Framing for a humid area

[borders]

I have a customer that wants to hang original art in his boat. How do I frame this so the humidity will not effect it? Is this even possible?

Any imput would be helpfull.
Thanks

[Jack Cee]

Good question; poor answers forthcoming. First of all warn your client that, in all probability, that nothing will work as well as you would like.
What type of original art is it? It will make a difference. We reframed several watercolors that were hanging in a suana for several years, we fixed them for the client by drying everything out in a heat press and returned them to her with the suggestion that she had best hang them elsewhere. I would hesitate in suggesting that objects of art could be sealed without the failure of the sealing systems. You might want to suggest that your client keep the originals at home and hang posters in the boart. Other Grumblers may have other ideas on the subject that that is my best shot.

Jack Cee

[Jim Miller]

Please describe the art.

[borders]

The art he was looking at is a water color and ink. I assume thats not a good medium for humidity. Maybe I can talk him into some prints instead and have him keep the good art at home.

Thanks, Diane

[rosetl]

Sounds like a candidate for sealing the package --the marvel seal stuff if you want to be really safe. Or, just extra filler and tape seal the package together before putting in frame.

It also depends on what kind of boat! Some have more stable temperature control systems than many Florida/New Orleans homes!

[John Gornall]

A book could be written about problems with art on boats. Big boat-little boat? Ocean or lake? Summer season or all year round? At the wharf mostly or at sea in storms, wind and rain. Boat heated and air conditioned? Our shop is on the west coast boat route to Alaska and they pass by 100 yards from our front door. Right now they are on their way back from Alaska where they bought art. We hear their art problems everyday as they stop here for fuel and food. Biggest problem of course is broken glass - gee, it fell off the nail when we went over that big wave. The answer to this, which I learned from the shops in Alaska, is to mount to the ship's wall with 6 or 8 big pieces of velcro about 2 x 4 inches. This also makes it easy to take the art home when you leave the boat. And that's the answer to the humidity question - when the season doesn't suit boating take the drapes, linen, and other water absorbing stuff home - and take the art too!!! But the biggest problem we see is fading. People go out in boats when it's sunny and boats have a lot of windows and those UV rays not only come directly in the windows but also reflect up from the ocean or lake all around the boat. They bought the art in Alaska and that was only 3 weeks ago but the fading is all ready obvious. I have often wondered if conservation/ preservation standards for framers should include some guidelines about where art should hang or not hang.

[Rebecca]

"I have often wondered if conservation/ preservation standards for framers should include some guidelines about where art should hang or not hang."

Makes perfect sense to me John. I always try to emphasise that UV filtering glazing only slows light fading, it doesn't prevent it. I bet you could photograph some great "before" and "after" examples. Something for FACTS?

BTW John, you must be in BC - where?

Rebecca

[Ron Eggers]

Originally posted by Rebecca:
Something for FACTS?
"Display environment" and "owner's care responsibilities" are two elements of the proposed FACTS education guidelines.

Regarding the use of UV glass: I have examples of prints framed behind UV glass and displayed in south-facing windows with a UV film. There was drastic fading after about two weeks. I think the attributes of UV glass were oversold by manufacturers when the glass first became readily available to framers. Since then they have become careful to point out that the cumulative effects of that 5% or so of transmitted UV can be very damaging.

In Border's shoes, I would tell the customer that I can guartantee that the art will suffer from hanging on a boat, but here's what we might do to delay the damage:

1) UV Acrylic (no glass)
2) Sealed frame package
3) Security hardware (no hooks and wire)

With all that, I'd still push for inexpensive reproductions instead of original art.

[Leslie S.]

O.K., I agree with the acrylic for breakage, and fading...however, you haven't said yet if the body of water is Saltwater or not. If salt water, I would think that acrylic might get cloudy, and certainly scratch easier in a serious saltwater environment like a boat. The size of the boat and climate control are definately issues but only 'cause if it's longer than about 50 feet, they can afford to replace the originals every year! ;) With posters, you can just Print Guard them and forget about it. I love the velcro idea...but if it is a really expensive boat, the woodwork is incredible...does velco adhesive remove from finished wood (I'm not talking about the back of samples!)cleanly? I have a friend with an old all teak sailboat and in rough seas he runs around taking his pictures down and the velcro sounds like a great idea...if it won't ruin the finish underneath.

[Ron Eggers]

I'll modify "1) UV Acrylic (no glass)" to

1)AR (abrasion resistant) OP-3 (UV) Acrylite. You can clean this stuff with anything - including steel wool - without scratching it.

[Mike Labbe @ GTP]

Maybe they can send it to one of those Giclee companies to have the art scanned and reproduced. (if it is their work and doesn't present a copyright issue)

They could use the "copy" on the boat and keep the original safe at home. Then again, the Giclee may be just as prone to damage. Maybe you could laminate the giclee/copy to seal it?

Mike

[tnframer408]

Until recently I was the proud owner of My Mistress, a 36' wooden Grand Banks trawler. It was heated in winter, air conditioned in winter with gorgeous wooden walls with real African mahogany

I set the stage because, despite her beauty every single piece of art hanging in her was laminated 20-30 dollar posters. When they rotted, got salt spray, rain spray, etc I threw them out and started over.

Anyone wanting to hang original art in a boat is an idiot. BUT if they have one of those 100_+foot Cerubinis or something costing over 3 million, THEN let's talk about hanging original art. ONly because in that price range you have a full time, year 'round crew and total temperature/humidity controls on the vessel.

any of you guys in South Florida where the big yachts are may be able to verify this. SOuthern Cal. too.

[Shan Linde]

If your customer insists on hanging a piece of artwork on a boat, the idea is not completely lost.
When I worked with SmallCorp (smallcorp.com)we developed a system to enclose art for exhibition in museums that didn't have air conditioning (or even glazing on windows). The SmallTrays are manufactured to the mat size from a aluminum/polyethalene/aluminum sheet product. If you will, the matted art fits into the tray- like a lid from a shoe box.
The glazing of your choice can be placed on top. GLASS is the preferred glazing for sealed packages. Acrylic sheeting expands and contracts substantially. Laminated glass would solve the problem of breakage (if you want to go that far)
The glazing is taped to the tray.
Mind you, ANY art/mat package that is to be sealed requires conditioning to proper humidity levels before sealing.
For extra added protection for the art, a sheet of properly conditioned silica gel can be placed behind the mat within the SmallTray.

Shan Linde

For additional information on sealed packages see numerous articles in Picture Framing Magazine by Hugh Phibbs

[borders]

Thank you all for the great advice. Being a beginner in this vocation, (opened our doors last November), it is so great to have a place to come for information and nice people like you to give it! I'm sure I'll be talking to you all soon.

Thanks again from the bottom of my frame!

Diane

[BUDDY]

You have received a lot of good advise but if the Preservator( Hugh Phibbs) is looking maybe he can tell you how to handle this difficult preservation Problem? I think there will be a class on that very topic in Atlanta. as amatter of fact I attened a class with Hugh where "Sealed frame packages" where demonstrated that where tested by submergeing them under water. I don't know if this is what you need but Hugh will.Give him an email.
BUDDY

[preservator]

A frame can be made that will allow the work to
be kept on a boat, but it is somewhat complicated.
The mat package must be completely sealed so that even tiny amounts of moisture can not get in and build up, over time. This means that the glazing must be laminated glass. Only glass will serve as a vapor barrier and it must be laminated to avoid shattering. The rest of the package can be made
of a material like Marvelseal as Rosetl mentioned
or the sort of box that Shan referred to. Everything that goes into the package must be
conditioned so that its relative humidity does
not exceed 50% at 70 degrees F. The last preservation supplement in Picture Framing Magazine describes some ways in which such packages can be made. As with any technique,
before it is put in practice in the shop, it
should be practiced and tested. Here, the practice
package can be sunk in water and watched for
leaks. Another difficulty comes with the laminated
glass. The green tint of iron in ordinary glass
is doubled if it is laminate and can be somewhat
unsightly. Low iron glass can be found and if
it is laminated, a good looking product will result. Unfortunately, this can be both expensivbe
and hard to find. If the client wants to put the
work on the boat temporarily, it should be kept
in a dry place when it is not on the boat.

Good luck,

Hugh