Another VoIP Question

[Bill Henry-]

More questions:

I have decided to bite the bullet, dump my existing phone service (ChoiceOne Com), and subscribe to Verizon’s VoIP (VoiceWing). I should save a bundle.

Initially, I was worried about the extension phone off of my main telephone line. On their web site, Verizon suggested that I get a “wireless/cordless extension phone”, so I don’t have to worry about wiring. (My phones are almost antique, anyway, so no big deal).

But, after reading Barb's inquiry about new telephones, it just hit me that the extension phone is actually connected to the auxiliary port of my credit card machine i.e. the terminal IS the extension.

What do I do now?

Do I have to fall back to my original thought about having to disconnect the incoming phone lines in the phone room? It would seem to me that I could use the existing internal wiring to connect my main phone line to the credit card terminal if I “capped” the incoming wiring. But, I’m not too phone savvy.

Or, is there some way I can make the credit card terminal wireless, too? From what I can learn from the web sites which feature “wireless/cordless extension phones” they do not appear to have any kind of output jack on them.

Any thoughts?

[Paul N]

No idea about the wiring scheme.

But if you have LifeSaver POS, and use PowerPay (their version of credit card swiper), it'll run through your internet connection and not the phone line.

[Mike Labbe @ GTP]

A voip system can provide dialtone using your existing wires, as well. Usually, you disconnect the old system's wires at the point of entry, and re-use the same wires that go to your equipment now.

Special considerations have to be taken if you also have an alarm that uses the phone line, since it needs access before anything else. (The line typically goes into the alarm, and then to the other equipment. This allows the allow the ability to disconnect the phones when it needs to call out)

I'm not sure that I fully understand your question, but old wiring usually has red, green, black and yellow. You only need red and green for dial tone. If you only have one wire, line two can be wired to go through an existing wire's (unused) black and yellow wires, as long as you install a new jack to those two wires near your counter. Hook the black wire to the green one on the jack, and the yellow to the red.

Mike

[Dave]

Bill,

I'm about to take the plunge too with Vonage as my provider. In the scenario I'm setting up I will have a Voip wireless phone which will work in any wireless network at home or on the road and I'll use it like I do my cell now as a home phone and work phone and buy a prepaid cell for emergency use.

My Nextel cell number will migrate to Vonage with no problem.

For $ 5.00 extra a month I'll add a line to the residential package I'm getting for shared use between my fax and credit card machine. As I said in a past post the Vonage rep suggested I get the residential plan because it would be cheaper...?

Unlimited calling for $ 24.95 + $ 5.00 for the extra line = $ 29.95 + tax

vesus

The Small Biz Plan which has somewhat limited calling + a free extra line for $ 39.95 a month + taxes

The routers Vonage supplies allow for two or with upgrade 4 lines which you connect regular phone cord into the back of the router and plug it into your phone system or other device.

I'll end up saving somewhere around $ 150.00 a month over what I do now and will have more capabilites with voice mail and forwarding, etc.

If my credit card machine or internet goes down I'll still have a prepaid cell at my side.

Dave Makielski

[Bill Henry-]

Dave, I am trying to avoid anything to do with cell phones (I refuse to wear a wrist watch, too). It’s certainly not because I’m a Luddite, but, according to my wife who lives on her cell, there are too many dead spots around here for me to rely on it, and, of course, I don't want the added expense since I'm getting the flat fee VoIP.

I found a site that offers a free “wireless” credit card terminal if you sign up with them (at first glance, their rates seem better than my current rates). But, from their description, I cannot tell if it is meant for the wireless kind of LAN that a VoIP on top of a FiOS router provides, or the wireless kind of cell phone terminal that a cab driver, street vendor, or hooker would use. I’m waiting for a reply from the company.

I would rather go with a wireless credit card terminal than try to mess with the tangle of silly string in the phone room despite Mike's confidence. I wouldn’t dare try to reconfigure the wiring there myself for fear that I would cross connect the Dog Grooming place with the Karate Studio in the building. And, since I need the changeover from land lines to VoIP to be smooth and simultaneous, I don’t want to have to worry that a phone technician wouldn’t show up exactly when I needed him.

[Dave]

Bill ...there are three main reasons I feel I still need to have a cell:

1.) If your broadband service goes down you are SOL on your VoiP system and have no way to call out or have anyone call in for that matter. This would include getting voice credit card authorizations for that $ 5000.00 closed corner frame Fred's supposed to pick up in an hour and pay for with his AMEX.

If you don't have some alternative to your VoiP phones then you should keep at least one standard land line for if/when your broadband is down for whatever period of time.

2.) I have children who I want to be able to reach me 24/7 for whatever reason.

3.) Even though I rarely travel anymore, if I do and I'm not in a zone where I can use my VoiP handsfree direct to internet phone, then I would still have the cell available.

My brother travels constantly as a lecturer in the medical field and also is not that fond of cell phones and rarely uses them. He bought a prepaid phone which he has for the occassional need he has. No fancy bells and whistles on the phone and you buy X amount of time which can be used within one year of purchase and you just buy more over the phone if you use the time up.

You pay more per minute than on regular plans but if you seldom use it the cost is less than any contract plan without sacrificing the convenience and saftey of having a cell phone.

Dave Makielski

[realhotglass]

Not sure what voip connections are like over there, but I've just installed full voip in my home / office, and having a couple of issues.
Mainly, trouble sending and receiving faxes, and calls drop out occassionally.

My IT man * son : ) * says he can get on top of it, but until we do, I'm keeping landline on full service with main landline provider here.
After that, I'll go on their base (cheapest) plan to keep our business number uninterupted and operational, then to be only for incoming calls.

We can also dial # before any outgoing call to go through the real landline whenever wanted / needed.

[Dave]

Just a thought ...I wonder how long it will be before faxes go the way of the buggy whip, slide rule, & eight track tape?

I dropped my long distance on my land line because they had a minimum charge per month and currently use my cell for any long distance. The only real stumbler was that I couldn't send faxes long distance either but then I realized I could scan any document and attach it to an email just as easily without any phone charges whatsoever.



Dave Makielski

[David N Waldmann]

Just a thought ...I wonder how long it will be before faxes go the way of the buggy whip, slide rule, & eight track tape?

Not for quite a while. The first thing that comes to mind is that faxed documents contain the same legal weight as an original, so it is an easy way to transfer documents that need to be signed. However, I would slot them in somewhere between buggy whips (thousands of years) and 8-tracks (they've already oulived them).

[Bill Henry-]

Here’s another wrinkle in this process …

Apparently, credit card machines (except for cellular wireless models) need an analog line, so I cannot use one over a VoIP network.

From what I gather, VoIP routinely drops packets of information when transmitting – no big deal during a voice transmission, but lethal to the data that a credit card terminal sends.

Back to square one.

[Dave]

Bill,

I'm not sure about that ...seems in a past post related to this others were using VoiP for CC machines.

When I spoke to Vonage about this they stated that it should work fine, but they offer no support for it ...exact same thing my CC processor said.

Anyone out there in Grumble Land have any real life experience with this?

Dave Makielski

[Mike Labbe @ GTP]

The credit card terminal is simply using a modem, much like your fax machine or a dialup ISP.

This is usually only a problem if you are using a very slow internet feed, of say under 3mb. A feed that slow may have choppy results and result in a lot of transmission errors/retries. Voice calls are much more forgiving than data calls.

In short, it should work for short calls like a CC machine - or short faxes... but not as well as copper wires. No one probably wants to take responsibility to guarantee your satisfaction.

I think the technology our cable company uses to offer digital telephone is different. We have been using the service for 5 years without a single issue. Faxes and credit card terminals (before we switched to powerpay 13 months ago) worked flawlessly.

Mike

[Bill Henry-]

I was suspicious after talking to the VoiceWing (Verizon’s VoIP) tech guy, but his statements seemed to be confirmed on this Vonage web site (http://www.vonage-forum.com/ftopic4182.html).

[QuickDraw]

My day job involves the IT Support for a company in Atlanta where we recently went with a VOIP System. I have about 20 phones on the system with a T1 feed. My VOIP Provider www.reignmaker.com (http://www.reignmaker.com) suggested very heavily that we not use the system for faxes or other analog equipment. You can get an analog terminal for the system that would allow you to use standard phones and devices. However their statement is that the process is just not gelled enough to be reliable for transmitting data such as faxes. CC processing using an analog terminal would be questionable as well for the same reason. Can it be done? Possibly... Should it be done? Maybe. Would I do it?? Not without having some level of support from my supplier. Otherwise when the $500 transaction gets dropped, it could be me that winds up eating it....

[Dave]

I read further on the posts to the Vonage forum and it appears that some people are having no problems and others are.

One of the main problems stems from what they callo "echo cancelling". If you have a fax/data line and use it only for that Vonage can turn this off according to a tech rep for Vonage.

The post you linked to Bill was from almost two years ago and although I'm sure problems still exist a Vonage rep said they were working on things back then and there should be improvements in the future.

I think the prudent thing to do would be to maintain a land line for at least a few months after putting in a VoiP service to see what problems, if any, arise.

I know enough to be dangerous in this area so I'm not one to give advice and appreciate any input folks have.

:popc:

Dave Makielski

[Mike Labbe @ GTP]

I bit the bullet Monday and ordered VOIP for our house, from ViaTalk. Their best unlimited plan with every possible feature is on sale for $199 for 24 months, so I figured I would try it. (equipment is also free)

Free unlimited long distance to USA and Canada, Caller ID with name, Call Forwarding, Distinctive Ringing, Anonymous call rejection, international call rejection, Follow me forwarding to cell, voicemail, call waiting, call return, e911 support, Do Not Disturb, Simultaneous Ring, Call Waiting, CW CID, Custom call blocking, Special ringing for different friends, custom outgoing CID, Wake up calls, etc.

Well the equipment came in tonight, and it took 6 minutes to install. Basically, all we had to do was plug the box into the router, and then the phone into the box. Instant dial tone, and just as clear as the regular house line.

It will take an additional 8 days for them to port my old number over. They give a temporary number during this period.

If anyone is thinking of doing this, let me know. I can give you a special referral ID/Link so we both save something.

So far, so good!
Mike

PS: It works fine with the fax machine and the house alarm.

[Paul N]

Well Mike, you're lucky because if that thing acts up, the best person to call to fix it is............you!:)

Oh, and congrats, glad it worked for you!!

PS: Andy said it took like almost 7 minutes to install....

[Dave]

Wow, Mike ...you are timely. I was looking at going with Vonage but their one year free deal is pretty amazing!

http://www.viatalk.com/vtfreeyear.htm

Yeah, if there is some special you can get with referral ...count me in!

:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

Dave Makielski