Hardware and Hanging a large Shadowbox?

[RozR]

I have my first 3 shadowboxes (oooo, got a fourth one yesterday - but it is really small!)...

The question is: What hardware do I use on my largest one which is 32 x 40 with a 2 1/2" deep frame?

Also, what is the best method to direct the customer to use to hang this piece which is fairly heavy. Does he need to secure it to a stud? I would say yes on this one... But I will await your expert advice for this novice!

Thanks always,

Roz

[Framerguy]

Roz,

No doubt in my mind what to use, WallBuddies!

Use the large WallBuddies and your customer will forever be thankful.

Framerguy

[fttom]

Roz, Wallbuddies, yes, but also hang on studs. Something that big and heavy will pull out of plaster or wallboard. If where there are no studs where he wants to hang it, have him span 2 studs with a 1x3, paint that the same color as the wall, then hang the box on that with the Wallbuddies. This will let him get good heavy screws into studs to mount the 1x3, then more pretty heavy screws into the 1x3 to hang the Wallbuddies on. ;) Sounds like you're going great, Girl. Keep at it! :D

[Ron Eggers]

My opinion: WallBuddies with the larger hooks and don't worry about studs. I've hung lots of large shadowboxes with this combination and only got into trouble twice. I dropped a completed shadowbox down a flight of stairs while hanging it (not the WallBuddies' fault) and I drove some hangers through a wall into a medicine cabinet in the next room.

Come to think of it, maybe you'd better not follow my advice.

Both of these incidents occured with the same customer and she is still my customer. Loyalty is a wonderful and unfathomable quality.

[Framerguy]

Roz,

I have to agree with Ron. (Well, I don't HAVE to but I will). The nails in the special hangers for WallBuddies aren't long enough to penetrate most drywall and go deep enough into a stud to make any difference. The angle of the hangers will pull the hanger tighter into the wall rather than pull them out unless they just rip a whole chunk out of the drywall and in that case, you have probably built a VEWY VEWY heavy shadowbox and should look into structural anchors (ya know, the kind they hook big bridges to their base with!) ;)

Using a 1x3 on the wall is probably unnecessary and would set the shadowbox further off the wall by 1" and make it "droop". You would have to install another 1x3 at the bottom of the shadowbox to compensate for the one at the top.

Framerguy

[wpfay]

"Z-bars"
You can use the lighter weight model. With attachments every 4" across the top rail of the frame & the wall you needn't worry about hitting a stud (or a Framerguy for that matter).
Avoid medicine cabinets on the verso.

In designing the shadowbox (assuming sufficient depth) you could incorporate a strainer frame that doubles as a cleat style hanging system. This would strengthen the frame and solve the hanging delima.

[RozR]

BLOL (belly laugh out loud)!!!!! On Ron's tale... ohmygoodness. Aren't understanding customers wonderful!!! Gees, it seems when something goes wrong it happens to the same customer again and again.

And I haven't used these "wall buddies" - but thanks to Framerguy, fttom, and Ron for that advie!! Butc where do I get them for Tuesday!!!???

Thanks, frantically! Roz

[RozR]

WallBuddies! Too Cool!! Got 'em - United!! Thanks everyone!

[iceref]

OK, I've had enough. Could someone tell me about wall buddies. I too have 2 32 X 40 shadowboxes to complete and I've heard a lot of talk about wall buddies but have never seen them.

I've searched the United catalog (on line) and was unable to find them.

Are they designed to hang the shadowbox straight or serve as strength for heavy objects? Finally, where can I get some?

[Jim Miller]

Originally posted by iceref:
OK, I've had enough. Could someone tell me about wall buddies...Are they designed to hang the shadowbox straight or serve as strength for heavy objects? Finally, where can I get some?United Catalog 409, page 16. For a large wood shadowbox, get United #5057 (bulk packed) for large frames. They come with wall hooks.

I agree with Ron -- the hooks are adequate in ordinary drywall up to about 80 lbs, which is about all most of us could comfortably lift for hanging. Beyond 80 lbs, I would use the same WallBuddies on good screw anchors (E-Z Anchors, perhaps).

[fttom]

Ya'll just have a much greater confidence in the strength of drywall than I do. That goes way back to my former life as an architect. I just don't trust the stuff. I've seen how easily it comes all apart too many times. tongue.gif

[Framerguy]

Susan, Susan, Susan, c'mon now.

Do you really want to argue a point ad infinitum or do you just like to get in the last word. Either way, you have to understand that there is, at least, the possibility that more than one method can be used successfully to accomplish many of the little tasks that we face in framing.

I am a firm believer in using WallBuddies. But, I didn't argue against wally's idea of Z-bars! It is a good idea, one that would serve as well as WallBuddies for hanging a large shadowbox.

I DID question your idea of hitting studs with the special hangers that accompany WallBuddies. But, after measuring the hanger on the large WallBuddy, I will retract my statement about hitting a stud. The length of the nail is about an inch longer than what is needed to penetrate 1/2" drywall. That would give a significant amount of holding power in a wall stud.

I still question the use of a 1x3 to hang the shadowbox as it will tip the top of the shadowbox way off the wall and make it look like it is in the process of falling.

FGII

[fttom]

Tom, you have to remember that I am a belt and suspenders person. If a hanger says that it will hold 80 lbs, to me, that is just right for that 40 lb picture. Most of the time, on big stuff, I use the z-hangers. Wallbuddies are great for some things. I don't use them as much as ya'll do. I have used the bit of spanning studs with a 1x3 and added a spacer on the bottom of the box to make it hang right. I'm just a super cautious person. Part of it, I think is that I have to have grab bars hanging on the walls all over my house, and I'm not the village munchkin. I always get a funny feeling when I reach up to grab one of them, and it runs through my mind, is it going to hold. Now, I know that ALL of my grab bars are screwed into the studs with 3-4" screws. I just have this great fear of falling. I transfer this fear to anything that I hang on the wall. It's as simple as that. Roz asked for opinions. I just gave several. I didn't know that doing that was not allowed. I have had great big pictures come crashing off of the wall due to a leak in the wall that we had no idea was happening. Had that hanger been screwed into a stud, I would still have that piece of original art that there was no way I could replace. As it was, it was hung properly just into the wallboard. The dishwasher leaked into the inside of the wall. The water ran down the inside of the wall, and disolved the wallboard downstairs. The way we found out was when a 3'x4' brass rubbing came crashing down off of the wall. I always screw my large pictures/boxes into studs,now.

[Frank Larson]

Originally posted by fttom:
I have had great big pictures come crashing off of the wall due to a leak in the wall that we had no idea was happening. The dishwasher leaked into the inside of the wall. The water ran down the inside of the wall, and disolved the wallboard downstairs. The way we found out was when a 3'x4' brass rubbing came crashing down off of the wall. Susan, I think you have to admit that this was a very rare circumstance and odds of it happening again are very remote. No framer or installer would ever be held accountable for such a thing but feel free to overbuild, it never hurt anything.

Roz, if you weigh the largest piece I'll bet you'll find it doesn't weigh more than 25-30 lbs at most. The Wallbuddies will be more than sufficient. If you're really worried about it Wallbuddies work quite well with Mollies (expanding metal type anchors) which have about a 120lb. shear strength and 70lb. pullout strength in 1/2" sheetrock. I don't believe a 1x3 to be necessary here. If the piece was to weigh more than 60-70lbs I would be tempted to use the Z-Bars or some other type of cleat system.

[RozR]

Project completed - and it looks mah-velous!!!

Thank you all for your input and help in making this project a success for me for my 2nd shadowbox/jersey!!! 2 down, 2 to go!!!

Happy Holidays, Roz