Kinkade DNA

[Framecrazy]

Is it true that Thomas Kinkade puts his DNA in his signature on his paintings? What does he do spit in the paint? Kinda cool, kinda creepy. Do any other artists do that?

[Randy Jordan]

I don't know about Thomas Kinkade, but when I was framing houses, I [I]always[I] left some of my DNA on every one I framed, somewhere! :D Althought it was NEVER intentional. I wonder, does that make the houses I framed worth More? Hmmmm... I shall ponder further, in the meantime, it will be interesting to find out about Mr. Kinkade, (I might have something in common with him!!!) Randy J.

[j Paul]

Just found this illustration representing the various editions by Thom. Interesting it is a pyramid. (not saying scheme, no not I)

http://www.thomaskinkadeimages.com/images/tkg-ed-pyramid.gif

And then there is this article which attempts to explain all of the different editions and their value, and the fact that he doesn't even hand sign them anymore. They use an auto-pen with his DNA signature, supposed to prevent counterfeiting but the real reason seems to be due to the sheer volume of prints that he does. He would have to spend too much time signing rather than painting.

This article also says that the only way to buy a print on paper and to have it continue to have an investment value is not to frame it.

LINK (http://www.artontheweb.com/editions.htm)

Haven't found out yet what the source of his DNA is. Maybe he pees in it to thin the ink out. :D


This is another interesting bit of information on printing and signing. (http://scottkolbo.com/printmaking/Printmaking%20pdfs/Printmaking%20Book_signing%20prints.pdf)

This article talks about DNA signing and how it is far from foolproof as Tom suggests (http://thepersonalgenome.com/2005/04/saffo_on_dna_pr/)

[Bob Doyle]

JPaul I thought the pens had his blood in them or something like that. Maybe Plasma. So in the future when they are looking to replicate people of today the scientists may be able to clone TK! great.

[Pat Murphey]

Serendipity - they find his DNA at a crime scene!

[Maryann]

An article in USAtoday said the source of the DNA was blood and hair. Gross.

[PaulSF]

This was an interesting quote from the article:

"Bev Doolittle’s most recent print, Music in the Wind, has an S/N edition size of 43,500; however, this is the only print she published during the 1997 year."

Even if that's the only one she published all year, she would have to sign more than 119 a day just to get them all done in one year.

[Bob Doyle]

Maybe he throws the prints on the floor, with all the money he is making off them, and rolls around naked covering the whole thing with his "DNA"!

Get that image out of your head! Even worse with the "lights" isn't it!

[seido]

I think he pees on them...I would!

Joel

[Luddite]

Maybe he throws the prints on the floor, with all the money he is making off them, and rolls around naked covering the whole thing with his "DNA"!

Get that image out of your head! Even worse with the "lights" isn't it!
Great,now that`s in my head....Only not rolling on them,more like shaking a Champagne bottle,and spraying the foam:vomit:! Gee thanks,L. BTW,My father did a number of University of Ky. themed art prints in the 70`s.They were in editions of 5,000.I vividly remember him sitting at the kitchen table ,and hand signing each one!!!!Ow ,writer`s cramp!

[Val]

Serendipity - they find his DNA at a crime scene!
Uh, yeah, some of those paintings are the crime scene!

Don't get me wrong, I adore little cottage paintings, I just don't love his marketing methods and lack of truth. But this is a very beaten dead horse, so I'll leave it at that..

I would love to know what his DNA source is, though.....been watching too much CSI, NCIS and House. In my next life, I want to be a forensic scientist.....I love puzzles. Working in the medical field as a lab tech for a number of years, diagnostics was my favorite part.

[Luddite]

Not sure where he gets his to contribute,but there was a company that would take your DNA,replicate it,and mix it with ink,in a fancy ballpoint pen.Pretty popular with execs for a while.Don`t know if they are still in business though.BTW,there was a KISS comic book(er,graphic novel) with actual band member blood mixed into the ink!I swear,it`s TRUE....Heard straight from the Comics industry. L. (My fav. "kinkaide`s "are still the photoshopped beauties on somethingawful.com )

[JFeig]

I have thought long and hard on this subject and have come to the conclusion.... It is a lot of hype with no substance.

1. How would one test this claim? Scientific chemical analysis?
2. Wouldn't this be destructive to the "art"?
3. Would the binders in the ink prevent this analysis or at least compromise this process?
4. Would the cost of such analysis be cost prohibitive in relationship to the value of the "art"?

Just my thoughts....

[DanGray]

Bill Hannah and Joe Barbarea ( the cartoons guys) had special made pens that when they signed the cells they had there DNA in the ink. This was a way to keep them from getting reproduced.

[Pat Murphey]

Bill Hannah and Joe Barbarea ( the cartoons guys) had special made pens that when they signed the cells they had there DNA in the ink. This was a way to keep them from getting reproduced.

Isn't DNA how "cells" reproduce? :D vs. "cels"

[John Ranes II, CPF, GCF]

...And then there is this article which attempts to explain all of the different editions and their value, and the fact that he doesn't even hand sign them anymore....

j Paul,

Your pyramid structure makes me wonder on which level would we place this collectible item?

http://www.theframeworkshop.com/ProdImages/KAES1906_Thomas_Kinkade_Nutcracker.jpg

For those that collect Kincade items, it might be a nice complimentary piece. This nutcracker is signed on the base by the maker, Karla Steinbach, but is also signed on the framed art in the Santa's hand by Thomas Kincade.

The distributor of Steinbach Nutcrackers in the United States is a NY company, Kurt Adler who happens to be sell other Kincade licensed material.

Frame shop/Gallery owners who wish to obtain one of these, kindly email me directly and I can can offer a discount. John @ The Frame Workshop (john@theframeworkshop.com) ;)

Thomas Kincade - Steinbach Santa L/E Nutcracker (http://www.theframeworkshop.com/store.cfm?SubCatID=56&view=2073&the_start=1)

John

[surferbill]

This was an interesting quote from the article:

"Bev Doolittle’s most recent print, Music in the Wind, has an S/N edition size of 43,500; however, this is the only print she published during the 1997 year."

Even if that's the only one she published all year, she would have to sign more than 119 a day just to get them all done in one year.


Paul,
Was that a typo on the S/N ed of 43,500?? How can that huge number of prints be a limited ed?
It just seems ridiculous to me to call something L/E if it's over 5,000 or so.

[Framecrazy]

The over commercialized stuff loses my interest and respect soooo fast. I don't need a Kinkade plate, throw, calendar, puzzle, etc. But I guess everybody knows his name.

Cheers.

[MarkyW]

That pyramid forgot the very bottom level. His certificates of authenticity list the different editions and then state that:

TK reserves the right to use the image on any other media.

which I assume would be the plates, needlework patterns, calendars, puzzles, etc.

In other words, there IS NO limit!

[JFeig]

There is another clause in the certificate that indicates:

If the art is damaged or destroyed, a replacement can be acquired(with the same limited edition number) for a minimal charge............ (not an exact quote)

Having and using "overrun" copies, numbering them with the original series number is an oxymoron to the definition of limited edition.

[Beveled]

Just the name Kincade makes me cringe, and most of my artist friends feel the same way. But hey, he's not trying to gain the respect of his peers, he's trying to pull dollars out of purses and wallets, no matter what he has to resort to to do it.

[seido]

Have any of you seen his NASCAR print TV commercial where he really stretches the Southern accent to appeal to the NASCAR good-old-boy crowd?

You get the color print and 2 copies of other sketches in the package.

Actually the painting/print isn't bad? (much to my surprise!)

Joel

[Pat Murphey]

It just seems ridiculous to me to call something L/E if it's over 5,000 or so.

Brainwashing of the public and the industry? Shouldn't that be 150 to 250?

[framer01]

Just the name Kincade makes me cringe, and most of my artist friends feel the same way. But hey, he's not trying to gain the respect of his peers, he's trying to pull dollars out of purses and wallets, no matter what he has to resort to to do it.

Who cares about his peers and my artists friends. It's business! Didn't we start our businesses to make money? I did. I'm in a small village outside a depressed city and it ADDED $250,000 to my sales, $100,000 in December alone, without adding to payroll or custom framing work load. That's not the case today but it was nice for about 8 years. I always told my customers to buy it because you like it, not as an investment. Nobody put a gun to their heads. It was the smartest thing i did in the 20 years I have been in business. Built a new house, set up my retirement and exposed my framing business to people who normally wouldn't have come in. Thanks Thom!! It was great while it lasted.

[Pangolin]

I'm not a real fan of his style, but I wouldn't turn my nose up at having been able to take advange of the big boom in sales his artwoek made for the shops that sold it. If I had been in the business at the time I would have jumped at selling hundreds of those a year. (I was framing them, just ddn't own MY shop.) I wouldn't be any more hesitant to sell those as I would beanie-babies if they were still such a hit.

[Beveled]

Who cares about his peers and my artists friends. It's business! Didn't we start our businesses to make money? I did. I'm in a small village outside a depressed city and it ADDED $250,000 to my sales, $100,000 in December alone, without adding to payroll or custom framing work load. That's not the case today but it was nice for about 8 years. I always told my customers to buy it because you like it, not as an investment. Nobody put a gun to their heads. It was the smartest thing i did in the 20 years I have been in business. Built a new house, set up my retirement and exposed my framing business to people who normally wouldn't have come in. Thanks Thom!! It was great while it lasted.

Sorry to touch a nerve, and welcome to the grumble. However . . .
Ethics ethics ethics. Doesn't anybody care about that anymore? The almighty dollar seems to make people feel as though anything goes in the name of money. Glad you were able to make a living off it, but it doesnt make what HE does right, and every art critic out there will tell you that.

[framer01]

:bdh: oh well. Thanks for the welcome. :beer::thumbsup:

[Jeff Rodier]

This article also says that the only way to buy a print on paper and to have it continue to have an investment value is not to frame it.



I didn't take the time to check the link but here is something we should all consider. In the 80's the SEC determined that in selling artwork such as limited editions the dealers could not discuss future value without holding a securities license.

Now if any of us find any item that refers to future values of prints being sold it should be referred to you states Attorney General as well as the SEC.

If every one of us did this we would see action on the matter. Many galleries are in violation of these laws on a daily basis. We can make a difference if we decide to do something about it.

[SportShots]

In some articles about this it stated a drop of his blood was mixed with the ink master batch.

This is a lot like homeopathic medicine. I can sell 'heroin' as homeopathic medicine if one molecule of heroin is used in the master mix. Even if it can't be verified by any test as long as 'some' of the substance was used it is legal.

Kinkade is a marketer and a good one. That he markets to fools with money lines his pockets faster. He is the Reverend Ike/Jim&Tammy Baker of art schlock.

[Endocrom]

I did an autographed jersy once that had a little card with info about the ink being used with artificial DNA technology that makes it impossible to reproduce, that's the first thing I thought of when I read about this.

Then again (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Kincaid#Personal_conduct) maybe one of the other posters got it right, even if in jest.

(Allegedly)

[SportShots]

"Who cares about his peers and my artists friends. It's business! "

It is this attitude that allows some folks to run whorehouses and convince themselves it is OK.