Adding a hanger to VERY thin frame!

[CAframer]

Looking for ideas as to best way of adding the hanger to this VERY thin frame that client wants me ro re-use!

Moulding is 3/16" wide and only 1/4" deep.

Appreciate any suggestions.

 

[B. Newman]

Flangers - see the United catalog.

 

[stshof]

Flangers are great and Betty's one smart cookie! I have them and use them but couldn't remember what they were called!

 

[Baer Charlton]

#17 1/2 screw eye and carefully pre-drill.

 

[stud d]

Hate screweyes...Flangers, now if I only knew how to say it. Gues it is nanother Fillet thing.

PL

 

[Paul N]

Flangers or the smallest screw-eyes.

I really hate such thin frames! I use them only for stacking.

 

[Baer Charlton]

I loved 3/8" moulding when it was popular and I still stand by my use of #17-1/2 screw eye.
There is a smaller screw eye, but I'm a sucker for things traditional.

And I must say, it's great to see the trend towards traditional classic narrower mouldings.

 

[Val]

Okay, I'll bite...
Is it flang-ers?
Or flanj-ers?
I looked it up in the dictionarey, it says flanj-ers, but I have a feeling as framers, we'll pronounce it something else.

 

[Baer Charlton]

Val, it's TAN-jers. Right across from Gibraltor. I'll send you a photo in about 3 weeks.

 

[Puppyraiser]

We have one of those in right now, too! I was planning on using Flanjers to attach the wire. Mine is an old British frame... the kind held together with MDF and gummed tape. It will probably go back together with 8-ply and ditto over the framing points. I suspect that one of the main supports is the all-over tape...

 

[Ron Eggers]

I suspect this frame may be too narrow for even the smallest Flangers.

Can't be sure, though. My box of Flangers is 50 miles away.

I've always called them Flanj'-ers, but I can't even agree with a certain Appleton framer about how to pronounce "fillet," so who knows?

 

[Mr. T]

This is the same problem that you have with the IKEA frames that is talked about in another thread. Way to thin for a good hanger.

 

[Bob Doyle]

I've had some really big frames made of thin moulding come in to be repaired. Thankfully they were tall so I could make a subframe with strainer bar.

How would the gallery clips work for you? The thin aluminum ones (swiss clips?) might hide under that miniscule rabbet and give you better security on the wall than a #17 screw eye! BTW I think flangers are way too big for this puppy.

 

[Framing Goddess]

What's the overall size of the frame? Hope it's small.
I would use what Baer said; tiny screw eyes.

edie the needmyglassestoseethatone goddess

 

[Kit]

The frame is a stinker but dontcha LOVE those transparent quilters' rulers marked off in 1/8 inches?

Kit

 

[Jim Miller]

What's the frame size? If it is larger 8"x10", I suggest giving this customer your sincere best wishes, and the name of your worst competitor.

If you must use this frame as-is, then perhaps you could very carefully pre-drill and use #4 x 3/8" screws to attach Infinity Hangers or another flat-profile termination. To lesses the probability of splitting out the wood, fill the frame completely with a carefully-sized board backer and/or filler board.

In any case, I suggest you do not use screw eyes, because they elevate the wire away from the surface of the frame. That creates leverage, which greatly increases the side-force on the hole. That is, the screw eye is much more likely to split the grain than any flat-profile device would be.

If this screw eye problem isn't clear, do this quick demonstration:

1. Drill two small holes in scrap moulding, about 1/8" away from the rabbet's edge.

2. Drop the pointed end of a nail set into one hole.

3. Grip the nail set down low, at the wood surface, and push toward the rabbet. This way, it takes some force to split out the wood's grain.

3. Now put the nailset in the other hole and grip it up high, at its top, and push again. The wood's grain will split more easily because of increased leverage on the tool.

 

[Val]

Originally posted by Baer Charlton:
Val, it's TAN-jers. Right across from Gibraltor. I'll send you a photo in about 3 weeks.

No, no Baer, that's Tan-JEERS. (I think?) My, you are in need of spell-ck! Geeze. (No heed to me, I'm just jealous... Can I go too, with Steph, maybe Paul? We need a vacation too, after our little "procedures". She can keep track of your crutches, Paul's goggles and my cane! You would do that for us, wouldn't you, Steph? Steph...? You there, Steph...? Oh...Well, we'll keep track of our own darn stuff. Can we still go??? Pleeze?? Insert begging graemlin here)

 

[CAframer]

The smallest Flangers listed in the United catalog require a frame edge of 1/4". This particular frame is only 3/16".

To answer a question above, the overall frame size is 19 x 14.3/8".

I think the frame is too fragile to accept anything but the tiniest screw (i.e. about the size of the ones that come with Rabbetspace). Therefore screweyes are unlikely to work.

I am considering modifying a small piece of Rabbetspace (drill a hole thru the elevated portion and then screw to frame with two or three Rabbetspace screws to distribute the stress).

I am also considering fabricating something along the lines of the clips that come with "Curl Up 'n' Stand" suports. Basically I'm thinking of a thin piece of aluminum folded around the margin of a stiff backing board with an elevated cutout to create a loop for the wire. It seems to me that it would be preferable in this case to attach the hanger to an auxillary support rather than to the frame. Hence this plan is currently my favorite.

Any other ideas or feedback comments would be very welcome!

 

[Elaine]

If its small, why not the ugly sawtooth hanger??

I think flangers are too big - the screws are too fat for the moulding.

 

[Steph]

Originally posted by Val:

Originally posted by Baer Charlton:
Val, it's TAN-jers. Right across from Gibraltor. I'll send you a photo in about 3 weeks.

No, no Baer, that's Tan-JEERS. (I think?) My, you are in need of spell-ck! Geeze. (No heed to me, I'm just jealous... Can I go too, with Steph, maybe Paul? We need a vacation too, after our little "procedures". She can keep track of your crutches, Paul's goggles and my cane! You would do that for us, wouldn't you, Steph? Steph...? You there, Steph...? Oh...Well, we'll keep track of our own darn stuff. Can we still go??? Pleeze?? Insert begging graemlin here)

Good lord Val, Yeah I could keep track of your stuff. I might end up calling you and Paul, Nick and Casey, after my kids. I have yars of experience of children wanting me to keep track of their stiff.

Of course these days, I throw it back at them!

As for the frame, I pefer skinny screw eyes in this case, thoug I traditionally hate to use them. MAybe you could suggest to the customer for them to velcro it to the wall

 

[Mitch]

strainer

 

[Rick Granick]

strainer

Use for mixing a cocktail when you get home.

Rick

P.S., If you feel you absolutely must take responsibilty for this, follow Jim Miller's advice above. Instead of fitting with points, maybe you could cut a piece of 4-ply board the size of the outer frame edge, trim it off with a reverse bevel, and carefully staple it into the frame's back surface to act as an external strainer / dust cover. I would also substitute thin acrylic glazing for any glass to lighten the weight, and so it will not shatter when it eventually does come down.

 

[Ron Eggers]

How much work are you going to do to use this frame before it becomes more economical for the customer to buy a new one?

(That from the guy who has actually REFINISHED some of these frames.)

 

[Kit]

19 x 14 3/8

Ack! If a customer pulled your teeny-tiniest frame sample off the wall and asked to to build something that size, would you do it?

What is the condition of the corner joints on the frame? Are they loose? Why does the customer want to re-use it?

If they are trying to avoid the cost of another frame, adding a strainer isn't going to help them. It doesn't look like the frame is deep enough anyway. If they want to keep it for sentimental reasons, perhaps adding a second frame around the outside for stability would be the best answer.

Kit

 

[CAframer]

If they want to keep it for sentimental reasons

That was their reason!

Basically I'm thinking of a thin piece of aluminum folded around the margin of a stiff backing board with an elevated cutout to create a loop for the wire. It seems to me that it would be preferable in this case to attach the hanger to an auxiliary support rather than to the frame. Hence this plan is currently my favorite.

That's what I ended up doing ... here is the finished result. The backing board was stapled into the frame, tape was applied over the staples, a dustcover was applied, and finally slits were cut to permit the aluminum loop to pop thru the dustcover. The end result seems pretty sturdy, and added considerable strength to what was otherwise a fragile frame.

Appreciate all the input.

 

[Rick Granick]

Nice job, Andrew. Out of curiosity,how much did you charge, and how long did it take?

Rick

 

[Paul N]

The wire is thicker than the frame, LOL..nice work!

 

[CAframer]

Out of curiosity,how much did you charge, and how long did it take?

About $40 each. There were three.

I'd have to guess at the time involvement ... I'd say about 10 minutes on the Grumble searching for ideas, some think time while doing other things, and probably about 15 - 20 minutes for the first and 10 - 15 minutes each for the other two (maybe less).

Used bits and pieces from the salvage bins.

She's a regular client and the important thing was to provide her with a good looking, secure result.

 

[Rick Granick]

Not bad- $120 (and some good customer relations) for an hour or so and some odd materials. Now for that adult beverage- celebrate!
Rick