tee it off the top to help eliminate moisture and dirt on the active line. But you still get it, so the regulator and filter that are in the sketch that Rob had, shows these.

Thanks Rob.
 
Those “units” are water/oil separators and while they will stop most water and oil, they won't get rid of moisture in compressed air lines. To get rid of moisture, you need a real drier, and they are expensive and operate on a refrigeration principle. They cool the compressed air, the moisture condenses out of the cooled compressed air and is drained away. Beyond them the air is fairly dry. We fashioned a simpler and way less expensive drier. We have several air motors on our lines (iron pipe and pecs); while no water gets past the separators, moist air did and ruined two motors on our pocket hole machine. The moist air condensed in the motors. We fashioned a condenser out of 4' lengths of galvanized pipe, taking advantage of the differences in temperature between our air conditioned shop and the outside compressor shack. In addition over the considerable run of our air lines we incorporated 4 10 ft. drops into water separators There is also a separator on the bottom of our condenser which is the only one to collect any water; the 10 ft. drops down stream have remained dry. No more ruined motors. There is a picture of our shop made condenser on our we page under The Frame Outlet's Backroom Gallery. We also installed a timer controlled valve on the tank of our compressor that opens every 2 hours to drain the tank.

It's a very good idea to turn off compressors at the end of the day to avoid having one run continuously if a line breaks; a continuously running compressor designed for intermittent service can cause a fire.
 
Thanks Warren.... I hope you don't mind me sharing the photo of your galvanized pipe condenser system (below).
How did you determine the amount of pipe lengths you needed to use? Also, is the amount of pipe length dependent upon compressor size and/or whether or not the compressor is located in temperature/humidity controlled environment... or not? Based on the size of your operation, I assume that you have a much larger compressor... and that the compressor shack may not be temp/humidity controlled. What I'm leading up to, is such a system still valid for my small compressor and small operation and if so, would a scaled down galvanized pipe condenser system be correspondingly effective?

123353Air Condensor.jpg

Z
 
Good advice here on this thread. I can't emphasise the importance of draining the compressor and the lines every night ( at least here in Florida's humidity. Also never leave your compressor on when you are gone, a broken fitting or even a small leak will cause continuos running and overheating and possible fire
 
Z, I think the amount of compressed air you use is the determining factor for the size of the condenser. The condenser is really just another air tank with a lot more surface area than the compressor tank. The more pipe, the more surface area. There needs to be enough pipe to allow the moisture in the compressed air to condense and flow into the separator. I think there should be a drop somewhere in any compressed air system with a separator at the bottom, not only to collect condensed moisture but also to indicate that there is moisture present at that point. Air leaving our condenser already cooled passes through a separator and flowers into our first 10' drop. My guess is that it's in that first drop that the moisture condenses and flows down into the separator bowl. The other drops don't collect water. The compressed air isn't really dry but its moisture is stable at the shop's temperature by the time it leaves the first drop. A system should have as many drops as necessary so that the last one's separator is dry. The drops don't have to be 10' but should be as long as possible, 6',say, in a shop with only 8' ceiling.


The act of compressing the air causes it's temperature to rise and absorb moisture. When the compressor is outside in humid air it absorbs more because there is more present, a sort of double whammy for us. A compressor inside a conditioned space shouldn't present nearly as difficult problem as ours does. But it would still heat the air as it compresses it and as that air cools it'll release water; it needs to cool and release its water before it reaches water sensitive equipment.
 
Thank you Warren... and everyone else. This thread has been very educational... it seems that no matter how many times I visit a subject... I learn something!

BTW, I live in a very humid area. Fortunately my compressor is indoors, but I'm sure there is still more humidity here than in drier areas of the country... despite conditioned air!






Z
 
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