Grumble Alert ATG tape damage

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Framing Goddess

Framing Goddess

SGF, Supreme Grumble Framer
Joined
Jul 18, 2000
Posts
4,319
Loc
Cleveland, Ohio
These photos show a print we originally framed about 20 years ago and recently disassembled to fix a slipped hinge. It was hinged with filmoplast, edges exposed (or 'float mounted' to some of us.)

It was framed with glass and spacers. The print was hinged to a rag mat backing and then backed with regular fome core. The mat board and fome core were attached together with an "X" of ATG tape. The overall size is about 22" x 28".

The first photo is unedited and shows the faint X.
In the second photo, I have increased the contrast of the X.

I replaced the mat backing and reassembled it.

edie the whatgives goddess customer framing2013 053-001.jpgcustomer framing2013 053-003.jpg
 
You mean we are looking at an X burned into the back of the artwork that came through all the way from the back of a 4-ply matboard backing?
 
4 ply rag board is not a barrier. Barrier paper is even less of a barrier. If you look at mat board (either rag or woodpulp) with a microscope, you'll see that it looks like a scotch bright pad. You can almost blow smoke through a piece of rag board. Mylar or even aluminum foil would be a better barrier.
 
Yet another reason to give up the ATG habit.
 
Would anyone know what the adhesive used on the atg tape back in those days was made of. !!!

Many thanks

Dermot
 
Framar said:
You mean we are looking at an X burned into the back of the artwork that came through all the way from the back of a 4-ply matboard backing?
Click to expand...

yes, exactly that; caused by the ATG tape.

Think about this: double mats on fancy/rare/antique/irreplaceable art held together with this very same ATG tape. Just think about it.
 
About the only time I use ATG anymore is to hold the blanks to the backs of the front mat(s) for cutting on my Keeton (the old fashioned way).

I use Frank's to attach layers of matting and also dustcovers.

Although I must say I have never run into any staining from ATG such as Edie's example - and I have samples which would date back to the mid-seventies.

Gives one pause, though, doesn't it?
 
Yes it does, as our standard method of attaching double mats to one another is tabs of atg and dots of cornerweld glue.
:icon9: Rick

Out of curiosity, why did you need to attach the FC to the ragboard anyway?
 
I use ATG and glue, like Rick does. But always on the outside perimeter of the mats, so it would at least not be anywhere right above the art. I use the ATG for just holding it in place long enough until the glue dries and I use Lineco's neutral ph adhesive. I will be even using the ATG more sparingly than before.
 
The only place I use ATG anymore is to hold the sidewalls on an object box until the glue sets up.
 
Yes, as you say Ylva, most of the time the area in question is beyond the perimeter of the art itself.

I'm very curious about this example, because I have opened and reframed thousands of previously framed items over the years, most of which had ATG in various uses within the package (some more horrific than others) and I have to say I have never witnessed anything like what is in this picture. My guess is that exposure to strong light through the glass and the artwork itself, as well as the rag backing, may have accelerated the reaction shown. In the first photo, it seems that the area of the "X" that was shielded by the mats might have exhibited somewhat less of this activity.

:cool: Rick
 
what did the top to the rag board look like and did the Filmoplast do any damage?
 
I have only seen anything like this once before: a small print I unframed showed acid burns from a wood fillet on the mat. The mat, rag backing and two ply barrier looked white as snow. Only the print, however, on good quality rag print making paper showed burn stains.

http://www.thegrumble.com/showthread.php?63245-Why-I-Don-t-Like-Fillets-On-Mats

This piece was similar in that the 4 ply rag mat and regular fome core backing were as clean as the day we installed them. Only the print, on good quality rag print making paper, showed the burns, and only on the back of the print's paper.

Is this type of paper the proverbial Canary In The Coal Mine?

Rick, I like attaching the rag board backing and fome core backing together when they are being installed with a 'float' mounted print with spacers. I have seen the rag board backings 'flop' forward toward the glass allowing the print to come in contact with the glass and I like to avoid that.

It should also be noted that this print was hanging in an absolutely unremarkable setting. No unusual light exposure, fumes, temperature fluctuations, excessive dampness nor dryness. Just some guy's house. A regular house.

edie the nowwhat goddess
 
Thanks for posting that. Interesting to see long-term effects.

I've seen similar (much worse) things on old pictures mounted on cardboard, where they have been backed with wooden slats. There are usually gaps (before plywood/hardboard etc) and there have been horrendous burns on the front of the picture - corresponding to the gaps. The wood itself can leave a grain-pattern image on the back of the board, but the real damage was seemingly caused by the atmos being able to reach the back of the board which the picture was mounted on.

As for AT tape, I think of it as a temporary fix. It doesn't really hold for very long anyway. :icon11:
 
hmmm?

Must be a chemical reaction and not an “acid” burn if the rag does not show signs of damage. I would not be surprised if it is not the fillets causing the problem as I have seen really old paper mats do no damage and rag show discoloration on prints directly under the mat. Makes Less often scratch his little head?
 
I do wonder if the art paper is acting like a wick and is absorbing the contaminate.
 
I had the same thought, could there be some kind of chemical reaction from the paper itself? I haven't been in business as long as most of you, so saying I have never seen this before isn't saying much ;)

Does anyone use the 'gold' atg tape?
 
Ylva said:
Just wondering if it is less harmful or if it would be the same discussion as acid free foamboard or regular.
Click to expand...

It probably is the same discussion as acid free foamboard, etc., but I guess it just makes me feel better. :smiley:
 
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